Roundball bag

Discussion in 'The Craftsman' started by Brokennock, Dec 13, 2019.

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  1. Dec 13, 2019 #1

    Brokennock

    Brokennock

    Brokennock

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    I was bored, already have a few bags (not shot pouches) that I've made to carry roundball in. But, in anticipation of needing to come up with a load for my .62 smoothbore that uses far less powder than it's favorite load, I figured I'd try to do it with the smaller, lighter, .595 balls I have on hand from initial load development. Well, that means I need a new bag to carry them. And, since it will be for range and trail walk use, it should be a little bigger than my usual bag. I decided to use different leather too, this leather worked out really nice for a couple of shot pouches I made by just warming it and rubbing some mink oil into it. When I try to use up the scraps of Tandy "Buckskin" I have sitting around it takes a lot of time and effort to "de-farb" the stuff. I was bored, but not enough to overcome laziness and lack of time. I use bamboo, that I bought in a bundle of three 6 foot lengths at a craft store years ago, as the throats, and a piece of small branches, that I cut from my grandmother's apple tree last spring as we prepped the place for sale, as a plug.
    20191208_134025.jpg
    I tried to show how the color changes with the mink oil compared to the leather and it was bought. What can't be seen is the positive change in how the leather feels and works.
    20191208_134142.jpg
    Difference in pattern size shown here.
    20191208_231046.jpg 20191208_231236.jpg
    Some size comparisons between the larger bag and the ones I usually use. The long skinny one is for .445 balls, the others carry balls of .610 and .600, with the one far left being the one I use most for hunting.

    20191212_114010.jpg
    Just something I put together to show the beauty of the apple wood. It changes quite a bit once finished. It starts off looking very plain, but once heated and some beeswax is applied more colors and grain patterns come out.

    As a side note. The new bag holds over 20 of the .595 balls. But, I want use that pattern again as it is now. I'm going to slightly trim the widest part of the pattern from both sides. The final product, after the nightmare of turning it right side out, is too triangular for my liking.
     
  2. Dec 13, 2019 #2

    Ames

    Ames

    Ames

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    The horned toad says we should go to Mexico.
    I like it.
    And bravo for picking apple wood, one of my favorites for horns. And bowls.
     
  3. Dec 13, 2019 #3

    Rifleman1776

    Rifleman1776

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  4. Dec 13, 2019 #4

    springfield art

    springfield art

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  5. Dec 13, 2019 #5

    springfield art

    springfield art

    springfield art

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    Knockout presentation and photos. Excellent work. Thanks!
     
  6. Dec 13, 2019 #6

    DOUBLEDEUCE 1

    DOUBLEDEUCE 1

    DOUBLEDEUCE 1

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    I like the touch of your grandmother’s apple tree. That added bit of family history, to me is priceless.

    Some of the photos remind me of still life pictures with the drapery in the background. Well done.
     
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  7. Dec 13, 2019 #7

    hanshi

    hanshi

    hanshi

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    Excellent work. I do mine in a very similar pattern; but yours are "more better".
     
  8. Dec 14, 2019 #8

    Brokennock

    Brokennock

    Brokennock

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    Thankyou folks, much appreciated.

    Ya. There is that factor. I'm trying not to delve to deep into that thinking right now. 1st holiday season without her. She was the person in my family I was closest to...
     
  9. Dec 14, 2019 #9

    DOUBLEDEUCE 1

    DOUBLEDEUCE 1

    DOUBLEDEUCE 1

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    Brokennock,
    Enough said. I understand completely. :cool:
     
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  10. Dec 20, 2019 #10

    Mad Irish Jack

    Mad Irish Jack

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    Kuddos; nice work. I like that your pics include patterns. I make patterns for everything I make. If I have various sizes, I have patterns for each. Some folks just starting don't know where to start: Start by making a pattern; and think if it's the best or tweak it; and then jump in and make whatever your making. I've had several master I knew when they started, they gave me one of the first item they made and told me,"Keep it, it's yours. Use it, it's a prototype. Get back to me on how it works for you. Thanks." I thank them back and report on it later. Only had 1 item that I had bad comment on. But, that's how they learn and get better. Congrats and your skill developing.
     
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  11. Dec 26, 2019 #11

    Artificer

    Artificer

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    Great Point!

