Quantcast

Long Fowler Restored

Help Support Muzzle Loading Forum:

Feltwad

45 Cal.
Joined
May 28, 2017
Messages
1,134
Reaction score
592
Enclosed are images of a flint lock converted percussion that I restored some years ago . It is an 8 bore with a 62 inch barrel and a 7 inch lock , the barrel is of iron and I would date the gun approximately from 1750 with brass furniture which includes a tang, butt plate , a acorn trigger guard and a brass side plate. The barrel was very rusted but not deep pitting has it had been housed in an old barn and not exposed to the elements the bore was also good with just a light rust and no pits I manage to hone out the bore which came up bright just like new.. With the stock which was very dirty and dry I removed the grime but not the patina and finished with a good stock oil for restoration work it should never and I say never take it too far it should look its age and not some thing new straight of the shelf one of the worst faults in restoration is to recut the checkering it is better to clean the grime out using a paint stripper and a strong bristle tooth brush there is nothing worse to handle crisp checkering on a 200 year old gun .
Feltwad
P1010001.JPG
P1010002.JPG
P1010002.JPG
P1010006.JPG
P1010005.JPG
 

OldRust

40 Cal
MLF Supporter
Joined
Dec 12, 2018
Messages
194
Reaction score
74
Location
York County Pennsylvania
Nicely done ! With that barrel length and bore do you think it may have been a market hunters gun or was that size typical for the period. Thanks O.R.
 

Feltwad

45 Cal.
Joined
May 28, 2017
Messages
1,134
Reaction score
592
Nicely done ! With that barrel length and bore do you think it may have been a market hunters gun or was that size typical for the period. Thanks O.R.
This type of gun would have been used for fowling on the inland marshes here in the UK and would have been shot from the shoulder it would have been small for a market gunner {or punt gunner]for which that would have been twice has big and a lot heavier see image
Feltwad
punt gun firing

100_2733.JPG
 
Last edited:

OldRust

40 Cal
MLF Supporter
Joined
Dec 12, 2018
Messages
194
Reaction score
74
Location
York County Pennsylvania
Thanks You can find the sneak boats and punt guns in our local museums as I'm only 40 miles or so
upriver from the Chesapeake Bay in MD USA. Still a big waterfowl area.
Those gents using an 8 bore every day shoulder fired for a living were definitely hardy souls.
Really nice job on the restoration of a beauty. O.R.
 

Silky921

45 Cal.
Joined
Mar 5, 2014
Messages
970
Reaction score
84
Thank you for sharing that. Taught me something new in regards to hunting in your part of the world.

I've always admired your interest in smoothbores.

Feel free to share more.
 

Zonie

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
MLF Supporter
Joined
Oct 4, 2003
Messages
31,756
Reaction score
4,882
Location
Phoenix, AZ
Thank you for sharing that. Taught me something new in regards to hunting in your part of the world.

I've always admired your interest in smoothbores.

Feel free to share more.
Well, in my opinion, they really weren't hunting. They were slaughtering (as in slaughtering cattle and swine for food).

Their only interest in stalking game was to harvest as much as possible as easily as possible. That is why we, true hunters in the U.S. wanted it to become illegal (which it eventually did become.)
 

MountainSmoke

40 Cal
MLF Supporter
Joined
Jun 23, 2020
Messages
175
Reaction score
130
That is a beauty. So, dumb question but why were the barrels on these fowlers so long?
 

Feltwad

45 Cal.
Joined
May 28, 2017
Messages
1,134
Reaction score
592
Well, in my opinion, they really weren't hunting. They were slaughtering (as in slaughtering cattle and swine for food).

Their only interest in stalking game was to harvest as much as possible as easily as possible. That is why we, true hunters in the U.S. wanted it to become illegal (which it eventually did become.)
You are talking about something that you know very little about has far has slaughtering is concerned look no further than the fur trappers of America in that period of the flintlock and the percussion with many species fur and feather shot to near extinction .
The long fowler was used mostly on the marshes by the locals to feed his family yes the punt guns used were used by people for a living but not all the year only in the season, to shoot large numbers of wildfowl such has upwards of 50 is a myth it was more than likely to be 6 on a good day .Today there are only a very small number that use a punt gun they are more for demonstrations at Game and Country Fairs
Feltwad
 

Feltwad

45 Cal.
Joined
May 28, 2017
Messages
1,134
Reaction score
592
That is a beauty. So, dumb question but why were the barrels on these fowlers so long?
The reason for the long barrel was mostly to burn the very coarse powder for a punt gun and to shoot to the distance of 60 to 80 yards .lets not forget that black powder in those days did not have the same strength has todays black powder
Feltwad
 
Last edited:

toot

32 Cal.
Joined
May 9, 2013
Messages
1,921
Reaction score
655
I beleave that they were called HUDSON VALLEY GUN'S, because that is where some of them were used on the great flocks of birds that came to rest on there journey. also I know that they were used on the GREAT LAKES also.
 

OldRust

40 Cal
MLF Supporter
Joined
Dec 12, 2018
Messages
194
Reaction score
74
Location
York County Pennsylvania
You are talking about something that you know very little about has far has slaughtering is concerned look no further than the fur trappers of America in that period of the flintlock and the percussion with many species fur and feather shot to near extinction .
The long fowler was used mostly on the marshes by the locals to feed his family yes the punt guns used were used by people for a living but not all the year only in the season, to shoot large numbers of wildfowl such has upwards of 50 is a myth it was more than likely to be 6 on a good day .Today there are only a very small number that use a punt gun they are more for demonstrations at Game and Country Fairs
Feltwad
I'm referencing the USA and market hunting here. I agree with Zonie to a point on the market hunters. But it was legal to slaughter the game and wildfowl during that time period. It was a business.
In 1918 the Feds made it illegal to sell wildfowl. They didn't even try to regulate it which in my mind was a good thing. The passenger pigeon wasn't as lucky. The plains Bison barely survived the market hunter.

