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LME

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Do you honestly think the protests you see in other Countries are going to show any of the violence?? You're kidding yourself. Even our news media won't show you that. Like the rest of us who are former military. It won't be a matter of joing units again. It won't be N vs S, E vs W, etc. It will be neighbor against neighbor. As far as America is concerned, I'll stand right next to you to defend our freedom.
The last trip I took was to Japan. I wasn't there as a military man just a vacation and I had friends over there that I hadn't seen in several years. They wanted to know what was wrong in the U.S. and why people were burning the cities. I told them that certain people control the people doing all the damage in our cities. They want to destroy the old history and start anew and that I thought their goal is a one world government. I may be wrong but reading a lot of world history I found that all the countries that made drastic changes did it for power which equates to money. I also never saw a protest in a foreign country act like our so-called protesters act. Our protester riot and tear up the cities .
 

ML48

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The last trip I took was to Japan. I wasn't there as a military man just a vacation and I had friends over there that I hadn't seen in several years. They wanted to know what was wrong in the U.S. and why people were burning the cities. I told them that certain people control the people doing all the damage in our cities. They want to destroy the old history and start anew and that I thought their goal is a one world government. I may be wrong but reading a lot of world history I found that all the countries that made drastic changes did it for power which equates to money. I also never saw a protest in a foreign country act like our so-called protesters act. Our protester riot and tear up the cities .
You hit every detail exactly right. I could never figure out why people that think communism is great, don't move to China, Russia, North Korea....give them a real taste what it's like to lose your freedom. Try their BS in those Countries and see how long they live!! GBA.... 👍
 

4575wcf

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I have the advantage of being married twenty five years to a Christian lady from the Eastern Block. She immigrated to the US in '91. As she is a strong, intelligent, hard working person, I have not had a great deal of influence over her political views. She has lived in America as a free person with me, watched and learned, and arrived at her own conclusions. You will never sell her on the current agenda of the Democratic Party, my wife says she has seen all of that she needed to already.
 

ML48

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I have the advantage of being married twenty five years to a Christian lady from the Eastern Block. She immigrated to the US in '91. As she is a strong, intelligent, hard working person, I have not had a great deal of influence over her political views. She has lived in America as a free person with me, watched and learned, and arrived at her own conclusions. You will never sell her on the current agenda of the Democratic Party, my wife says she has seen all of that she needed to already.
You keep that gal around forever. I'll bet she could tell these fools that think America is bad just where to move to! My father-in-law and mother-in-law were in work camps in Germany during WW2....they had some real horror stories to tell and remember.
BTW: When you said, "hard working", you probably scared a crap load of them dem commies. ;)
 

LME

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I have the advantage of being married twenty five years to a Christian lady from the Eastern Block. She immigrated to the US in '91. As she is a strong, intelligent, hard working person, I have not had a great deal of influence over her political views. She has lived in America as a free person with me, watched and learned, and arrived at her own conclusions. You will never sell her on the current agenda of the Democratic Party, my wife says she has seen all of that she needed to already.
Your wife has already lived part of her life under a govenment that has a few people at the top and the rest at the bottom and no way for the ones at the bottom to climb up in the system. She has already had a look at what is happening to The U.S. . and she expressed her feelings about this matter well! What is happening in the U.S. is out of an old play book. the game plan is to paint a beautiful picture of what could be and get as many uninformed people as possible to tag along. Once they have enough to over power the existing government they take over the governing and they also take over the peoples lives. You will no longer be a citizen, you will be a subject and under strict control!
 

4575wcf

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I agree with you 100%. When I was in school I didn't know why we had to learn about some old guys from long ago. Now that I am old, I know
My English teacher for my first three years in our small high school, once told me it was unfortunate that the study of Abe Lincoln, Geo Washington, etc. were force fed to students until they grew tired of it. She encouraged me to study the actual lives of the founding fathers at some point in my life, and arrive at my own conclusions. I have studied the lives of the members of the Continental Congress on my own. She was SO right.
 

Loyalist Dave

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The emancipation proclamation was nothing more than a order issued in hopes of drawing more negro men to the ranks of the union. And a political endeavor to bolster the republic.
Actually it also prevented the UK from entering on the side of the South. Slavery in colonies, as well as international trade in slaves, had been abolished for the UK by 1833. Lincoln's idea to pay off slave holders was not original, he got it from the British. So the EP then set up the issue that the Union forces were fighting to enforce the EP, so the UK could not then come in on the Confederates' side, which was to preserve slavery. Further it was supposed, and was likely, that England was going to try and pull a "Roman Provance" scenario, coming in when the South was quite weak, resources depleted, and turn part of the Southern States into quasi colonies. They would need British protection, and British economic help, so... even if they didn't put Victoria on any Southern minted coins, they would be defacto colonies..., but then the EP was issued....

LD
 

appalichian hunter

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Never made sense too me why England did not come into the souths side even with slavery being a issue, bet we might be british subjects if that would of happened.
 

4575wcf

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The truly unique thing about America, was that we were let alone to fight our civil war out to the bitter end. When it was over we were decided, and gradually we became one people again. I think that is why we could have battlefield reenactments and southern monuments, fly the Stars and Bars if we wanted to, and until recently, nobody was offended. I think Vietnam should always be held up as an example of the results of foreigners interfering in someone else's civil war.
 

