Preparing for accuracy.

[Tb54]

Ok, so I did some cramming and jammin before the season, to get a load worked up, and at least I know my limits now. Got a few more days left to make mistakes and learn from them. (Cleaned and lubed my lock...duhh)

After season, I’m gonna hit it as hard as I can and get me a good load worked up. I noticed before that at about 60 gr I was shooting pretty tight groups at 50 yds. But at 70,80,90the impacts were 5,6” high. That suggested to me that 60gr was fairly light for cow Elk, adequate for deer.

I wanna find that sweet load, so I plan to collect patch material, deer lard, (and whatever), powder and balls. Got a box of .535’s but them’ll keep. I’ll start with .530’s gonna get a yard each of pillow and mattress tikking, a couple sizes, any waste or unused material I’ll turn into char cloth for my tinder box, because matches now days are sooo reliable. I’ll start with a pound each of 2f and 3f Goex. Already scrubbed the hell out of my bbl with a green scratch pad, but maybe I’ll do it again. The last few inches of the bore look like a very fine brass filter, between the lands.

A lot has been said about patch lube, but no one brought up bacon grease, any reason that can’t be used? I like the idea of useing what I got available...seems more period accurate to me, to use what’s handy.

Wide open to any other advice, encouragement, and / or suggestions. You all have given me a lot to chew on already. Thank you.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Man....it seems you are way over thinking this issue. If your groups are satisfactory with heavier charges just remember that while in the field and hold accordingly. I have never shot an elk but that 90 gr. charge impresses me as adequate. (need experienced input on this). Stores will sell fractions of yards of cloth. No need to spend more than necessary for experimenting. Bacon grease would be a very poor choice for patch lube. It would not be consistent brand to brand and contains salt. You absolutely do not want salt in yer rifle bore. Make a decision on what is most important to you in choice of a lube. Period correct or works best and is not damaging to your rifle. Something like mink oil would fit both requirements, as would bear grease, etc. Good luck on the hunt.

 

[Kansas Jake]

Even plain old unsalted lard from the grocery store will work to lube a patch. You could also render a little beef tallow from the next pot roast by trimming off some fat an rendering it either in a slow cooker, the oven or a pan on low heat on top of the stove. You might also get Dutch's guide to accuracy. You could use his recommendations to get a good first shot. If a second shot is available and faster loading is needed experiment with something that will allow a faster follow up. Years ago for deer hunting I had the first shot and for a possible second shot I had refilled 45-70 cases with a cork in my hunting bag. They will hold about 70-80 grains. I also had a loading block with a few prelude patched balls and a thick piece of leather with holes punched in it along the edge to hold caps. I could get off several shots a minute with this setup.

 

[Okie Hog]

A lot has been said about patch lube, but no one brought up bacon grease, any reason that can’t be used?

In a word: Salt.

 

[Mad Irish Jack]

The best thing I ever did to improve my shooting accuracy, was experiment and practice the findings. Our reenacting group held a "Day of Distance qualifications". It was based on historical records of the Ohio Company. The records were in the Greene County (PA) Historical Society Historical Records & Documents. Men that the OC would suggest to work the military and other exploritory groups needing security, hunters and scouts needed shooting skill. These qualifications verified their abilities, The qualifications were mark as paces, not yardage. Since paces are close to yardage, we used yardage. Prior to our qualifying weekend, I and others went to our shooting ranges. Distances were rifle- 125 and 250 yards; smoothbores 65 and 125 yard. The targets we used were Hessian Soldier lifesize targets. A 3" orange stick on bull was on the face and heart area. 1 shot there was an instant kill and ribbon qualifier, 10 hits anywhere on the body was a qualify ribbon score. I used cardboard cutout shapes and sketched outlines to practice. I used a small ledger type tablet and recorded my every shot. Recorded the powder charge, patch, ball used; aiming point on the target, weather conditions. Any sight alignments difference in picture etc. for each distance and the gun used. This allows recall of pertinent knowledge acquired through studying your recorded info. Again, it all depends on how picky you want or how well you want prepared to consistently hit where you want the ball to strike.

