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muzzle loading season
- Thread starter sunshot
- Start date
Help Support Muzzleloading Forum:
Good Luck.
We tried a couple of times here in Minn.
Your going to need deep pockets, your going up against gun manufactures lobbyists that want their people to sell guns and the Division of Wildlife wants to sell licenses.
The bottom line is about the average sportsmen,, woe be it to us but the majority don't give a hoot for traditional guns and want all the modern bells an whistles.
1,000 signatures isn't enough considering last year they harvested 17,000 deer with ML.
The now really old argument is archery, long bows vs compound,, we all know how that went.
We tried a couple of times here in Minn.
Your going to need deep pockets, your going up against gun manufactures lobbyists that want their people to sell guns and the Division of Wildlife wants to sell licenses.
The bottom line is about the average sportsmen,, woe be it to us but the majority don't give a hoot for traditional guns and want all the modern bells an whistles.
1,000 signatures isn't enough considering last year they harvested 17,000 deer with ML.
The now really old argument is archery, long bows vs compound,, we all know how that went.
zimmerstutzen
70 Cal.
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Pennsylvania was one of the first to have a muzzle loader season, back before modern in-lines were a twinkle in the designer's eye. It was sold to the game agency as a heritage thing to celebrate the state's connection to the Pa Long Rifle and the significance it played in the history of the state. Our flintlock season, never has been a serious game management tool. That is the way it was sold to the game commission. At first it was only permitted on public hunting lands (IIRC) Later is was expanded to every where.
It helped that one or two lower level game commission employees were majorly into flintlock building and hunting.
North Carolina has a proud colonial history of long hunters, and I would try to use that.
It helped that one or two lower level game commission employees were majorly into flintlock building and hunting.
North Carolina has a proud colonial history of long hunters, and I would try to use that.
Yup, I hear ya,, bow hunters get all bucky about that.sunshot said:
Again, a heart felt Good Luck Friend.
Lonegun1894
54 Cal.
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Going to play devil's advocate here...
I would try to go for a separate season instead of "sharing" one with the bow hunters. First off, you will have made some enemies and people that won't want you infringing on their season. Second, if the bow hunters can share a season with the ML hunters, they why can't the ML hunters just keep their hands off the bow season and share a season with the modern gun hunters? See what I mean? You won't gain anything but enemies if you do anything but try to push for a separate season that doesn't interfere with anyone elses. I mean, I'm sure you wouldn't want the modern gun guys to be allowed to hunt during your ML-only season. Same thing. Make friends who will help you get more signatures and more votes if you can instead of making enemies who will work against you on this.
I would try to go for a separate season instead of "sharing" one with the bow hunters. First off, you will have made some enemies and people that won't want you infringing on their season. Second, if the bow hunters can share a season with the ML hunters, they why can't the ML hunters just keep their hands off the bow season and share a season with the modern gun hunters? See what I mean? You won't gain anything but enemies if you do anything but try to push for a separate season that doesn't interfere with anyone elses. I mean, I'm sure you wouldn't want the modern gun guys to be allowed to hunt during your ML-only season. Same thing. Make friends who will help you get more signatures and more votes if you can instead of making enemies who will work against you on this.
sunshot said:
you will never win going against the bow crowd. and the inline folks will be hollering foul as well. as stated, you will have to try for a season just for flintlocks, so you don't step on toes. here in PA, we are up against the inlines trying to get into our season and i believe they will win, it is just a matter of time. good luck with your venture and if we can assist in any way, let us know.
Flintlock season is when I take out a flintlock and go hunting. I hunt on a lease near you (essentially between Taylorsville and Boomer), and don't feel I am in completion with anything except the game I pursue. Except for archery season (bow or crossbow) we can hunt with flintlock, wheellock, matchlock, percussion, inline, even the dreaded muzzleloader that doesn’t smoke..... and then during 'rifle season' add bolt action, lever action”¦”¦. Wait a minute, you want a traditional muzzleloading season ”“ guess you are a flintlock only season advocate (flintlocks were all the rage for around 200 years or so, so that must be traditional, correct? Ban the caplocks in traditional season, works in PA) - however, I know someone who uses a matchlock and calls that traditional, maybe that should be traditional? Matchlock only season. Oh, and I got a doe near the house the day after Christmas (aka, rifle season) last year with a longbow ”¦. and no special archery season. An archery deer while competing with modern rifle hunters”¦. How is a 'traditional' muzzleloader to compete?
Likely not a well received opinion on this forum, but believe all hunters need to stick together and not fight among themselves. A single branch easily breaks, many branches are”¦”¦ We in North Carolina can hunt with traditional muzzleloader of our choice, bow of our choice, crossbow, pistol or rifle for a little over one and a half months every year. Quite the deal compared to some other states
The number of hunters is dropping. We need to do whatever we can to include all hunters and not continue this argument to compartmentalize ourselves.
