Linen Patches

[Bretwalda]

Is linen really any better that cotton for patch material ? If so...who is a good source for this higher quality material :hmm: ? The cost of the material is not part of this question :shake: ...I am seeking the absolute best shooting materials available :applause: ...and yes I know I will have to "test" my gun as each gun will shoot a specific way to each specific load :thumbsup: . I am seeking others experience on this subject.

Many thanks for your thoughts :bow: !

 

[rabjr]

Is linen really any better that cotton for patch material ? If so...who is a good source for this higher quality material :hmm: ? The cost of the material is not part of this question :shake: ...I am seeking the absolute best shooting materials available :applause: ...and yes I know I will have to "test" my gun as each gun will shoot a specific way to each specific load :thumbsup: . I am seeking others experience on this subject.

Many thanks for your thoughts :bow: !

Whatever is 100% cotton is the only thing to use for patch material. Now I have used anything from T-shirts to canvas material. All depending on the thinkness I need/want. Pillow Ticking at .018 usually does a fine job for most people. A lot don't use over .010 or .015 for patches. I use a cotton duct at .024 for my hunting rifle.

 

[LaBonte]

Whatever is 100% cotton is the only thing to use for patch material.

With all due respect Swampy, but linen was more widely used in the 18th and early 19th Century than was cotton, so linen can be used successfully, but...
Good patch material is more determined by how tightly woven the material is and not so much what it's made of - as long as it's a natural fabric that is - tightly woven hemp works good too.
That tight weave is why pillow ticking is so widely used - plus it's relatively inexpensive, which linen is generally not.
So for quality (and price even though you said that didn't matter - my Scots blood talking :grin: ): pillow ticking, cotton canvas, cotton duck, denim, etc. works as good as you're going to get, so IMO there is no sense in using linen unless you want to be as "PC" as possible.
I have used linen (scraps from clothing projects), but my main go to patching is pillow ticking or cotton duck.
What's best? along with the ball size, lube, and load it all depends - try several combos and use whatever your gun likes best..
The above is based on 45+ years of shooting smoke poles and experimenting with all kinds of load combos......I never found linen or hemp to be any better than a cotton fabric os some type....

Of course then there's silk..:hmm: :thumbsup: :hmm:

 

[rabjr]

Whatever is 100% cotton is the only thing to use for patch material.

With all due respect Swampy, but linen was more widely used in the 18th and early 19th Century than was cotton, so linen can be used successfully, but...
Good patch material is more determined by how tightly woven the material is and not so much what it's made of - as long as it's a natural fabric that is - tightly woven hemp works good too.
That tight weave is why pillow ticking is so widely used - plus it's relatively inexpensive, which linen is generally not.
So for quality (and price even though you said that didn't matter - my Scots blood talking :grin: ): pillow ticking, cotton canvas, cotton duck, denim, etc. works as good as you're going to get, so IMO there is no sense in using linen unless you want to be as "PC" as possible.
I have used linen (scraps from clothing projects), but my main go to patching is pillow ticking or cotton duck.
What's best? along with the ball size, lube, and load it all depends - try several combos and use whatever your gun likes best..
The above is based on 45+ years of shooting smoke poles and experimenting with all kinds of load combos......I never found linen or hemp to be any better than a cotton fabric os some type....

Of course then there's silk..:hmm: :thumbsup: :hmm:

Well ya learn something new everyday.

I spelt cotton duck wrong, thats my main patch material.

And dammit I almost mentioned staying away from Silk for those extra 40 yards. :haha:

 

[LaBonte]

Swampy - Cotton was fairly expensive cloth compared to linen up until some years after the cotton gin was invented making it easier to prepare it for spinning and weaving.

One instance where linen and hemp is probably "superior" to cotton is when using the real thin patches since both fibers are "stronger/tougher" than cotton...And silk is stronger than all of them...

 

[MercerLake]

:v Linen is I believe woven from flax fibers and it is tough and doesn't seem to compress as readily as cotton. One linen tablecloth from an estate or yard sale makes an awful lot of patches at a reasonable cost. Wine or gravy stains don't hurt the shootability but sure reduce the price. I think that I paid about $2.00 for the last one I bought. :v

 

[MikeChapin]

...And silk is stronger than all of them...

And you can get an extra 40 yards out of them. :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

 

[Dphar]

A good cotton patch is just fine. I would prefer to use Linen but its hard to find. Linen was the preferred material back in the day.

Dan

 

[paulvallandigham]

The thread count per inch( weave), and the thickness, and uniformity of thickness are more important factors than whether the fabric is pure cotton, or some other natural plant fiber( ie. non-synthetic.) The problem I have found buying linen- new or used, is getting it the right thickness, and then finding- particularly in used linens-- a piece that is uniform in thickness.

I don't have that much trouble with flannel, pillow ticking, pocket drill, Cotton Duck, denim(except worn denim jeans) or any other fabric made of 100% cotton.