TFoley

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Yes, I believe both civil wars were very similar. Freedom to rule themselves.
In the case of the Irish Civil War, having achieved the so-called Free State of Ireland, the anti-treaty side were fighting as a form of protest at the wording of the Treaty. A few thousand died before it was more or less settled, but the Dáil - the elected Irish government - still shows strong evidence of this schism, 99 years later.
 

stephenprops1

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History is never correct when it concerns why and how! These two elements are alway doctored up !
Your statement may or may not be true. However, I will admit that the winning side usually gets to write and approve the history that is told. We should take most anything we read with the proverbial "grain of salt."
 

stephenprops1

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I will never, read that never, take my position at the whipping post and begin beating myself up over being an American. I am proud of my country. Our country, may she always be right in all her affairs, but our country right or wrong. The more you travel abroad, the better she looks.
You need to credit your comment to Stephen Decatur who first made that toast.
 

ML48

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Your wife has already lived part of her life under a govenment that has a few people at the top and the rest at the bottom and no way for the ones at the bottom to climb up in the system. She has already had a look at what is happening to The U.S. . and she expressed her feelings about this matter well! What is happening in the U.S. is out of an old play book. the game plan is to paint a beautiful picture of what could be and get as many uninformed people as possible to tag along. Once they have enough to over power the existing government they take over the governing and they also take over the peoples lives. You will no longer be a citizen, you will be a subject and under strict control!
1984 coming to your neighbor soon....
You need to credit your comment to Stephen Decatur who first made that toast.
Doesn't matter who said it. He portrays he's feeling to be true.
 

4575wcf

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I knew full well who said it. You just cannot second guess yourself all the time. We are going to make mistakes as individuals and as countries because we are imperfect by design. We do the best we can in the circumstances and I ain't apologizing to anybody. And I will give credit to Stephen Decatur, who was a pretty darn good hand in the Navy.
 
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TomV

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The South left the Union because of the high taxes placed on cotton and other goods, around 80%. Lincoln did not want the South to trade with England or other countries as that would have hurt the bottom line of Northern factories. That is the reason the South decided to leave the Union. The whole slavery issue came up in 1863, two years after the war started.
Exactly, one thing the south didn't like was the loss of states rights and federal usurping control. Seems they predicted what the feds would do 100years later and today
 

4575wcf

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I think those southerners lived a little closer to the land, and had their own ideas about what worked and what didn't. I think at first they saw Abe Lincoln as the harbinger of bad ideas for them, and when he was elected in 1860 they figured that was the end of any good times. Personally, I do not think Abe was that guy. When you begin to study the man, the first thing you encounter is his uncanny skill as a politician. He took on a cabinet of fire breathers, some of whom were openly hostile to him, simply because they were better at their jobs. He never questioned his ability to put them in their place, outsmart them, and circumvent their attempts at distention at every turn. Salmon Chase never did catch on that he was being played to do his best. I think the south would have learned to appreciate him, had he lived to have some input on reconstruction. Abe really comes through as won of the truly great ones.
 

Southernfi

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Slavery was an issue for secession, just read the articles of secession. Slavery is all in them. Remember Mississippi and South Carolina actually seceded just before Lincoln took office. The other states seemed to be tipped by Buchanan's proposal to charge import taxes on goods coming to southern ports up to 48%, if I remember correctly. Also, big cotton wanted to expand slavery and stirred the pot on this. Even Lincoln said he would leave the status quo as it was, but this wasn't good enough for Davis and big cotton. As far as England, they were hoping on the U. S. and England to get into it over a border dispute Between Maine and Canada. This would have pulled U. S. forces into a two front war, possibly giving the South a victory.
But it doesn't matter what the reason for the South's secession. The United States was not going to allow a hostile nation to control the lower Mississippi River, Tennessee River, and the Gulf of Mexico. This would have crippled Northern economics, making it very expensive to ship agricultural and manufactured good from the mid-west.
 

LME

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Slavery was an issue for secession, just read the articles of secession. Slavery is all in them. Remember Mississippi and South Carolina actually seceded just before Lincoln took office. The other states seemed to be tipped by Buchanan's proposal to charge import taxes on goods coming to southern ports up to 48%, if I remember correctly. Also, big cotton wanted to expand slavery and stirred the pot on this. Even Lincoln said he would leave the status quo as it was, but this wasn't good enough for Davis and big cotton. As far as England, they were hoping on the U. S. and England to get into it over a border dispute Between Maine and Canada. This would have pulled U. S. forces into a two front war, possibly giving the South a victory.
But it doesn't matter what the reason for the South's secession. The United States was not going to allow a hostile nation to control the lower Mississippi River, Tennessee River, and the Gulf of Mexico. This would have crippled Northern economics, making it very expensive to ship agricultural and manufactured good from the mid-west.
 

Loyalist Dave

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Never made sense too me why England did not come into the souths side even with slavery being a issue, bet we might be british subjects if that would of happened.
They simply couldn't.

Parliament by the time of Victoria always had a reason to authorize any of Queen Victoria's wars. It was either to expand British territory (cash) or to demonstrate to another country not to mess with The British (public relations). The latter motivation was generally only done when it wouldn't cost too much. Entering on the side of The Confederacy would be costly, so the money making aspect would be needed..., ah but with the EP the anti-slavery members of Parliament would not have voted in favor..., ever...., thus, no British entry.

LD
 
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