Pedersoli Howdah Design Flaw?

[arcticap]

Someone on another forum posted about how he started to have trouble with one lock on his new Howdah pistol. When he took the lock off he found a broken sear and a damaged piece of lead shot that appeared to have caused the damage.
He eventually came to realize that when he was loading some shot into the barrels with the ramrod removed, that some lead shot fell into the empty ramrod channel which directly led to the inside of the lock causing the damage.
While Dixie had sold the Howdah and did graciously fix the damaged sear for free, the email that was sent to Pedersoli went unanswered.
In conclusion, it seems that the Pedersoli Howdah pistol has this peculiar design flaw which its owners should be made aware of in order to help avoid a similar occurrence. :wink:

 

[Musketeer]

Do you know if the ramrod hole opens into just the one lock or into both? I'm wondering whether the hole on this particular gun was drilled off center or whether it's a universal trait. :hmm:

 

[arcticap]

The original poster stated that there was shot found inside both lock areas. So it sounds like that's part of the Pedersoli Howdah design.

Maybe some other Howdah owners could check to see if their's is drilled the same way?

 

[Jumpshot]

The ramrod channel doesn't lead directly to the lock mortice, but there is an opening where a piece of shot can get in there.

I didn't have any trouble with mine, but then I wasn't spilling my shot when loading. My main purpose for the Howdah is shooting roundballs anyway, so it's not a problem for me.

 

[Jumpshot]

What size shot was he using? Upon closer examination, I think it would have to be pretty small because there's hardly any space under the barrels when they're locked in place.

 

[arcticap]

Those are very nice pictures that really serves to illustrate how it could happen.

He said that it looked like #4 shot, but he was probably just estimating. And the actual size of the opening might be a slightly different for every Howdah.

I found a table of shot size so a measurement might be required to distinguish the different sizes.

American Size Pellet Diameter
11 - .062"
10 - .07"
9 1/2- .075"
9 - .08"
8 1/2- .085"
8 - .09"
7 1/2- .095"
7 - .10"
6 - .11"
5 - .12"
4 - .13"
http://www.hallowellco.com/shot_size_chart.htm

Lastly, the original poster stated:

Once inside the pellets get jammed in the lock and cause 1) the lock not to catch at full or half cock 2) broken sear. Both happend to me.

 

[BlackNet]

Get some bedding compound and bed the area next to the locks and breech plugs.

Also while you are at it get some cups for the nipples because heavy firing can damage the blue around the nipples and also spread burn junk all around the breech plugs.

 

[PRM]

Good info - pics are interesting. I have been shooting mine for about a year and a half, with round ball and shot. So far no problems. I am kind of meticulous in loading (only pour shot down the barrel). Good to know info, and I will be a little more watchful in the future - but I don't see it as a serious design flaw.

 

[Jumpshot]

I find it hard to believe #4 shot could get in there. The gap isn't big enough. Mine locks up tighter than a virgin on prom night. It would have to be real small shot.

...but I don't see it as a serious design flaw.

Yeah, I don't either. I guess it can be a problem if you use real small shot and aren't real careful with your loading. As for me, I bought it to use with patched roundballs as a last-ditch defense gun against sasquatch, yeti, El Chupacabra, and other such ravenous beasts, so it ain't a problem.

Works for me. :grin:

 

[Jumpshot]

Get some bedding compound and bed the area next to the locks and breech plugs.

That would work. All you would need to do is apply a bit around the end of the ramrod channel near the breech. That would prevent any shot that gets spilled down the ramrod channel from leaving the channel and getting into those lock openings. Pretty simple solution.

 

[arcticap]

Or just leave the ramrod in place or use a funnel when loading shot.

 

[BlackNet]

I have done some testing on my howdah in this regards, here is my conclusions.

I removed the ramrod and dumped about a dozen pellets of #6 down the channel. I removed the barrels and this is what I found. Most of them came out easily when I invented the pistol.

in BOTH locks I had pellets stuck in the exact same position on the main spring, thus preventing it from going into the fire position. There were 2 pellets in the seer spring but they fell out when I removed the screw. There were also 2 addition one next to the stuck pellet in the mainspring.

Here is some basic lock mechanics on the howdah locks.

What we have here is the hammer all the way back, hammer in the middle (safe) and hammer down. Is this enough to cause the seer to break? I do not know. Is this enough to cause major malfunctions in the locks? OH yes with out a question. I do know with that pellet stuck on the mainspring you are not going to be moving the hammer very far.

I added some white playdough to see what areas it would cover for bedding compound.

Please excuse my mess here. I am still cleaning the barrel out and I have junk on it still. As you can see the white is the build up areas and in the middle you can see the ramrod impression. I dumped several pellets down the ramrod channel and shook it quite good to see where they would go and all came out except one, that one stuck in the ramrod spring area which is a big area and I dont see any dangers of that breaking or causing problems.

The ultimate solution here is to get a shot flask. They have an english and irish head on them, I prefer the english it's more durable

You just invert it and push the lever, it dispenses 1 1/2 or 1 1/4 oz shot every time. Make sure the tip is in the bore and you will never spill any. I used this for 6 hours at the range on christmas eve and I have a powder noobie with me and we both fired it often. Never had a single stray pellet while loading using this flask.

 

[Jumpshot]

A shot flask is a good idea, which is what I would use in the field anyway. I've just been pouring the shot in with my dipper and I don't spill any down the ramrod channel, but I can see it happening. Anyway, a little bedding compound around the end of the channel should eliminate the potential of that happening altogether.

 

[arcticap]

I did wonder about how a sear could break. If a smaller piece of shot became stuck in one of the notches, that might cause the sear to either not fully seat in the notch or to change the seating angle of the sear in the notch.
I'm speculating that could cause enough extra pressure on the tip of the sear to possibly break it off or damage it?
I suppose there's also a possibility that a part wasn't hardened properly or that too much pressure was applied once the lock became jammed.
Maybe he was shooting with #7.5 - #9 shot and just didn't realize it?
As they say in medicine, anything is possible I guess.
Thanks for all of the detailed info.
It's always interesting as well as a pleasure to try to figure out these little nuances. You guys really cared enough to check out all of the angles really thoroughly.
Now if only Pedersoli would have been thorough enough to not have left a gap! :grin:

 

[Cage Dodger]

Maybe I'm over-simplifying here, but couldn't you just keep a thumb or finger over the ram-rod hole while holding the pistol during loading as an easy fix?

Cage :v

 

[BlackNet]

Yes.

 

[Jumpshot]

Now if only Pedersoli would have been thorough enough to not have left a gap! :grin:

Does anyone know if the Kodiak double rifle is the same? I believe the Howdah pistol is based on it. It uses the same locks.

 

[BlackNet]

Also the SxS uses the same breech plate and trigers. Am wondering if they to have the same problem. I will send this to Pedersoli (got email from Pierangelo about the carvings on mine recently)

 

[Jumpshot]

(got email from Pierangelo about the carvings on mine recently)

What about them?

 

[BlackNet]

Just sent him an email about this thread and this issue.