Kids moving out..... eventually

[Tb54]

i got a couple kids that might actually move out in the next couple years. I’m thinking in terms of home defense.... or apartment defense, whatever the case may be. If they’re under the age of 21, they would be restricted from owning / possessing a pistol. What about a BP revolver? Since the ATF regulations differ between BP and modern firearms, would say, an 18 yr old be able to legally possess a BP revolver? And the other question on my mind would be loading it, and sealing it in such a way that it would reliably fire when needed, even if it had been loaded a while before?

 

[8 BORE]

I would re-consider using a bp pistol.
The caps may fall off or not on the nipple correctly. Teach them how to safely use and shoot a .22 cal. pistol first. Many drawbacks in using a muzzle loading gun for home defense.
Can they legally have a .22 in a home for self defense if under 21? Check your state laws. Pepper spray works well. A flare gun will stop a bad guy but be careful with that

 

[Griz44Mag]

BATFE will not allow an 18YO to BUY a handgun, the rules do not say they cannot have one... Check your state regs...
I got my first pistol at age 9 or 10, before the nanny state police took control.

 

[necchi]

thinking in terms of home defense....
What about a BP revolver?

That would depend entirely on local County, City and State law, as it does vary by region.
As far as loaded storage(?) Dry and climate controlled environments will lend a loaded BP revolver capable of firing for years.
Just don't keep it in the fridge,,

 

[Rat]

Unless they are expert in the use of, and the loading of, and maintaining a BP pistol, no. What's wrong with a short carbine?

 

[rodwha]

Unless they are expert in the use of, and the loading of, and maintaining a BP pistol, no. What's wrong with a short carbine?

Or a shotgun, which is both quite effective and legal for an adult.

 

[wzroberts]

rodwha, I'm thinking along the same lines. I don't know these young adults,their interests, or their future neighborhoods. I just know that a pump or semi-auto 12ga or 20ga shotgun is versatile enough to handle a variety of circumstances.

 

[necchi]

Or a shotgun, which is both quite effective and legal for an adult.

I just know that a pump or semi-auto 12ga or 20ga shotgun is versatile enough to handle a variety of circumstances.

Come`on guy's,, let's not turn this into another modern arms vs trad arms self-defense thread that get's locked.
Go back and read the topic and question.

 

[Zonie]

i got a couple kids that might actually move out in the next couple years. I’m thinking in terms of home defense.... or apartment defense, whatever the case may be. If they’re under the age of 21, they would be restricted from owning / possessing a pistol. What about a BP revolver? Since the ATF regulations differ between BP and modern firearms, would say, an 18 yr old be able to legally possess a BP revolver? And the other question on my mind would be loading it, and sealing it in such a way that it would reliably fire when needed, even if it had been loaded a while before?

Back in the mid 1800's, a cap & ball revolver was the best thing available for personal defence so they used them and lived (and died) because of their choice.

While they are great fun to shoot, they still leave a lot to be desired when it comes to life and death situations. Just recall that time you were going to shoot one of these and all you heard was a "click" as the hammer failed to fire the chamber.

As for ownership and use of cap & ball revolvers, your State's laws are the ones that count. Many States consider cap & ball revolvers to be handguns, subject to all of the laws that control ownership and use of modern guns.

Check your States laws and while your at it, think of something else that is more reliable for your home defense.

 

[rodwha]

Come`on guy's,, let's not turn this into another modern arms vs trad arms self-defense thread that get's locked.
Go back and read the topic and question.

If a BP arm can be proven to be reliable, such as mine have shown themselves to be when I use Rem #10 caps, then that’s potentially doable. But there are two things to consider. One is a single action revolver isn’t all that fast handling of a gun, and the other is that in many of these discussed situations it’s at home where the level of smoke must be unreal.

Now I figure that most situations just the threat of force alone is going to be enough to diffuse a typical situation, which would be theft. Most people just don’t want to be shot. It would have to be a very determined attacker, either on drugs, having psychological issues, or someone who is determined to bring harm that this won’t work so well on. So the gun alone or the firing of a single shot may well be all that’s needed.

The fact that being shot isn’t exactly a means to end an issue either. Sometimes people don’t realize they’ve been shot and continue. Sometimes they’re just determined or on something and don’t care. And sometimes just the thought that you’ve been shot is more than enough with one instance being fatal despite it being a starter pistol with a blank. A shotgun is much more forceful. The trauma is much more definitive leaving the bad guy less time to consider dastardly activities. No doubt a side by side BP version could be used but then it’s back to the smoke and likely twice as much per barrel.

And a .22 handgun is still a handgun under every jurisdiction. You’d be setting your child up for time behind bars considering such.

 

[Tb54]

Shotgun is the first choice, but it’s a long gun, two handed operation for most. Just wondering if anyone had found a way to keep a loaded revolver reliable. Thanks.

 

[rodwha]

Shotgun is the first choice, but it’s a long gun, two handed operation for most. Just wondering if anyone had found a way to keep a loaded revolver reliable. Thanks.

I had loaded my NMA, as usual after cleaning, and moved finding myself far from an outdoor shooting range so it took me a bit over 4 years to make the over an hour (one way) drive to a range and found my gun shot all 6 reliably and with what seemed like the same authority as always using Triple 7 powder and with the same caps that were placed on the nipples long ago. And I live in central Texas where humidity is an issue.

