Oil based stain or water based ?

[kyron4]

Working on a Traditions Kentucky rifle kit. I believe the stock to be made of beech wood. I'm told with beech that water based is the way to go, but I did a Deerhunter beech stock a few years ago and it turned out great with Minwax oil based stain. I used a mixture of walnut and red mahogany and got a nice even reddish brown, med. dark color that really "popped" after a few coats of Tru-Oil. So why Water based and why not oil based ? -Thanks

 

[Jim Evans]

I used the water base stain on this Kentucky then Tru-Oil.

 

[Mike Payne]

Many years ago I tried oil based stain on a maple stock did not penetrate well. Ever since I have used water based stains.

 

[kyron4]

I used the water base stain on this Kentucky then Tru-Oil.

Wow ! I'm sold, how many coats of stain to get that color ? I'd like to go just a little darker.

 

[44-henry]

Water and Spirit based stains put the stain in the wood, oil based stains sit on the surface like a translucent paint.

 

[Tumbledown]

Fiebrings leather dye works well. It's alcohol based, I believe.

Oil based stains don't penetrate the wood well.

 

[Jim Evans]

Wow ! I'm sold, how many coats of stain to get that color ? I'd like to go just a little darker.

I only used one coat ,right out of the bottle.

 

[PathfinderNC]

Water based. Be sure to prepare the wood (pre-raise and sand , a few times).
Alcohol based is good but dries very fast and can leave witness marks, particularly on big projects like a long rifle stock.
Oil doesn’t adsorbe into wood as well as water or alcohol.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

I like alcohol based. Fiebings' leather dye always worked well for me on gunstocks.

LD

 

[springfield art]

Working on a Traditions Kentucky rifle kit. I believe the stock to be made of beech wood. I'm told with beech that water based is the way to go, but I did a Deerhunter beech stock a few years ago and it turned out great with Minwax oil based stain. I used a mixture of walnut and red mahogany and got a nice even reddish brown, med. dark color that really "popped" after a few coats of Tru-Oil. So why Water based and why not oil based ? -Thanks

Some of the Alcohol based stains work great. Check 'em out.

 

[Col. Batguano]

Can someone please chime in as to the chemistry involved here for the various stain carriers; water, alcohol, oil?

I have my own theories, but they are based on supposition rather than scientific fact.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Can someone please chime in as to the chemistry involved here for the various stain carriers; water, alcohol, oil?

I have my own theories, but they are based on supposition rather than scientific fact.

Here is a pretty good link to the differences. Stain or Dye
After reading the above I wonder about acid based "stains", which when heat is applied, actually alter the wood reacting with the mineral content that shows to the human eye as "wood grain". So the acid is different than my using dye for leather. I've not noticed that the sunlight has faded any gunstocks that I used dye upon..., maybe because it's a leather dye that the company added something to keep it light resistant.

LD

 

[Scota@4570]

Oil based stains are a one shot deal. Once applied you are limited on what more can be done. Water does not penetrate oil. Paint store stains are mostly not suitable for gunstocks. Oil based paint store stain is ground up pigment in an oil carrier. They tend to look muddy on the wood.

On maple always start with ferric nitrate solution (aqua fortis). There is no need to make it from iron and nitric acid, buy ferric nitrate crystals or premade solution.

Dye stains are used to adjust the color after the AF. Dye stains work on any wood. It is a good idea to dilute them at first and sneak up on the desired color.

Once you apply finish any new coats of stain will not work as well. You can put some dye in the finish to give an overall background color. IT will look flatter and more uniform than letting stain soak into the wood.

Jim Kibler has stain tutorials on Utube.

 

[kyron4]

I only used one coat ,right out of the bottle.

Will it get darker the more coats you put on ?

 

[Jim Evans]

Will it get darker the more coats you put on ?

It should because the wood will keep soaking it in.

 

[Vaino]

I use the water based stains from Jim Klein and the first applied is an orange toner which yields a yellow undertone. The toner is followed w/ either the reddish brown or the dark brown or both......Fred

 

[JCKelly]

Here is a pretty good link to the differences. Stain or Dye
After reading the above I wonder about acid based "stains", which when heat is applied, actually alter the wood reacting with the mineral content that shows to the human eye as "wood grain". So the acid is different than my using dye for leather. I've not noticed that the sunlight has faded any gunstocks that I used dye upon..., maybe because it's a leather dye that the company added something to keep it light resistant.

My experience, with Fiebring dye, is that it makes a fine color which then changes (to not so fine) with time.
I suggest you use Laurel Mountain, it was developed by an actual SHOOTER. He now flies aeroplanes that he has built himself. Firt met him several decades ago, when he lived here in SE Michigan.

LD

 

[Loyalist Dave]

thanks
Laurel Mountain is very fine for a first time stain on a curly stock, but the Fiebings is great when one is restoring an older stock with little figure, and I've done this many times. Never had fading issues.

LD

 

[appalichian hunter]

Fiebings also makes a low V.O.C. based stain that works well on leather it may be a good choice for a stock. V.O.C. --- volatile organic compounds --- No alcohol base, in case some did not know.

 

[rafterob]

The post is specific to the Beech wood used by the Traditions-CVA guns. It can be very finnicky about absorbing stains. I have found that the Feibings leather stain works the best for these stocks. Thanks to advice I got off this forum over 5 years ago.