Just some food for thought.
Likely not a well received opinion on this forum, but believe all hunters need to stick together and not fight among themselves. A single branch easily breaks, many branches are”¦”¦ We in North Carolina can hunt with traditional muzzleloader of our choice, bow of our choice, crossbow, pistol or rifle for a little over one and a half months every year. Quite the deal compared to some other states
The number of hunters is dropping. We need to do whatever we can to include all hunters and not continue this argument to compartmentalize ourselves.
Just some food for thought.
Lonegun1894
54 Cal.
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sunshot said:
You aren't thinking right--unless you have a year round deer season, and I seriously doubt that. Your State's wildlife department set the seasons you have, and I am sure there is time before or after the current seasons that they can add a few days, or a week, or a month, or whatever to the current seasons, that way you don't step on toes. Here is where I am coming from. I love hunting with a ML, and prefer the flinter over a cap gun, but I also bow hunt, and love that too. To me it isn't so much about the method, but about getting out there and hunting, regardless if I get anything or not. If you were to offer me a special flint season, I would love it, but NOT at the cost of taking time from the bow season. Here we have a bow season, and a gun season. During bow season, you can hunt with your choice of bow or crossbow if you're handicapped. During gun season, you can hunt with your choice of bow, crossbow, muzzleloader, or modern gun. Do you have the same opportunity of being able to use your ML during the modern gun season? If so, just use it then instead of trying to screw other hunters out of part of their season because doing so will NOT get you any friends. Using your ML is not any disadvantage over the other guy with a modern gun. Yes, he may be able to take longer shots with his scoped .300 Mag, but who cares. I have done the long range "hunting" thing, and still take varmints out past 800 yards regularly, but that is pest control, and not hunting. It fulfills a purpose (pest control and training), but it is not "hunting", but closer to shopping. You can't pick up a ML, and by doing so accept the limitations it imposes on you, and then cry foul that the other guy, who chose to play within the legal limitations, but who can reach out farther than you, doesn't play by your rules. How about giving up part of your gun season to allow the archers more time, since their bows limit them to closer ranges than any modern gun, or even your flint lock. It's only fair after all, since their more limited range obviously requires that they have more time since they need to get closer, right?
As was said above, we need to stick together and help each other out, cause if you start all the various groups of hunters to go against each other, maybe you will get to hunt for a few more years, but your kids will not, and I doubt you want that. Doing what you suggest only plays into the hands of the anti's.
Guess your reply makes me realize that discourse on this subject enlightens me to other points of view. I would never desire to hurt the rights of hunters at large. In retrospect there does not appear to be enough traditionalist ml hunters to influence our wildlife dept. Thank you for your input.
Lonegun1894
54 Cal.
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I just hope I didn't step on your toes because that definitely was not my intention. I love your idea of having a dedicated traditional ML season, but as you said, there's not many of us, and in a way, that may be to our advantage in getting one added to the existing seasons, say before or after, without cutting into and shortening the others. I mean, what's the harm in giving us an extra week or two when there's very few of us that hunt this way, right? And every deer we take, what few that is, is one more that isn't getting hit by a car and injuring the people inside. 
:hmm:
:hmm:
zimmerstutzen
70 Cal.
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Hunters stick together and not bicker? Suggest that to the archers, most of whom would not be in the woods, but for cross bows, plastic arrows, training wheel bows and mechanical releases. Yet they CLAIM, it is traditional and jealously guard THEIR season like their own private fort knox. Any suggestion that they share the woods is met with screams of blasphemy and demands for crucification. They have a strangle hold against any other specialseasons
I just cannot refrain from beating this dead horse.First, you are correct; an attempt to change anything would be viewed by some as offensive to all hunters there is just no escaping from those who would twist our words or the truth to suit their purpose. Next we would have to play politics and that is viewed by the politicians strictly according to voting numbers. Still I may be jousting at windmills but if I could get a sizable number to help I would be willing to try to get a few days added just for us traditional ml hunters. LASTLY MY PERSONAL OPINION is that calling the modern inlines muzzleloaders is a misnomer. I'd just as soon see the gun season lengthened since too many deer are wounded by hunters that think they can make shots that are out of range just because that inline wears a scope. I welcome discussion, even criticism.
Discuss all you want, just don't discuss inlines. :wink:
zimmerstutzen said:
yes sir, you nailed it Zimm! heck we can't even get an earlier opening for squirrel season because we are invading their turf! right now we share the flintlock season with archery and small game, no big deal if it stays that way. but the "modern" ml folks are knocking on the door and i hope we can keep them at bay. i wish you luck and hope you succeed in getting a fl season. again, anything we can do to help, please let us know.
Mickc01
45 Cal.
I'm in NC, add me to that list! Let's get the ml season back to what it was intended to be.
