I found this set at a small gun shop, What is it? a factory set or a special issue? Or???

[Redlemur60]

Dang nice place to start ,holy moly!

 

[Kowalsk1]

Thank you, do you know how to tell what caliber the rifle is?

Nice sight on the rifle.

 

[Grenadier1758]

Thank you, do you know how to tell what caliber the rifle is?

There may be a stamping on the barrel. The other way is to use a vernier caliper with inside jaws. If you have an even number of lands, measure from land to land to determine the bore diameter. A ball 0.010" less in diameter will reflect the caliber of the barrel. It's a bit more difficult to determine the caliber if the barrel has an odd number of lands. No matter how the barrel is marked, it is best to measure the diameter of the bore to determine the size of the ball to use and to measure the diameter of grooves to determine groove depth for selecting a patch thickness.

A machine shop could measure the land-to-land bore diameter with great precision using pin gauges. If there is a traditional muzzle loading gun club near you, the members will have the equipment to measure the bore.

 

[larry58v]

Three bills for each pistol minimum, new. That's $1200 right there. No idea on the rifle but I reckon at least $500, easy. Flasks and such, the rest of the little stuff, likely a couple hundred more counting what you mentioned but that isn't pictured. Then you have a custom fitted case, the value of which is at least a couple hundred more if not more than that. I feel like I'm being pretty conservative here on these estimates. You had a very good friend indeed. I do know that if you took that to my local range and popped it open you'd get a crowd.

Thank you for your input, I'm trying to get my wife to go to the range today and test fire these weapons, I'm going to guess that 30 grams of 3F should be adequate for each pistol and 60 grams of 2F for a starting point with the rifle. How does that sound to you?

 

[larry58v]

Where in Idaho... several clubs around... I am in the panhandle.... Most any of us would be happy to share knowledge with you first hand,..

I'm down in Nampa, just about 15 miles West of Boise. Thank you for any help and advice you can give me.
Larry

 

[larry58v]

There may be a stamping on the barrel. The other way is to use a vernier caliper with inside jaws. If you have an even number of lands, measure from land to land to determine the bore diameter. A ball 0.010" less in diameter will reflect the caliber of the barrel. It's a bit more difficult to determine the caliber if the barrel has an odd number of lands. No matter how the barrel is marked, it is best to measure the diameter of the bore to determine the size of the ball to use and to measure the diameter of grooves to determine groove depth for selecting a patch thickness.

A machine shop could measure the land-to-land bore diameter with great precision using pin gauges. If there is a traditional muzzle loading gun club near you, the members will have the equipment to measure the bore.

Thank you, I'm still looking for my gauge, It is one of those things that have decided to hide from me lately.. Gosh getting old is fun.

 

[larry58v]

Sorry it took so long to get back. the number 575 is the bullet diameter and 213 is the weight in grains. It's for a 58 caliber gun.

Thank you so very much. I have a book (very old) that came with the set it is a "Handbook of cast bullets by Lyman Gun Sight Corp. with a copyright date of July 1958 and I have had much luck figuring out what the numbers mean in it as yet. It is going to take me awhile to read this and to understand enough to make sense of it. Once again, thank you for all your assistance. Larry V. Nampa Idaho.

 

[larry58v]

You did very well, especially in the steel frame revolvers. I was also going to say the mold sounds like a 575 Mine' bullet. As others have indicated, the case was most likely built by the previous owner and not a special issue.

I can send you some handouts on how to load a rifle or single-shot pistol if you like plus one on muzzleloader "Dos and Don'ts". Otherwise, there are plenty of YouTube videos, some by well-known experts like Mike Belevue and Mark Humphries.

Try and locate a ML club in your area. You'll find many seasoned shooters there. Most are willing to take a newbie and help them on their way. There are classes out there. When we do them, we only charge for the cost of materials. Others want $250!

Lastly, head the warning below my signature!

Good Luck, welcome to the fold, and congratulations on an awesome gun store find!

Walt

Absolutely, I need all the help I can get, do you want to mail them? or email.. If email, mine is [email protected] and I'm here in Nampa Idaho.

 

[larry58v]

View attachment 131769early Turner Kirkland View attachment 131768

The stamping on my rifle looks just like that, just above the stock near the breech is a stamp that says Made in Belgium. But I can't find a single indicator of the caliber. I am getting the idea that it is a .58 caliber from the sizing information on the Mini-ball mould that came with it, And I have to say that looking down the bore it looks like a tunnel that you could crawl down. I know it is unloaded but it is a heck of a view from the working end. I wonder if I can find a caliber marking under the stock? what do you think. by the way, nice old CJ4? in the photo.