Here is a well written article on market hunting in the USA if interested. Its centered on the Chesapeake bay below me but I'm sure relates to our Hudson Bay and Great Lakes as well.

Ducks for Sale

Feltwad I believe I took your excellent fowler post off on a tangent with the market hunters question. For that I apologize. I appreciate you sharing your knowledge on these period smoothbores and hope you continue to do so. I've always loved our American Longrifles but I'm finding the smoothbores fascinating

Were you able to identify the origin or builder of your 8 bore ?

Thank you O.R
 

Feltwad

45 Cal.
Joined
May 28, 2017
Messages
1,134
Reaction score
592
I'm referencing the USA and market hunting here. I agree with Zonie to a point on the market hunters. But it was legal to slaughter the game and wildfowl during that time period. It was a business.
In 1918 the Feds made it illegal to sell wildfowl. They didn't even try to regulate it which in my mind was a good thing. The passenger pigeon wasn't as lucky. The plains Bison barely survived the market hunter.

Here is a well written article on market hunting in the USA if interested. Its centered on the Chesapeake bay below me but I'm sure relates to our Hudson Bay and Great Lakes as well.

Ducks for Sale

Feltwad I believe I took your excellent fowler post off on a tangent with the market hunters question. For that I apologize. I appreciate you sharing your knowledge on these period smoothbores and hope you continue to do so. I've always loved our American Longrifles but I'm finding the smoothbores fascinating

Were you able to identify the origin or builder of your 8 bore ?

Thank you O.R
Have not seen a makers name on the 8 bore I restored which is quite common for that period Peter Hawker had his made by makers such has Manton and Clayton and others . I half restored several long fowlers including punt guns with no name and I have come to the conclusion that most punt guns and some fowlers were blacksmith made they would obtain a large barrel by some barrel maker and fit a small lock if the lock had a name then most people think that it was made by that gun maker who had never seen the gun . These guns were very crude which no top gun maker would make .
Feltwad
 

Zonie

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
MLF Supporter
Joined
Oct 4, 2003
Messages
31,756
Reaction score
4,882
Location
Phoenix, AZ
You are talking about something that you know very little about has far has slaughtering is concerned look no further than the fur trappers of America in that period of the flintlock and the percussion with many species fur and feather shot to near extinction .
The long fowler was used mostly on the marshes by the locals to feed his family yes the punt guns used were used by people for a living but not all the year only in the season, to shoot large numbers of wildfowl such has upwards of 50 is a myth it was more than likely to be 6 on a good day .Today there are only a very small number that use a punt gun they are more for demonstrations at Game and Country Fairs
Feltwad
(Boldface added by me.)

Perhaps it is you that knows very little about market hunting in the USA?
This NRA article is but one of many that supports my comment about it being a slaughter.


As far as fur trapping in America goes you are correct. Vast areas of the country were trapped to such an extent that nothing worth bothering with was left behind.

It was because of the market hunters, who made their living by killing as much as they could that the American hunters demanded and got laws controlling hunting here.
 

Feltwad

45 Cal.
Joined
May 28, 2017
Messages
1,134
Reaction score
592
What you quoted was for American punt gunners not here in the UK which is different because this thread was about the UK long fowler and its use you also mentioned History of the punt gun which implies to American punt gunners with flaws regarding UK punt gunning. Also the man in the punt is no other than Snowdon Slights the east Yorkshire punt gunner and the gun in the punt I have examined many times which is now housed in York UK museum .Books are good for the basics but they have many flaws that have been repeated down the time , research into these and experience can produce a different answer has for punt gunning here in the Uk your knowledge is very limited .
Feltwad
 

Zonie

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
MLF Supporter
Joined
Oct 4, 2003
Messages
31,756
Reaction score
4,882
Location
Phoenix, AZ
What you quoted was for American punt gunners not here in the UK which is different because this thread was about the UK long fowler and its use you also mentioned History of the punt gun which implies to American punt gunners with flaws regarding UK punt gunning. Also the man in the punt is no other than Snowdon Slights the east Yorkshire punt gunner and the gun in the punt I have examined many times which is now housed in York UK museum .Books are good for the basics but they have many flaws that have been repeated down the time , research into these and experience can produce a different answer has for punt gunning here in the Uk your knowledge is very limited .
Feltwad
Yes. I'll be the first to admit my knowledge of gunning in the UK is limited however, this forum and the vast majority of the members on it are in the United States of America. Because of this, it is only to be expected that we view things and speak about them from an American point of view. This includes guns, hunting and all aspects of history.
 

Rudyard

45 Cal.
Joined
Feb 28, 2019
Messages
893
Reaction score
589
Great work! Would be awesome to see converted back to flintlock. That beautiful gun deserves it.
You seem to be missing the point it Was flint ,now its cap lock that's its history..Fortunatley you don't own it . Well for the gun at least . Felt wads knowledge on this subject is extraordinary & matches his skill as a restorer . I've seen his work close up & known him 50 years or so. He is no FME ( Five minet expert) . My father shot 25 pounder Howitzers for 6 years .But Felt Wads shooting sportsmen go way back beyond cap locks . It is true the Irish Elk, Bears &, wild boar where creamed up in post medieval times & the Beaver but now they are making a comeback and there are more deer than in Robin Hoods day .By some estimates plus the Per Davids & other varieties . The greenies moan about the big estates designed for rearing many game birds .But the same keepering out the natural vermin also provides the best protection of small song birds who are rarely disturbed except the shoot days .
Rudyard
 
Top