 

[Dr5x]

Bacon is fat with salt.
Salt and steel are not friends. Ask any sailor..
Dutch Schoultz

Ok, so I did some cramming and jammin before the season, to get a load worked up, and at least I know my limits now. Got a few more days left to make mistakes and learn from them. (Cleaned and lubed my lock...duhh)

After season, I’m gonna hit it as hard as I can and get me a good load worked up. I noticed before that at about 60 gr I was shooting pretty tight groups at 50 yds. But at 70,80,90the impacts were 5,6” high. That suggested to me that 60gr was fairly light for cow Elk, adequate for deer.

I wanna find that sweet load, so I plan to collect patch material, deer lard, (and whatever), powder and balls. Got a box of .535’s but them’ll keep. I’ll start with .530’s gonna get a yard each of pillow and mattress tikking, a couple sizes, any waste or unused material I’ll turn into char cloth for my tinder box, because matches now days are sooo reliable. I’ll start with a pound each of 2f and 3f Goex. Already scrubbed the hell out of my bbl with a green scratch pad, but maybe I’ll do it again. The last few inches of the bore look like a very fine brass filter, between the lands.

A lot has been said about patch lube, but no one brought up bacon grease, any reason that can’t be used? I like the idea of useing what I got available...seems more period accurate to me, to use what’s handy.

Wide open to any other advice, encouragement, and / or suggestions. You all have given me a lot to chew on already. Thank you.

 

[Le Loup]

Ok, so I did some cramming and jammin before the season, to get a load worked up, and at least I know my limits now. Got a few more days left to make mistakes and learn from them. (Cleaned and lubed my lock...duhh)

After season, I’m gonna hit it as hard as I can and get me a good load worked up. I noticed before that at about 60 gr I was shooting pretty tight groups at 50 yds. But at 70,80,90the impacts were 5,6” high. That suggested to me that 60gr was fairly light for cow Elk, adequate for deer.

I wanna find that sweet load, so I plan to collect patch material, deer lard, (and whatever), powder and balls. Got a box of .535’s but them’ll keep. I’ll start with .530’s gonna get a yard each of pillow and mattress tikking, a couple sizes, any waste or unused material I’ll turn into char cloth for my tinder box, because matches now days are sooo reliable. I’ll start with a pound each of 2f and 3f Goex. Already scrubbed the hell out of my bbl with a green scratch pad, but maybe I’ll do it again. The last few inches of the bore look like a very fine brass filter, between the lands.

A lot has been said about patch lube, but no one brought up bacon grease, any reason that can’t be used? I like the idea of useing what I got available...seems more period accurate to me, to use what’s handy.

Wide open to any other advice, encouragement, and / or suggestions. You all have given me a lot to chew on already. Thank you.

Any animal fat is fine Tb, so long as you process it & use it as tallow. This takes out most of the salt & cleans it.
Keith.

 

[Tb54]

Sorry guys, I worded that poorly. The tightest group I shot was at 50yds, .54 prb over 60 gr. The 70,80,90 gr charges, all at 50 yds opened up, and shot high. Some groups were a couple pairs (1” group), 7” apart. Some were bigger spreads. I ain’t satisfied with that.

How do I get ahold of Dutch’s book, or method?

 

[jdw276]

In a word: Salt.

How about boiling/rendering to salt out of the grease?

I have boiled bacon twice in water etc, to separate the salt into water. Does this not work to rid the grease of the salt?

 

[necchi]

How do I get ahold of Dutch’s book, or method?

http://www.blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/
Or just message/start a conversation with Dr5x here on the forum.
If you want to do it right,, it's the only way

 

[necchi]

Does this not work to rid the grease of the salt?

At issue is "lard" and "grease" are two different things. Each come from different parts of the dead animal.
Bacon grease doesn't make good patch lube,, it hasn't made good patch lube nor has it been known to make good patch lube for 100's of years.
Think about it. If bacon grease was good, there would be 3 major companies mass producing, marketing and have available on the shelf @ Walmart,, Jim Tookie's "Gold Bacon Grease".

 

[Tb54]

How can spit be better than bacon grease? I’m missing the purpose for patch lube evidently.

 

[Tb54]

Thanks necchi, but now I feel bad asking for advice he’s trying to sell. Maybe after the holidays I’ll be able to.

 

[Kansas Jake]

Tb54, spit doesn't contain the salts that would be in bacon grease. Also, spit tends to soften fouling in the barrel and helps keep the fouling soft so the next rounds are able to be loaded. I've just used spit patch for years with good results. It may not be the best practice for absolute accuracy and is not the best if the piece isn't going to be fired for quite a while as in hunting.