Ultimately I feel one needs to go to the range enough to see for themselves just how reliable their loads in their gun(s) are, especially if you feel you’d be relying on it yourself.

But I also must say that I feel, much like with hunting, that the projectile and powder choices are critical. The powder needs to be one of the few energetic ones available and the projectile should have a wide meplat as expansion isn’t garaunteed. It’s why I chose to make my own designs using Accurate Molds. If you don’t want a wide flat meplat a ball is OK, and better than a RN or pointy design. But none do what a wide meplat will do, and a HP even more if you want to go through the hassle of that in a cap n ball design.

 

[Rat]

Well, again, a VERY experienced BP revolver shooter could get by just fine, using one for self defense. Gun nutz like us who shoot often, and experiment with this and that and the other thing. Without true expertise, no. And having shot one, having loaded one, been to the range with dad and plinked with them, does not qualify as expertise. A BP revolver in the hands of the inexperienced would be a very poor choice for self defense. Would probably be easier to teach one the basic elements of using a sword, and use that for self defense, (unless the perp has a gun) rather than the intricate workings, cleaning, care, malfunction drills, and the loading of the BP revolver. !!!

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

I would re-consider using a bp pistol.
The caps may fall off or not on the nipple correctly. Teach them how to safely use and shoot a .22 cal. pistol first. Many drawbacks in using a muzzle loading gun for home defense.
Can they legally have a .22 in a home for self defense if under 21? Check your state laws. Pepper spray works well. A flare gun will stop a bad guy but be careful with that

Yeah, get your kids a flare gun for home defense folks! What a genius idea!

 

[drobs]

I was thinking about this topic recently myself. Thinking I might outfit my 2 nephews and niece with C&B revolvers. 1 nephew is in college, the other nephew is going next year, and my niece has 2 more years of High School. All 3 are math geniuses, good at sports, and all around good church going kids. I know the younger nephew is interested in shooting and has asked about trying a certain commonly available handgun that I happened to have a couple of.

In the next year - I plan to get them all out shooting either at my place in Missouri or near their place in Michigan. Will definitely put a C&B revolver in their hands to start then work our way up to modern day pistols and rifles.

Planting seeds... I sent the 3 kids Mora Bushcraft Black Knives for Christmas this year. The knives have a sharpening stone built into the sheaf + a fire steel starter. I probably should've found a pink one for the niece but she'll get over it.

 

[TNGhost]

Shotgun is the first choice, but it’s a long gun, two handed operation for most. Just wondering if anyone had found a way to keep a loaded revolver reliable. Thanks.

Remember as well that a muzzleloading shotgun can legally be "cut off" to what ever length you desire, and then you have the "howdah" type double barreled smoothbore pistols too.

I have a double percussion shotgun I have left loaded from hunting season to hunting season (basically a year) with no ill effects. (just remember it is loaded, and I tag it to that purpose). As far as reliability, cap and ball revolvers can be left loaded indefinitely as well, when loaded properly, and they can be relatively reliable and made more so:

http://www.theopenrange.net/articles/Tuning_the_Pietta_Part_One.pdf

http://www.theopenrange.net/articles/Tuning_the_Pietta_Part_Two.pdf

They can also be very accurate and are powered in the range of a .380-mid range .38 Special. Plenty for defense. Bill Hickock found them very useful, but he was very practiced, and if you are going to use one for self defense, there will be much more to learn and practice than with a modern hand gun to become sufficiently proficient. That is the major difference between modern and blackpowder arms, and when it comes to self defense, familiarity and proficiency is everything. You can't expect just to throw one in the dresser drawer and call it good. Thorough and regular training is paramount.

Also as mentioned check any applicable local laws. Many areas treat blackpowder handguns as regular firearms for the purpose of carry and self defense.

 

[rodwha]

They can also be very accurate and are powered in the range of a .380-mid range .38 Special. Plenty for defense.

Using Swiss, Olde E, or T7 and those numbers go way up. My NMA and custom conical is likely within the lower realm of .45 ACP/Schofield levels of performance, and the .36 can become akin to a .38 Spl +P. Even the Colt Police Model, loaded with said powder and a custom 100 grn conical was shown to produce low end .380 performance.

 

[Tb54]

Remember as well that a muzzleloading shotgun can legally be "cut off" to what ever length you desire, and then you have the "howdah" type double barreled smoothbore pistols too.

.

Awesome! That’s the kind of info I was fishin for! Yes, local laws trump, but I’m friends of the local sheriff and will ask him pertinent questions next time I see him at church. My oldest boy (Colton Samuel) will be getting a ‘60 Army .44–of course. I have a ‘58 Rem already. I’ll be considering the sawed off BP shotgun as well. My daughter will get one loaded with “pig lead” fluxed with bacon grease... for the Muslim boys around here.

 

[Pete G]

Just wondering if anyone had found a way to keep a loaded revolver reliable.

Hiccock would reload with a fresh charge every night,

 

[Tb54]

Andplusalso...

Racking the slide of a pump shotgun is a warning sound everyone recognizes...

The 4-click sound of a BP revolver being cocked, though not as loud, is just as businesslike I think.