 

[flntlokr]

Nice score! Wow, is all I can say. Don't be afraid to ask questions. Never load the rifle directly from those flasks. You will need to learn how to load, how NOT to dry ball, patches, lube, cleaning. Believe me, dry balling is not fun, (forgot to add powder before the patch/ball). The best of us have done it. You will find that 3fg works best in a 40 caliber rifle, and the pistols as well. That peep sight doesn't look cheap. We have many old salts on this forum that have been around the block a time or two.

Forgive my manners, welcome to the forum. You will be hooked! This is one addiction that is better than drugs!

Find a local club, and introduce yourself. Get some one-on-one instruction on how to use those guns from folks who know how. Our club offers a morning-long course to intriduce new shooters, which includes a couple of hours of shooting under individual supervision. I am sure some other clubs do the same; it's worthwhile so you won't end up damaging the guns, your neighbours, or yourself.

 

[BadDaditood]

My sister just joined a nice range near Caldwell… can’t recall name of it
The loads you mentioned are fairly stout, I’d have you start off with 15 gn pistol and 40 gn in rifle.
One fun advantage of loading each shot is each can be different.
My granddaughter can shoot my Hawken with 30 gns, next shot her big brother can load 100 gns

 

[hrt4me]

when you first mentioning getting a 'box' of black powder muzzleloading guns, I had no idea the presentation case was so nice

 

[Capnball]

Thank you, do you know how to tell what caliber the rifle is?

Wow, love, love ,love the fitted case. It soothes my OCD.

 

[painter]

Thank you for your input, I'm trying to get my wife to go to the range today and test fire these weapons, I'm going to guess that 30 grams of 3F should be adequate for each pistol and 60 grams of 2F for a starting point with the rifle. How does that sound to you?

Change grams to grains, and you'll be close.

 

[Grenadier1758]

Thank you for your input, I'm trying to get my wife to go to the range today and test fire these weapons, I'm going to guess that 30 grams of 3F should be adequate for each pistol and 60 grams of 2F for a starting point with the rifle. How does that sound to you?

I'm sure you meant to be using grains of powder not grams. I'd take it easy on the initial charges and use 20 to 25 grains measured by volume for the revolvers. 60 grains for the rifle too.

 

[BP Addict]

Absolutely, I need all the help I can get, do you want to mail them? or email.. If email, mine is [email protected] and I'm here in Nampa Idaho.

I can email them, Larry. I'll try and get them out tomorrow.

Walt

 

[kaotikross]

I'm sure you meant to be using grains of powder not grams. I'd take it easy on the initial charges and use 20 to 25 grains measured by volume for the revolvers. 60 grains for the rifle too.

yep- this, 100%. you can always pull a charge but you can't generally weld a broken gun back together. Not that I'm saying they're in any way unsafe, they look perfectly fine, just go easy on a few initial loads, just in case.

 

[DuncNZ]

Thank you for your input, I'm trying to get my wife to go to the range today and test fire these weapons, I'm going to guess that 30 grams of 3F should be adequate for each pistol and 60 grams of 2F for a starting point with the rifle. How does that sound to you?

You have to be careful with that conversion . I have used Metric for most of my life but when it comes to firearm ammunition and loads I only think in Imperial measurement's.
There are 7000 grains in a pound or 454 grams so there are approx 15.42 grains in a gram or 925 grains in 60 grams . There are 437.5 grains in an ounce and 27.35 grains in a dram (1/16 th oz )
I was at the range one day and a guy was sighting in his .243 unmentionable with new handloads , it did not sound right , I asked what he was using and he said 46 grains of X powder . I pulled one of his rounds and sure enough there were 46 granules of powder in the case , he had counted out 46 granules 50 times to load his ammo .

 

[larry58v]

You have to be careful with that conversion . I have used Metric for most of my life but when it comes to firearm ammunition and loads I only think in Imperial measurement's.
There are 7000 grains in a pound or 454 grams so there are approx 15.42 grains in a gram or 925 grains in 60 grams . There are 437.5 grains in an ounce and 27.35 grains in a dram (1/16 th oz )
I was at the range one day and a guy was sighting in his .243 unmentionable with new handloads , it did not sound right , I asked what he was using and he said 46 grains of X powder . I pulled one of his rounds and sure enough there were 46 granules of powder in the case , he had counted out 46 granules 50 times to load his ammo .

Well, that wasn't me, but it sounds like something I might consider. LOL.

 

[larry58v]

My sister just joined a nice range near Caldwell… can’t recall name of it
The loads you mentioned are fairly stout, I’d have you start off with 15 gn pistol and 40 gn in rifle.
One fun advantage of loading each shot is each can be different.
My granddaughter can shoot my Hawken with 30 gns, next shot her big brother can load 100 gns

I'd like to know the name if you happen to remember it, I'm in Nampa an d not that far from the Caldwell area. Thanks for the advice.