How fast does a 50 cal PRB need to be for deer?

Discussion in 'Traditional Muzzleloader Hunting' started by brewer12345, Jun 8, 2019.

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  1. Jun 8, 2019 #1

    brewer12345

    brewer12345

    brewer12345

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    I was fooling around with PRB in my TC Hawken today and found that if I use an over powder wad I can go up to 75 grains of Black MZ with very good accuracy at 50 yards. My vision doesn't permit me to really see what I could possibly do with the load at 100, so lets assume the farthest shot I might take with this load is 75 yards (and most likely would be insider 50). I believe the ball is doing about 1500 FPS out of the muzzle. Enough for deer? I would be looking at white tails, mostly.
     
  2. Jun 8, 2019 #2

    Walkingeagle

    Walkingeagle

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    At 75 yds your load will flatten the biggest of bucks, no worries sir.
    Walk
     
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  3. Jun 8, 2019 #3

    brewer12345

    brewer12345

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    Thanks, Walk. I kind of figured as much. The doe I took last fall was with a 200 grain cast bullet out of my .30-06 that was doing maybe 1900 FPS out of the muzzle. She basically did a "donut" and turfed it within 15 yards of where she was hit and that bullet probably took half or more of its energy with it on the way out of the rib cage to parts unknown. I'd imagine the PRB would make a bigger hole and probably dump more of its energy into the target.
     
  4. Jun 9, 2019 #4

    azmntman

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    How fast does a 50 cal PRB need to be for deer?

    twice as fast as the deer:D
     
  5. Jun 9, 2019 #5

    Walkingeagle

    Walkingeagle

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    Heavy, slow and large hunks of lead have been effectively taking game for 400 years. Believe it or not, but a 75gr charge behind a .490 prb would have been considered a rather heavy charge 150-200 years ago.
    Walk
     
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  6. Jun 9, 2019 #6

    brewer12345

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    I believe it. Powder was a scarce commodity in many cases, a lot of those guys were market hunters so efficiency mattered, and deer are not that hard to kill.

    Elk are hard to kill, though. For that I worked up a load this morning based on a 375 grain 54 conical and 100 grains of powder. Cloverleafs at 50 yards, which is about the best I have ever done with open sights at that range. If I can get close enough in September...
     
  7. Jun 9, 2019 #7

    azmntman

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    I've cleanly killed several cow elk with .54 PRB and 80 gr. Have used conicals too and truly believe there is no benefit in the "knock down" dept. If I had a rifle that shot conicals better I might use em but for me PRB is all I use for elk. I would hunt with my .58 for bull, they seem to have a lot more will to live and endurance.
     
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  8. Jun 9, 2019 #8

    SDSmlf

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    At 75 yards with a 50 caliber round ball over 75 grains of BP no deer will travel more than 100 yards with a well placed shot. Likely less than 50. Have harvested deer with smaller calibers and less powder. Personally, have a preference for larger caliber ((58 or 62), but have still cleanly taken a couple of deer with a 45 caliber Cherokee the past few years. Why? Because I can and it works.
     
  9. Jun 9, 2019 #9

    brewer12345

    brewer12345

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    I am edging in that direction. That said, this particular rifle shoots the conicals so well I decided it was the way to go for this year.
     
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  10. Jun 9, 2019 #10

    BrownBear

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    For nigh onto 20 years my wife has been shooting 60 grains of 3f in her short 54 cal, holding her shots to 50 yards or so. We've never recovered a single ball. Only light load experience I have with 50 cal is my sweet little Pedersoli Frontier Carbine which loves 70 grains of 3f. Whacked several deer with it out to 75 yards, and never recovered a ball or had to chase down a long blood trail. I'd say your 75 grains from a longer barrel is in a league, and probably even better. If deer can be d
     
  11. Jun 9, 2019 #11

    Griz44Mag

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    I magnetospeeded my .54 PRB last weekend with 70gr real black.
    They are running 1668fps. The same charge on a 50 cal would be even faster.
    Last year, at 93 yards the 54 cal with 70 grains did a clean pass through a large buck, completely severing a rib on the way in and taking large chunks of bone out of 2 ribs going out the other side. I found bits of bone and lung more than 10 yards on the exit side. I never found the ball.
    That 70 gr charge with your 50 cal will do quite nicely for any deer you are going to find in North America.
     
