L & R Replacement Lock

[Mdl94]

I have a Traditions Kentucky kit gun in 50 cal that I put together about a year or more ago. I took it out to the range to put a few rounds thru it and quickly got frustrated. could not hit a thing as a result of the extreme delay from the trigger pull to the fire of the charge in the barrel. So I contacted another member of our local muzzleloader club (an avid flintlock shooter and rifle builder) and he came out to help me. after his first shot he even said "this aint right" so we started working on a few things. first the touch hole liner, we drilled out the liner to see it making it larger would help the delay, starting out at 1/16th; shoot, still lengthy delay; drill the next number size and shoot again as he had # bits to enlarge very incrementally as to not change too drastically and create a pressure loss situation with too large of a touch hole. We finally stopped drilling at #48; shoot again to see if it helped, no luck. Then we disassembled the lock to see if it was binding any where, polished everything we could; reassembled and checked for contact of the lock to the wood; all clear. I am using real black powder 4F in the pan, 3F main charge tried both GOEX and Swiss with Track of the Wolf flints. The local experts conclusion it is just a poor lock so my long winded story boils down to these questions 1. I would like to hear from someone that has purchased a replacement L&R lock and did it make a difference in your gun. 2. are you satisfied with the result you got. 3. would you do it again. Thank you in advance for your replies, I have learned a great deal from this forum, and I have been shooting percussion guns for over 40 years but really like the flintlocks! Thanks again!

 

[GregCSarver]

Hi. I've sent a number of TC and Lyman locks that were less than stellar to Brad Emig @ Cabin Creek Muzzleloading. Brad will fit one of his lifetime frizzens to your lock with no gap, he will polish the internals, balance the springs and bend the hammer for optimal strike if needed. All locks were vastly improved.

 

[Mdl94]

Thank you Greg, I will check into this, yet another possibility I had not thought of.

 

[Tom Compton]

Yes, yes and I have. Good results.

Some flintlock ailments are not just frizzen issues though that is the most common. Mass produced parts have tolerances that when assembled cause greater problems in lock geometry. Contact L&R directly they are a great resource and very helpful. Also, they sell direct.

 

[Sparkitoff]

I have 3 L&R flintlocks that are RPL, and previously had another on a rifle I sold. They are way better than the factory lock. The geometry is good, the frizzen is large, hardened properly and spark great. Strong, but balanced springs. On 2 of them I did some polishing, not because of a mechanical issue but a cosmetic one. With each rifle the RPL made a huge difference. I did open two vent-holes to get optimum performance. The others were good and just needed the better lock. I buy the flints from L&R. When I had a rifle made I used the L&R RPL lock not as a replacement but as a choice since I am now familiar with them, like the customer service and guarantee and have come to trust them.

 

[forty_caliber]

Just replaced the lock on my Lyamn (Investarms) GPR with the L&R #5. Still working on the finishing details but there is a tremendous difference in quality between factory and the replacement. L&R hands down winner. Don't regret spending the money at all.

The replacement required the removal of a quite a bit of wood in my case. The new lock is thicker. Take your time, use inletting black to show where you need to cut. I probably test fit 100 times or more sneaking up on it until I got it just right.

.40

 

[Eric Krewson]

The RPL locks are great sparkers, just keep in mind they are not a drop-in in most cases. I put one in a TC that required the barrel to be moved back, the lock bolt hole to be relocated, the bottom of the hook breech ground off to accommodate the new lock bolt, tons of wood removed to accommodate the main spring and other internals and shims glued in the lock inlet to fill the gap because the lock plate was smaller than a TC.

Unless you really love your rifle I wouldn't invest this kind of money in a Traditions, you will have way more in it than it is worth. It will still be worth about the same with the original lock or the L&R.

 

[smo]

Don’t overlook the flint... In my experiences with T/C & GPR Lyman factory locks, both performed well when clean and the flint was sharp and set properly.

Look at your flint length/width and try it both bevel up & down .. if you haven’t already.

I can’t speak to the replacement locks, but all I’ve heard on them was good.

 

[olskool]

one simple thing, different locks like to be charged different. some locks require a large dose of powder while others like a small amount away from the touch hole. just a thought,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

[rafterob]

You haven't really said where the problem lies. Are you getting a delay between the pan igniting and the charge going off, or is it a big delay from pulling the trigger till the pan goes off? Sounds like with your attempts to drill out the touch hole that it is a delay in igniting the charge. If that is the case, it is not the lock's problem. Could be there is a metal burr in the flash channel or something interrupting the flow of the primer charge to the main charge.

