Priming Powder

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M. De Land

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So I have always used the same FFFG powder that load my flintlock rifle with to prime the pan... I know most people use FFFFG for priming and it supposed to give a faster ignition than just using 3f like I always have. So today I crushed up a very small (safe) amount and filled my primining tool. Has anyone tried this before? It seems a waste to me to buy a different granule size powder to prime with and what I crushed up is smaller than 4f and more of a powder. (Before anyone jumps in to say this is unsafe, I only crushed 10 grains at a time and wore welding gloves and a face shield while doing so).
I like and use Meal D from Goex which is black powder flour. Actually though if you use Goex in any grade all you have to do is sieve out the fines and you will have all the priming powder you will ever need for free. Grain size does regulate burn rate in confinement and smaller grains are easier to light so there is some speed benefit for target work in my opinion.
 

old ugly

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i shot my new fowler today. primed every shot with 2f. straight from the horn. no issues.

i like that i can prime without fiddling with another horn or primer flask.

i do carry 4f in my pouch but just to force out a dry ball.

ou
 

Historian

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This is true to an extent but rain is evil on pan powder. But for humid air the coating helps. The main reason for the coating is to prevent static from igniting powder.
That is absolutely wrong. Sorry I disagree sir. Static Electricity Will Not Set Off Black Powder. I Have tried. I have even used Stun Guns trying to ignite BP. Nothing Happened. 99.99% of static electricity is not HOT enough i.e. there is not enough Amperage/Heat to ignite it. Neither is it truly Concussion Sensitive. I have used hammers on a wooden table trying to set it off. Again Nothing. Using a non porous stone or wooden mortar and pestle and grinding up BP is not dangerous. I once spent about an hour grinding up 2 pounds of 1Fg to make priming powder. Yes it does destroy the graphite glazing which is used to protect the kernels from moisture. Not static electricity. Someone correct me if I am wrong but I believe it takes heat, sparks, open flames in excess of 620+ degrees F° to ignite sporting grade Black Powder. Why the old wives tales persist is truly sad.
 

J. Paul

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That is absolutely wrong. Sorry I disagree sir. Static Electricity Will Not Set Off Black Powder. I Have tried. I have even used Stun Guns trying to ignite BP. Nothing Happened. 99.99% of static electricity is not HOT enough i.e. there is not enough Amperage/Heat to ignite it. Neither is it truly Concussion Sensitive. I have used hammers on a wooden table trying to set it off. Again Nothing. Using a non porous stone or wooden mortar and pestle and grinding up BP is not dangerous. I once spent about an hour grinding up 2 pounds of 1Fg to make priming powder. Yes it does destroy the graphite glazing which is used to protect the kernels from moisture. Not static electricity. Someone correct me if I am wrong but I believe it takes heat, sparks, open flames in excess of 620+ degrees F° to ignite sporting grade Black Powder. Why the old wives tales persist is truly sad.
One of the Colleges had a video a couple years back of passing static electricity through Blackpowder. It would not ignite until after several seconds of continuous passage, the underlying brown paper started to burn and that ignited the powder.

I love to accidently drop a can of black at a shoot when some "knowledgeable " expert is lecturing on the impact ignition of blackpowder to watch him or her scatter
 

oldwood

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Dropping a can of Powder is very funny , but cruel to the poor folks around the area that don't realize how stable the stuff might be. Bad Boy.......I smile...
On another note , Don't know if the guy's story was truth , but he said he had a new can of 3F in his hand , set it down on a steel welding table top. He was wearing a vinyl coat and the outside air was 10 Deg. F. , and the potential for static discharge was elevated. He stated that when the can ignited , his hand was still wrapped around it , and he said he actually felt the can start to expand before it burst. What made everyone notice he had some sort of an incident , was , he had lots of powder driven under his skin on one side of his face and the hand the can was in. He had witnesses as well. All I can do , is write this one off into the "unknown" category. The guy came to the first Muzzleloader class the local sportsman's club had back in 1972. ...........oldwood
 

mustanger

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7FA (blasting grade) and 4FG (sport use) are the same size. Perhaps they were referring to 7FA?
 