 

[Dr5x]

I WAS ABOUT TO SEND YOU A COPY AS YOU ARE ALL OVER THE PLACE BY MY STANDARDS.
FOR INSTANCE ALL THOSE SLICK LUBES ARE WORKING AGAINST YOU.
I WAS SURPRISED TO LEARN THAT LESS SLICK WAS BETTER THAN TOO SLICK. I WAS STUNNED WHEN KANSAS KAKE SUGGESTED SOME KIND OF FAT FOR A PATCH LUBE AS HE IS A SUBSCRIBER WHO IS IGNORING MY WISDOM WITH THAT ADVICE

SEND ME AN EMAIL AT

[email protected]
AND I\LL ZIP YOU A COPY.NO CHARGE.

YOU REALLY NEED TO RETHINK A WHOLE HECK OF A LOT OF YOUR PRACTICES IMHO.

DUTCH SCHOULTZ

Sorry guys, I worded that poorly. The tightest group I shot was at 50yds, .54 prb over 60 gr. The 70,80,90 gr charges, all at 50 yds opened up, and shot high. Some groups were a couple pairs (1” group), 7” apart. Some were bigger spreads. I ain’t satisfied with that.

How do I get ahold of Dutch’s book, or method?

 

[Dr5x]

I'M NOT TRYING TO SELL ANYTHING.
I'M OFFERING TO YOU FREE.

ALL I NEED IS YOUR EMAIL ADDRESS

DUTCH SCHOULTZ [email protected]

Thanks necchi, but now I feel bad asking for advice he’s trying to sell. Maybe after the holidays I’ll be able to.

 

[Dr5x]

Spit works better because it's not so dam slick as all the greases and lards you are thinking of using.

Dutch

How can spit be better than bacon grease? I’m missing the purpose for patch lube evidently.

 

[Kansas Jake]

Dutch, I won't argue with your method as I think it will produce the best accuracy from the rifle. My point was in a hunting situation where a quick follow up shot might be wanted, one could sacrifice some accuracy by not wiping the barrel and using something such as a loading block with a natural lube. I've done this in the past with reasonable accuracy, but it is more minute of deer than a good group.

My other point is, if one is going to use a fat type lube, lard or tallow is better than bacon grease. I don't use either any more.

Dutch, thanks for catching me on that.

 

[Tb54]

Thank you Dutch!

 

[Dr5x]

THE WIPE BETWEEN SHOTS IS FOR PIN POINT ACCURACY ON A TARGET. IN A HUNTING SITUATION THERE IS NO NEED FOR THE WIPE IF YOU NEED A QUICK SECOND SHOT. OR EVEN A THIRD IF PRESSED.. A FOURTH WOULD BE HARD TO LOAD
.
IF YOUR RIFLE IS ACCURATE THERE IS LITTLE NEED FOR A SECOND OR EVEN A THIRD SHOT IF YOU KNOW WHERE TO AIM FOR A QUICK KILL.

PLACEMENT OF YOUR ROUND BALL IS WAY MOREIMPORTANT THAN THE POWER BEHIND THE POWDER CHARGE.

I LEARNED THAT MINIMAL SLICNESS IS A PLUS AND ALL THE GREASES, BUTTERS AND OTHER GOOS HAVE THE PATCHED BALL HALF WAY DOWN RANGE BEFORE THE POWDER HAS FINISHED EXPANDING. THE EFFECT OF THE SLICK LUBE IS VERY MUCH LIKE THE EFFECT OF TOO WEAK A POWDER CHARGE.

I STRONGLY SUGGEST YOU TRY TO IMPROVE YOUR ACCURACY BEFORE YOU GO OUT ANDJUST WOUND SOME POOR ANIMAL.

DUTCH SCHOULTZ

Dutch, I won't argue with your method as I think it will produce the best accuracy from the rifle. My point was in a hunting situation where a quick follow up shot might be wanted, one could sacrifice some accuracy by not wiping the barrel and using something such as a loading block with a natural lube. I've done this in the past with reasonable accuracy, but it is more minute of deer than a good group.

My other point is, if one is going to use a fat type lube, lard or tallow is better than bacon grease. I don't use either any more.

Dutch, thanks for catching me on that.