    I couldn't agree more to make a pattern first, especially when it is something one is making for the first time. Though leather doesn't cost as much today as it did in the period, it still costs too much to make mistakes on, when cutting it out. On some things, I'd even go so far as to say make a paper pattern, then cut it out on inexpensive cloth, sew it up with a modern sewing machine or whip stitch it, to see if it will do what you want before laying it out on the leather.

    Gus
     
  12. Dec 28, 2019 #12

    BillinOregon

    BillinOregon

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    Swell ball bags, sir -- every one of them. Great project for this time of year.
     
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  13. Dec 29, 2019 #13

    Brokennock

    Brokennock

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    Thanks.
     
  14. Jan 13, 2020 #14

    Boom Stick

    Boom Stick

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    Brokennock,

    I'm still relatively new to muzzleloading and working with leather, so a couple of questions if I might as I've wanted to make a ball bag with a spout as well.

    What leather / weight did you use for this bag?

    What did you use to wrap / secure the leather to the spout? Waxed thread? Artificial sinew?

    What other wood would be good to use of the spout other than bamboo? I would like to go back to our family farm at some point and possibly get a branch from one of the trees there as the land has been in our family since the late 1700s / very early 1800s so there is a lot of history there.

    Thanks

    Steve
     
  15. Jan 13, 2020 #15

    Brokennock

    Brokennock

    Brokennock

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    How Steve. I wish I had a straight answer for you. The leather for the newest bag shown was not labeled for weight, all the tag says is "designer double shoulder," and it is from Tandy. I would guess ISIS about 2 to 3 oz. But could be way off, I'm not that experienced. It is no heavier than your average buckskin, but due to the finish and color from the producer, is quite a bit stiffer of temper compared to buckskin. This made it far more difficult to turn rightside out, it would be better for a non-turned, wet molded bag.
    It is sewn with waxed hemp thread if I remember correctly (that is what I usually sew with). But could have been some other waxed thread from Tandy. The wrapping is with a pre dyed, waxed linen or cotton cordage that I think I got from Hobby Lobby.

    The neck material is a good question. I have seen people use turned antler, I don't have the tools nor skills for that, and it seems a bit high fallutin for me.
    River cane would work and be period correct if you can get some big enough for the size round ball you need to pass through it.
    If you have a drill press and a way to secure the wood so as not to be holding it in your hand, almost any wood will do, I think. I like the bamboo because it is already hollow and the joint/node gives me something down inside the leather neck to keep it secure.
    I would say to be careful with what you choose for a plug based on the strength of your neck tube. If you use too hard a wood for a plug in a brittle or weaker neck, it would be easy to split the neck. Ways to avoid this would include, undersizing the plug and using a thread wrap as a "gasket" to form your seal and fit. Or, making/using a so called "clothespin" type plug.

    For your 1st try, if you plan to "turn" the bag, find a soft and somewhat stretchy leather similar to brain tan or buckskin. Maybe try a chamois from the auto parts store. Turning the bag is the hardest part with this shape, you are trying to push the widest part through the narrowest part. I only sew up to the base of the neck, then turn the bag, insert my neck tube, and trim the edges of the leather to just touch eachother on each side of the tube, then wrap.

    Oh, I loathe artificial sinew. It can look okay at 1st but once it starts to wear and fray, looks awful. It can also tear through certain leathers more easily than natural fiber threads.

    Hope this helps.
     
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  16. Jan 13, 2020 #16

    Boom Stick

    Boom Stick

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    A big help! Thank you for taking the time to respond. :thumb:
     
  17. Jan 19, 2020 #17

    TXFlynHog

    TXFlynHog

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    I plan on making a round ball bag for my .54 caliber after I finish up making the possibilities bag (my 2nd one). To me, the puzzle is figuring out the pattern specifics for the neck, such that the finished result would be the right dimensions for the neck insert. Not too loose, not too tight!

    I have some antler scraps, and am thinking about just drilling out the center of a chunk to be the right inner diameter for a .54 round ball.
     
  18. Jan 20, 2020 #18

    Brokennock

    Brokennock

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    Yup, you got that right. Unfortunately, while it isn't easy to do the 1st time, it is still easier to do than explain.
    This is one of those times making practice models out of cheap felt, cloth, even paper, pays huge rewards. You need the neck part of the front and back halves of your pattern to be wide enough to go halfway around the circumference of the insert. A bit too small is probably better than too wide seeing as it is going to be wrapped with cordage anyway. Too wide would leave you with an overlap causing a bump. Of course you could carefully trim it before you finish stitching it up to the top.
     
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