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I just received this from Estes Rockets about the GOEX plant!!!!!!!!!

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I am just glad that GOEX is still being made in America and here in Louisiana - hopefully safely and at a profit that will allow the company to make decisions like providing free or discounted youth powder based on good business judgment. That decision can be made only if the company can make the endeavor workable in the first place.

Anyhow, glad GOEX will be back.
 
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They are about to find everything in life is not free and that they need to prioritize. They will find a job (hopefully) to subsidize their social life, buy clothes and save toward their education. They will discover other interests and there may not be any time for the shooting sports but hopefully the seeds planted will produce. There will be an education, career and family to start but when the pressure has relented somewhat perhaps they will remember the fun they had shooting black powder with their friends.
Very true, but if you check on the purpose and the guidelines of the 4H Shooting program, one of the stated things the Leader is supposed to do , is to teach them the cost of the sport, and help them make decisions.
I'm acquainted with a few of the 4H shooting sports leaders around here, and none of them run a shake down operation on suppliers. They have the kids earn their own money for the basics.
 

Ray-Vigo

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Powder shortages are a long and well-honored tradition in the US, as is obtaining gunpowder from Europe. What's old is new, as they say.

 
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Give it time. It will be a year before Goex is on the shelves and it will take longer than that to get established and build up a surplus before Goex can donate to charities.

Very true and given the startup costs (rebuilding, insurance, wages & benefits, etc.) against no income for nearly a year I wouldn't blame them for not feeling too charitable till they see a significant cash flow back into the coffers.
 
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Nope. It looks like you're in the minority who think getting kids on the range and introducing them to muzzleloading is a worthless effort. There is a reason this hobby has been declining and it all comes back to kids. They don't learn any history about our ancestors and if they do, it's going to be poisoned with political correctness. Couple that with your attitude and muzzleloaders are going to be a very small part of shrinking shooting sports that are vilified in the mass media. You're either part of the solution or part of the problem. There is no middle ground anymore.
Dave51
I’m curious what is needed to keep a club supplied? I didn’t know these clubs exist; how many are there? They shoot flintlocks or modern inline rifles? Are there scheduled events? Nice thing to be able to dedicate your time to.
 
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Very true, but if you check on the purpose and the guidelines of the 4H Shooting program, one of the stated things the Leader is supposed to do , is to teach them the cost of the sport, and help them make decisions.
I'm acquainted with a few of the 4H shooting sports leaders around here, and none of them run a shake down operation on suppliers. They have the kids earn their own money for the basics.
I see your point and agree.
 

dave951

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Dave51
I’m curious what is needed to keep a club supplied? I didn’t know these clubs exist; how many are there? They shoot flintlocks or modern inline rifles? Are there scheduled events? Nice thing to be able to dedicate your time to.
There's 4H and Scouts. In the case of 4H, they don't recognize any Instructor cert but their own. However, some clubs do quite a bit of shooting BUT generally, a Scout camp will see far more kids. Camps differ but they all recognize the NRA/NMLRA Instructor cert.

So keeping a club supplied, that depends on what they're doing, how much shooting, and how many kids. In our case dealing with Scouts, we shoot everything from PRB to Minies so we use #11s, musket caps, Scheutzen 3f and lots of lead. The key here is to get involved and help the existing programs improve and by that, get more kids wanting to come shoot. When our method is compared to the conventional stuff, kids invariably want to shoot with us. The key is to publicize and get known. Case in point, there's a camp fairly near me that has a decent program. However, the program is divided into 1hr slots each day with a limited number of kids per hour. Think a standard school type of schedule. How much do you think you're going to get done in one hour per day with the kids? Next, that same program sticks with only PRB. The kids load at a loading table, carry the rifle to the line where they sit down and shoot from sandbags. How much marksmanship do you really think gets taught?

Contrast that with what we do, and granted, ours is instructor intensive and we can only work with a number of kids based on our instructor numbers. We start with a safety brief, a quick hands on history lesson and demonstrations, and then dive right into shooting and all shooting is offhand. The targets are all reactive and varying in difficulty so if the kids want to hit the more challenging targets, they'll have to absorb some of the marksmanship techniques we teach while they're having fun.

Cost for what we do, assuming the guns are available already, for 6 sessions of about 14 kids per session, is about $500 for the summer. I know some insist on the kids funding this but this is in a Scout camp setting. They're already paying to be in the camp and the camp helps to defray the costs.

Bottom line is if you don't get involved, the decline will only continue and folks will come here and complain about it while doing nothing. Like I've heard it said, "we have met the enemy and they is us"
 
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Interesting next i see my neighbor he’s scout master I’m going ask if they have anything going. Thanks!
As a former Scout leader for 17 years, help was always appreciated!
Also, NRA Rifle Instructor, and ran .22 shooting events at Camp Strake.
Sounds like an opportunity to share your knowledge and experience! :thumb:
Let us know how this works out!
 

dave951

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A couple pix from the two camps we worked this summer-

The "history" lesson. Vinny is showing his Ferguson and explaining how it works. On the table are two percussion rifles and an original 1869 rolling block. Camp Bud Schiele
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"Teddy" in USMC period uniform and myself instructing with "Zouave" muskets. Camp Bud Schiele.
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We've cleared the table of all the PRB stuff and I'm starting into a discussion of loading minies. On the loading table is a container of 50cal minie rounds. I'm holding "Susie" my sewerpipe on a stick CVA. It will shoot pretty tight with those minies. Camp Raven Knob.
IMG_9439.jpg


"Flintlock" Bob (@PathfinderNC) demonstrating flintlock pistols. Camp Raven Knob.
362243970_3118778031760118_5981797662766258065_n.jpg


And the motley crew of instructors at Camp Raven Knob. LtoR Flintlock Bob (our own @PathfinderNC), myself and Charlie aka "Teddy" or "Mr President"
IMG_9575.jpg
 

Blitz

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Is it the local folks in Arlington supporting the youth or is the support coming directly from across the pond?

I will continue to buy Goex, it is American made using U.S. raw materials. Goex is paying taxes here to support the U.S., local, state and federal needs. Revenue made here by Swiss goes back across the pond, it does not stay here to support our economy.

Why is Swiss delivered to Canada, where it is unloaded, bypassing the unloading by U.S. stevedores and warehousing when unloaded?

Insight would be appreciated.
I would hazard to say it`s most likely to do it that way, would you make a guiess as to what country is responsible for that.
I would immagine import duties are paid to enter the U. S. of A. as well as Canada.
What reason to levee a tax on a product not being made here, who are they competing with? It certainly has not been lower prices driving domestic makers out of business
 

Johnny Tremain

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I was a rocketeer in the 60s, a lot of my paper route money went to Estes.
Sure glad 50 years later I can still give them money.
So where's the beef?
 
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