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Rifled Musket Range Report

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Another try at the range today with .570 rb and Lee minies. My first four shots offhand at 50 yards with round ball were 4 inches high, but the group was about two inches, with one flyer that went high. Then I tried the cast minies and they were everywhere. I weighed them and inspected. All looked good. Swabbing between shots they slid down the bore almost all the way to the powder. Most of the minies were six inches right and high, but the group was strictly buckshot. Lubed with Crisco. I also shot some .568 rb cast from my Jeff Tanner mould. These loaded easier than the .570s with about the same accuracy, and I can load these with the musket issue ramrod. I was thinking if I wanted to hunt with the musket, I could use the minie. But so far that's not working.
 
maybe you mentioned this in another thread, but what are you shooting? your mini's sound just a hare too loose. have you bedded your barrel?
 
No, the barrel isn't bedded. I'm shooting a 475 grain minie from a Lee mold ahead of 70 grains of Swiss. Accuracy with the round balls has been superb, so I doubt that there is any barrel movement. I just ordered some black powder bullet lube from TOW and will see if that makes a difference. I'm also going to increase my powder charge to 80 grains, thinking that maybe the skirt on the ball isn't filling the grooves. If none of that works, I'm going to work up a hunting load for the .568 rb and forget about it.
 
Assuming you haven't done so already, you may have some luck solving your minie problem by posting on the N-SSA's forum. There's a great bunch of guys over there that are very helpful. I learned a lot from them when I started out with rifled muskets. I do think they may tell you that increasing the charge is not going to help your accuracy issues, especially with Swiss powder. 50 gr. of Swiss 1 1/2F and a .001 under minie is a very accurate load in my original '63 Springfield and it shot clear through a buck broadside at aound 60 yds.

Duane
 
ihuntsnook said:
Another try at the range today with .570 rb and Lee minies. My first four shots offhand at 50 yards with round ball were 4 inches high, but the group was about two inches, with one flyer that went high. Then I tried the cast minies and they were everywhere. I weighed them and inspected. All looked good. Swabbing between shots they slid down the bore almost all the way to the powder. Most of the minies were six inches right and high, but the group was strictly buckshot. Lubed with Crisco. I also shot some .568 rb cast from my Jeff Tanner mould. These loaded easier than the .570s with about the same accuracy, and I can load these with the musket issue ramrod. I was thinking if I wanted to hunt with the musket, I could use the minie. But so far that's not working.

How much powder and which Minie? What powder granulation
There is no reason the RBS should not shoot we all load OK. Patch Lube can cause hard loading. I would try some pure Neatfoot Oil. If its rifled with the 3 groove it will start harder than it would in a RB barrel anyway. Also remember they are far higher velocity that the "issue" Minie ball load would have been. The Minie in Military Service was unlikey to break 1000 fps.
The Minie is a single purpose projectile. Its not really worth much off the battle field. But moderns are often hung up on things that are generally meaningless. Like fast reloads. They are seldom of any use in a ML since they are just not that fast anyway.

Dan
 
You might want to rethink your idea to increase the charge. The original load was 60 grs. of musket powder under a 500 gr. Minie. Using a ballistic pendulum, the Ordnance Dept. came up with a muzzle velocity of 960 fps. This was the optimum load for a 40" barrel with 3 grooves of progressive depth rifling. Also, the bullet used was a standard issue .575 elongated ball. If you use a tighter fitting (say .001 to .002 under bore size) bullet there will be less blowby and a somewhat higher velocity. By the way, musket powder is pretty much the same a ffg.

A charge of 38 to 40 grs. of fffg is enough to spread the skirt to fill the grooves, providing the cavity is not one of those super thick ones. I shoot a .576 Lyman Original Style in a .577 six groove match barrel 1 in 48 twist with this load and it will tear the center out. This is in a Richmond I had built by Blair Taylor almost 30 years ago. I can still hit a 6 inch pipe gong at 100 yds. with this load. For deer hunting, a 50 gr. charge does fine. The only drawback I see with using a rifle musket with these loads for deer hunting is the rapidly diminishing velocity at longer ranges. The heavy bullet retains a lot of energy and will easily penetrate a deer at over 100 yds. but the time elapsing between the bullet leaving the muzzle and reaching the animal at 100 yds or more is enough for a deer to move several inches. I've had it happen. Still, that big Minie will do devastating damage, especially if you hit bone. That deer will not go far.

Mic your bore and get a bullet no more than a thousandth or two under, weigh and size it. Either ffg or fffg granulations will work, just remember the finer will be hotter, measurement being equal, which I'm sure you already know. Start at about 40 grs. (if using fffg) and work your way up. You may end up using an 80 gr. load to get where you want, but I really doubt it.
 
Sorry if my post was misleading. The RB accuracy is actually exceeding expectations with 50 grains of 3f Swiss with both 570 swaged balls, and the 568's I cast. I ordered the slightly smaller mold hoping it would load the musket easy enough for a second shot in hunting, and it works. I'm shooting two and three inch groups offhand at 50 yards with the round ball, but can't keep 5 minies on a sheet of typing paper at that distance. The musket is a Colt Signature series and right now I like shooting it more than any other muzzleloader I own. And unlike my flintlock longrife, it has a sling. I'm 61, so the open sights of the musket are really not a disadvantage between 50 and 75 yards. And I think Dan hit the nail on the head with his comment about minies in general. And thanks to KanawaRanger, I will forgo the 80 grain experiment and work up a hunting load for my home cast 568s. I am going to try to bump the load up to 60 or 70 grains for a bit more "whompability."
 
ok minnie .001-.002 under bore dia. pure lead only. powder charge my colt 2 bander will shoot anything from 35 to 48grn 3ffg goexand stay in the black. But it likes 42grn the best. w/ 2ffg it likes 44 the the best. thin skirt minnies are what you want to use. I presently use the hodgen minne w/ the thin skirt plug. I dip mine in a 50/50 mix of beeswax olive oil. I do use mine for hunting. groups at 100 yrds off the bench are about 6" last weekend off hand I went 4 for 4 on 6
" tiles once I remember my hold was a bottom hold not a center hold. Remeber when hunting you can reload a minnie a lot faster than a patched round ball so don't give up on it.
 
A six inch group at 1oo yards is to die for at this point. However I'm shooting a thick skirted minie, and the point of impact is six inches right of the round ball. I will try again with a better lube and maybe even take the charge down to 60 grs. But with the round ball shooting this well, as long as I'm able to load the second shot with the issued ram rod, the deal is done.
 
check w moose at moose moulds maybe he can make you a new plug that will give you a thiner skirt. That or buy one of there mimmie mould. Seen there moulds they are top quality. Personaly do not have one yet. But will be seeing them next week to go over a mould design with him.
?? what is your bore dia. most colts are 580 and larger, with all the guys I know none are shooting under 580. mine and my sons both shoot a580 our S# are over 500 apart from each other. lees comeout aomewere arount 575- 578 which may be too undersized for your musket. you should also be sizing your mimmies
 
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