Historian

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Oldwood, I believe you that the gentleman told you that story. Was he burned severely and had scaring? Otherwise, I have to cry BS on that one. A metal can will expand but the issue I have is a full pound of 3Fg burning that close to a person in their hand, while not exploding would burn with enough intensity to cause 3rd Degree burns on most of a person's body if not all over it. You would be severely disfigured with burns. BP burns very hot and intense. The plastic bottles we have today are actually more safer than the metal cans and will easily split open allowing the powder to burn freely which will not cause any explosion.
 

Rfp10000

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That is absolutely wrong. Sorry I disagree sir. Static Electricity Will Not Set Off Black Powder. I Have tried. I have even used Stun Guns trying to ignite BP. Nothing Happened. 99.99% of static electricity is not HOT enough i.e. there is not enough Amperage/Heat to ignite it. Neither is it truly Concussion Sensitive. I have used hammers on a wooden table trying to set it off. Again Nothing. Using a non porous stone or wooden mortar and pestle and grinding up BP is not dangerous. I once spent about an hour grinding up 2 pounds of 1Fg to make priming powder. Yes it does destroy the graphite glazing which is used to protect the kernels from moisture. Not static electricity. Someone correct me if I am wrong but I believe it takes heat, sparks, open flames in excess of 620+ degrees F° to ignite sporting grade Black Powder. Why the old wives tales persist is truly sad.
I have a mortar and pestle that the inside is NOT smooth porcelain . The outside is. It is for crushing pills for whatever reason ... swallowing issues etc ...
Are your thoughts the same for this type of mortar & pestle ?
I actually got it to crush individual components .. charcoal etc rather than a mixture of components but I was curious about whether these non-glazed items seem like a problem.
 

Steve Whipple

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That is absolutely wrong. Sorry I disagree sir. Static Electricity Will Not Set Off Black Powder. I Have tried. I have even used Stun Guns trying to ignite BP. Nothing Happened. 99.99% of static electricity is not HOT enough i.e. there is not enough Amperage/Heat to ignite it. Neither is it truly Concussion Sensitive. I have used hammers on a wooden table trying to set it off. Again Nothing. Using a non porous stone or wooden mortar and pestle and grinding up BP is not dangerous. I once spent about an hour grinding up 2 pounds of 1Fg to make priming powder. Yes it does destroy the graphite glazing which is used to protect the kernels from moisture. Not static electricity. Someone correct me if I am wrong but I believe it takes heat, sparks, open flames in excess of 620+ degrees F° to ignite sporting grade Black Powder. Why the old wives tales persist is truly sad.
Heat, shock, and friction under the absolute perfect conditions will do it. Though it is extremely rare, I have known of people in my profession that have been seriously injured disposing of FFFF and flash powder because of failure to observe static precautions. Environmental conditions played a huge part in the accidents. Usually this is more a concern with electric dets than powder though. I use FFFF all the time as priming powder and have dropped cans without giving it a second thought. Of the items I encounter, powder down to FFFF is by far one of the most stable.
 

Pukka Bundook

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Speaking of safety in grinding powder,
As a kid I ground some fine in a regular hand turned coffe grnder!
This only proves that the Lord takes care of fools and children!

Don't try it boys, it might get exciting.
Huint and prime with 2F and it has always worked V well for me. Never a complaint.
 

Historian

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Yes I agree under the most perfect conditions you can cause stupid things to happen, however dropping a can of 4Fg on the concrete floor is no big concern. Stupid People doing Stupid Things always will equal Stupid Outcomes. If BP was so concussion sensitive they would not ship it to your door because as a former employee of a commercial shipping company they do not treat boxes like kid gloves even if they have BP in them. They get slung around and dropped on floors of vehicles.
 

J. Paul

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The first case I ordered, the delivery driver refused to drive on the 7 miles of gravel to my house, I had to meet him 22 miles away within city limits. He had an air matress and about 2 dozen packing blankets under, over and surrounding that 25# lot of BP. He wouldn't even pick it up to get it to the back of his truck. My son jumped in the surprised me by tossing the case to me on the ground. Driver had driven , according to him, 15 to 20 mph under posted speed to keep it from igniting from impact bouncing inside box. We had some fun with him but did give him an education about the true hazard or lack there off
 

LRB

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I use 3f for priming in my 20 ga. fowler. No noticeable difference from 4f.
Perceived speed of ignition may seem the same, however it has been scientifically proven that ffffg burns faster than fffg. Many believe that fffg is slower to draw moisture than ffffg, and that could be advantageous when hunting in fowl weather.
 
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