 

[Livbucks]

I had similar problems with a lock (not LR) and what I noticed is that the frizzen did not swing to the open. At least not willingly.
I removed the frizzen and polished the axle hub ends on both the lock and the frizzen too where the frizzen would swing with only the resistance of the spring acting on it.You want the frizzen to break away from the flint with the right pressure. Also polish the lobe that rubs the spring and put some lube there. Then experiment with flint up and flint down. Also the space from flint to frizzen. Once I tuned my lock it fires like a caplock. Im not kidding. Mind blowing fast.

 

[ord sgt]

While not a Traditions lock, I replaced a Dixie flint lock with one from L&R. This was on my first built rifle. I had no experince with flintlocks and money was an issue when purchasing parts for the build. The Dixie lock worked but screws holding the lock together wore down and worked loose constantly. Rather than using Locktite, I chose to replace the entire lock with a new piece.
I did have to open the lock mortice a little, even though L&R said it was a direct fit. The new lock works better. Good spark.

 

[bldtrailer]

You can get the traditions lock to spark way better buy filing the frizen spring to open easier and the frizen foot so it opens wider to allow using a larger flint . I have 2 Tenn. and kentucky (kit gun given as a xmas project ,saving for grandsons ,1 likes red)and I made the adjustments almost as reallable as my siles ALSO wipe face&pan,flint with 91% alcohal remove all oil(even from fingers)

and yes you need a GOOD flint (I knap my own texas flint BUT english or french will do) check to see if frizen is soft with a file (should not cut) putting a $200 doller lock on a $ 500 rifle might not be the best investment (new hard frizen $20) These are good barrels 1-66, trigger isn't, a good starter rifle

you could sell yours and add $ 200 and have a used GPR lyman or with alittle more cash TVA both up grades from Traditions (go to a shoot you may find a good used rifle at used prices)

 

[Mdl94]

You haven't really said where the problem lies. Are you getting a delay between the pan igniting and the charge going off, or is it a big delay from pulling the trigger till the pan goes off? Sounds like with your attempts to drill out the touch hole that it is a delay in igniting the charge. If that is the case, it is not the lock's problem. Could be there is a metal burr in the flash channel or something interrupting the flow of the primer charge to the main charge.

Delay in the pan going off to the main charge. After shooting another members flintlock mine does seem very slow, his is a siler so I understand my lock is not in the same league but should be better. We checked for breech material blockage with a light and did not see anything obvious but I have contacted another member who has a scope to get a better look.

 

[bldtrailer]

OK here's another thing your rifle has a patent breech you need to make sure powder settles all the way down (tap side or on ground settles powder) if you wipe you may be pushing crud/fouling into patent area (bore .50 patent area .30ish ) I like to use a cal under bore size .45 for 50 to wipe, the patch rides over fauling on way in twist to the right patch expands and pull crude out also wipe barrel with alcohal after loading feel for powder with vent pick (do the same every time)

 

[rafterob]

Since you have the CVA style breech, you can't really compare it to other flintlocks. If your pan is going off fine then the problem lies in the breech area. Blow in the barrel with your lips sealing on the barrel. You should get a good steady stream of air coming out the touch hole without a lot of resistance. Could be you had/have residual oil in that area. That can combine with fouling to create a tar-like substance that can wreak havoc on ignition.

 

[Livbucks]

I have a scraper that fits the breech and will run a patch under it and turn it to clean the area. Or spray a blast of Brakleen in the touchhole on occasion. Dont get Brakleen on your stock.

 

[anthonycrocker25]

I would like to comment that i have a cva kenturky 50 that i have replaceed with a L&R lock percussion and with alitte works with fitting it works fine and is my competition rifle.

 

[bldtrailer]

yes they are good shooters 1-66 round ball twist

 

[BadDaditood]

OK here's another thing your rifle has a patent breech you need to make sure powder settles all the way down (tap side or on ground settles powder) if you wipe you may be pushing crud/fouling into patent area (bore .50 patent area .30ish ) I like to use a cal under bore size .45 for 50 to wipe, the patch rides over fauling on way in twist to the right patch expands and pull crude out also wipe barrel with alcohal after loading feel for powder with vent pick (do the same every time)View attachment 63358View attachment 63347View attachment 63346

if it’s anything but the traditional breech pictured above I’m thinking a new lock won’t help.