Linen was certainly used for patching, as the Flax plant produced abundant seeds that could yield a fine vegetable oil, in addition to the tough fibers that could be spun, and then woven to make fine cloth. Linen was very common in the 18th century, but expensive, because it was milled in England, and then shipped to the colonies. It took some time after our independence for good cotton to be grown in enough abundance, that Cotton finally became " King" of the fabric industry. Even then, the mills were then located in New England, and Southern Planters fought constantly with the Millers over the low price they paid for the cotton, and the much higher price they charged for cotton fabric.

It was NOT until the late 19th century that a real effort was made to put mills in the South, so that cotton could be produced cheaply, and made into cloth. Some historians argue that these later events is what truly made Cotton King, because of the huge impact the industry had on the Southern States' economy. Because their transportation costs were lower, they eventually drove the New England Mills out of business. Some say that is when the South Finally WON the Civil War. :hmm: :surrender: :thumbsup:

 

[mazo kid]

...... One linen tablecloth from an estate or yard sale makes an awful lot of patches at a reasonable cost. Wine or gravy stains don't hurt the shootability but sure reduce the price. I think that I paid about $2.00 for the last one I bought.

Yep, that's where I pick my linen up,table cloths or dish towels at yard sales are generally cheap, especially if torn or stained.

 

[jbwilliams3]

The best patches I’ve used so far came from a pair of linen dress pants that don’t fit anymore. It’s the only linen I’ve used for shooting patches as I normally use cheap or free ticking or some other good weave cotton material.

When I shoot these pants up (that sounds funny) I’ll be sad, but I can probably find some material that works just as well by checking out the goodwill. Old clothing that’s cheap or free is always a good source of material for me.

 

[JKPope]

This may invoke some comments from the experts, but I've used everything from precut/prelubed pillow patches (of various sizes), down to old cotton shirts that were just about ready for Good Will. As long as I'm 100% cotton with some type of natural lube, my T/C Hawken loads and shoots just fine. A "just before getting tight" load is what I look for so I can focus on shooting and not a sore thumb and hand.

 

[colmoultrie]

Just to throw another wrench into the mix, I believe it was Dillon who said that the best patch was thin buckskin. Has anyone tried that, and if so, what results did you get?

 

[Snow on the Roof]

...... One linen tablecloth from an estate or yard sale makes an awful lot of patches at a reasonable cost. Wine or gravy stains don't hurt the shootability but sure reduce the price. I think that I paid about $2.00 for the last one I bought.

Yep, that's where I pick my linen up,table cloths or dish towels at yard sales are generally cheap, especially if torn or stained.

Just how do you determine a table cloth or towel IS linen? Short of lighting fire to it, which could get you in hot water {pun intended} at an auction or yard sale?


John

 

[Jblk]

I don't know if linen is better than cotton, but I never had one burn through.I have used it for many years and find it very dependable.I've bought scraps from a bridal shop but most of the time I get a big pile of material at auction sales for a buck or two.I guess that it really doesn't make any difference what you use as long as it does the job.

 

[tg]

Leather patches work vetry well the trick is getting a bunch that is the same size, the flanks of a deer is what I tried also some Muskrat and nutria hide I tanned, I went back to cotton due to availability.

 

[pondoro]

I saw "linen" at a cloth store (not Wally-world, a real cloth store)that was "100% cotton"!! Apparently they wove cotton to make it look like linen. I didn't buy any. But I expect it would make a good patch material. My pistols prefer thin patches so linen, or fake linen, would fit better than pillow ticking, but so far I have only used 0.010" plain cotton.

 

[Snow on the Roof]

I don't know if linen is better than cotton, but I never had one burn through.I have used it for many years and find it very dependable.I've bought scraps from a bridal shop but most of the time I get a big pile of material at auction sales for a buck or two.I guess that it really doesn't make any difference what you use as long as it does the job.

How I determine if an unknown fabric is natural or synthetic is to burn it. A natural fiber burns into ash a man made fiber will melt. As all man made fibers are petroleum derivatives, as are plastics, when exposed to excessive heat they melt. So again when presented with an unknown fabric, which from the burn test is proven to be a natural fiber, how do you differ between say cotton and flax?


John

 

[Jblk]

John if I was in your situation I would go to a bridal shop and ask them for some scraps.Once you have seen linen its fairly easy to identify.When I was growing up the linen tablecloth,place mats and doilys were the Sunday best that adorned the table for the visitors.I am sure that you have a little old lady in the neighborhood that will be happy to show you some of her linen items,and she may even give you some to try for your project.

 

[paulvallandigham]

There is a different texture to the threads, and weave of true linen, compared to cotton. Linen has a " harder", smoother, surface, if that term can be applied to fabric.

Yes, there are very fine cottons out there. The best are made with Egyptian grown cottons. However, they still feel different than Linen. Linen comes from the Flax plant, while cotton is grown on its own plant. The fibers feel different, to the touch.

Don't be surprised in this day that some clerk in a fabric store does not know the difference between true linen, and cotton fabrics. :shocked2: :nono: :rotf: :thumbsup: