I have a .610 caliber trade gun.

[Texas Gil]

Want to test accuracy with patched RBI’s.
normally I use .600 RBI’s leather on top of ball and leather on powder.
get normal accuracy at 50 yds of 6 to 9in groups.
planning on using lubed .010 patch for a very snug fit at the bore.
My normal 2f load is 120 Gr. Using leather wads over/under ball.
Now with a tight patched ball I’m thinking I need to drop down on the powder charge?
Where should I start with 2f ? Goex
Where should I start with 3 f ? OE

 

[Historian]

For heavy loads stay with 2Fg and lighter loads of 90 grains or under go with 3Fg. You might try patching the ball too. I too use leather as OP wads and over shot wads.

 

[Texas Gil]

Yes I am patching with .010 wonder lube patch. No wads. Going to try 70 Gr 3f.
Looking for better 50 yd groups

 

[Texas Gil]

Just read your post again. So are you using over and under leather wads and patching the ball?

 

[Brokennock]

Yes I am patching with .010 wonder lube patch. No wads. Going to try 70 Gr 3f.
Looking for better 50 yd groups

I get good results in one of my 20 gauge guns with 65 grains 3f, but my ball/patch combo is looser. That gun does not like tight load combos m, it shoots even better with the ball between wads, either 65 grains 3f or 80 grains 3f or 2f.
The other shoots a .600 ball and .010 patch well at 80 grains 3f. I am currently working on a lighter load though. It is a very light gun and 80 grains 3f kicks pretty hard in such a light gun. Also, trying to reduce powder usage given the powder situation.

Just as a note, my load development testing is off a bench. I've found several loads for both guns that shoot very well at 25 yards. But, determining which of those is "the" load is done at 50 yards. Any load that won't group in 4 to 6 inches at 50 yards is rejected.

 

[Texas Gil]

Agree with your thinking. I’m using 120 Gr 2f Goex in my current best load with over and under leather wads. It’s ok but not where I want to be. I see the 50 yd group as the test of a smoothie. Others seem to get 4 in 50 Yd groups. Seems always with patched balls. So I’m going try it out and maybe get descent groups and reduce my powder consumption at the same time. I’ll soon see!

 

[Brokennock]

Seems always with patched balls.

I think that this is usually the case because it is what people are familiar with and so is what they try. But, patched ball isn't always the best out of a smoothbore. And tighter isn't always better,,,, with a smoothbore muzzleloader.

Patched ball,

This is about the best I ever got this gun to shoot patched ball,,,, at the time, I hadn't tried going lower than I think 75 grains, still believing that a smoothbore needs extra power amd ball speed to achieve and maintain accuracy. (Another gun I have of the same bore i.d. shoots a p.r.b. quite well,,, at 80 grains powder)
Note that the looser ball and patch combo shot better.

Based on posts by folks like George and the fact that this gun was shooting the looser patched ball better, I decided to try wads.

Tolerable. Maybe making some headway.


Now we are getting somewhere. Not sure the distance of this target. I am thinking 25 yards still.
I should note that all loads tried were shooting high, to very high. I wanted a good grouping load before I started filing the rear site to bring the group down.

Obviously more shots were taken after the notes were written in the various points of aim. There are 3 shots across just above the orange bullseye and one next to it all taken holding at the point labeled "shots 3&4."
After filing the rear sight the gun now shoots groups like that, to that spot, holding just inside the bottom of the 8 ring.

All of that was a few years ago.
Since then, I tried to develop a load using less powder to try and fall within the rules of a local club's woodswalk rules.
I found that at 65 grains of 3f I can get those same groups, only printing about 2 inches lower (which I actually like better) at 50 yards,,,,, with a .595 ball and .010 patch, or my .610 ball wad sandwich (tow or lubed felt), or, at 25 yards (didn't try 50) a .595 ball in a paper cartridge.

 

[Texas Gil]

Thanks for this detailed info. Just gave me hope for some better results with lighter loads. I’m getting tired of the recoil with 120 Gr loads to tell the truth.
Interesting that a looser load worked so well. Thanks again it took a lot of work putting it together

 

[Brokennock]

You're welcome.
Unfortunately the only way to get the data needed to determine the best load for any given gun, is to burn a lot of powder. Something our current situation makes painfull.