  12. Jun 9, 2019 #12

    Grimord

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    I agree that your 75 grain charge is more than adequate for deer hunting. I have a question. Are you using standard percussion caps to ignite the load of Black MZ? I have never used this substitute, as I prefer flintlocks that require real black, but I have heard that Black MZ requires a higher temperature ignition source to ignite. Do you get any hang fires?
     
  13. Jun 9, 2019 #13

    brewer12345

    brewer12345

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    I use percussion caps and don't have any issues at all with hangfires. I actually started using this stuff because it is available at my local sportsmans warehouse for ten bucks a pound. Since I get good accuracy with it and it seems to be relatively clean, I don't have much reason to switch powders except that I have read it is less energetic than real black or substitutes.
     
  14. Jun 9, 2019 #14

    Sparkitoff

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    My State allows airgun hunting for big-game. I have seen many whitetail deer shot with a .50 caliber ball that left the muzzle between 700-950 FPS. I don't know the velocity at 50, 75 or 100-yards but I have seen deer killed at all of those ranges with this "slow" velocity. You are exceeding those velocities by quite a bit!
     
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  15. Jun 9, 2019 #15

    Grimord

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    That is good to know in case I ever run out of, or can't get real black. Hope that never happens cause I truly love shooting my flint locks. I plan to stock up on some real black for the future.
     
  16. Jun 9, 2019 #16

    Rudyard

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    That's some air gun ,Air gun & rifles of large bore are historically found .But I never saw a modern maker produce one of that bore .But the 22 sorts are impressive if hardly traditional . A friend in Indiana John Hakes made a Austrian ?Military rifle now I recall, but not seen others. No real reason why a skilled artisan couldnt make one (.We Muzzle loaders are a pretty creative lot .)

    .One word though of caution a late friend acquired an air Rifle by Stoudenmeyer a fine & noted maker. But he hydrolicked it using oil. He was demonstrating it at a clay shoot whenapon it diesiled and blew off his right hand ,sent part of the reservouir through his chest and left him with the two smallest fingers of his left hand .
    But It didn't put him off ,I made him a left hand flintlock 12 bore and he was such a proficient he shot twice at the Internationals for the UK at Bisley , then the first US Matches held at Quantico Marine base. In 1981 from memory. I went over just to watch and there met Don Getz, Willis Boitnot and Hershal House Who I recall gave me a cloth patch 'Corps of Kentucky riflemen 'Among other noteable's I was later to better know .( I did' Do' 16 NMLRA' Easterns' other regional R vous 'and a raft of Fairs, Feasts, and Re enactments ) And married at Fort Ti F&I Grand encampment 1999. Did manage ' Death of Lord Howe' , a Culloden, Fort 4 Johnstons Hall , & one last Eastern .But along came children and that stopped my gallup !. What a waffle ! Regards Rudyard
     
  17. Jun 9, 2019 #17

    brewer12345

    brewer12345

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    Nobody seems to sell real black locally. I ordered a pound on line, but have just begun to fool with it.
     
  18. Jun 9, 2019 #18

    mushka

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    Brewer, I order my bp from Graf & Son. I think a 5 lb minimum but they only charged me about eight bucks for shipping and handling. There was no hazmat. You might look in to their site.
     
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  19. Jun 9, 2019 #19

    brewer12345

    brewer12345

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    Yeah, I got a pound of Olde Eynesford in an order of primers from powder valley. Shot a little bit of it yesterday, but was mostly there to tune up some hunting loads with Black MZ, so I really did not have enough time to put the OE through its paces. If I get good results next time out (especially with round ball loads), I will order a bunch. Still, hard to beat a low fouling, less corrosive alternative that I can buy locally for ten bucks a pound.
     
  20. Jun 13, 2019 #20

    Sidney Smith

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    I load 80 grains of 2fg behind a 226 grain patched RB in my .54 cal Lancaster rifle. I've killed two deer with it so far. One ran approx 150 yards then dropped, the other dropped in its tracks. Both deer were does and both were shot at a similar distance of around 35 to 40 yards. Both were pass through shots. It's all in how you hit them. Put one in the boiler with a light load it will probably drop. Hit it somewhere else and it might run or might never drop. The same can be said for a heavier load.
     

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