How Corrosive Is Black Powder?

[TNGhost]

A very interesting analytical experiment on various powders, including black and different priming (cap) compounds.

It would seem the heavier the black powder fouling in your favorite smokepole is, the less likely it is to rust. Who'd a thought?

 

[Britsmoothy]

Already know....its not as bad as most believe.
Corrosive primers are far worse.

 

[EC121]

Dry black powder by itself is not corrosive, but if left in a bore long enough, burnt black powder fouling can draw moisture. Not overnight but over some time the fouling/moisture mix will generate various salts and corrode a barrel. A quick wet wipe and dry(even oil to mix with the fouling) after shooting, and the rifle could sit for a week before a better cleaning.

 

[Britsmoothy]

Dry black powder by itself is not corrosive, but if left in a bore long enough, burnt black powder fouling can draw moisture. Not overnight but over some time the fouling/moisture mix will generate various salts and corrode a barrel. A quick wet wipe and dry(even oil to mix with the fouling) after shooting, and the rifle could sit for a week before a better cleaning.

Another reason to use an animal or vegetable oil or fat as a lubricant.

 

[tenngun]

A key is humidity and temperature.
Guns have been found in American deserts that were in very good shape. Hot wet ozarks is not as bad as warm wet Great Lakes and better then steamy golf coast

 

[springfield art]

A key is humidity and temperature.
Guns have been found in American deserts that were in very good shape. Hot wet ozarks is not as bad as warm wet Great Lakes and better then steamy golf coast

Black powder residue is hydroscopic, is actively absorbs moisture from the air. Like a disco for rust!

 

[mooman76]

Someone I believe here did a test. He put BP, Pyrodex and if memory serves 777 on a flat piece of steel and burned them. They he took pictures every day for a few days to show how much corrosion/rust each got. Pyrodex was the worst as some already knew.

 

[tenngun]

Britsmoothie reports very good results from not cleaning like an OC every time he shoots. Me?
Well I’m OC
The sun may set on an argument but never a dirty gun.
Better safe then sorry

 

[Zonie]

Actually, the charcoal in black powder is hygroscopic . It can and does absorb moisture out of the air. This doesn't have much effect on the burn rate of the powder but, left for a long period in a bore, it can cause rust.

This was proven by the Bevel Brothers by "loading" a length of barrel with a vent hole in it like a flintlock and placing it in their humid basement.
They left it there for about a year and then tried to remove the ball. It wouldn't budge.
They tried to remove the breech plug. It also wouldn't budge.
After they sawed the barrel apart, they found the entire area where the black powder was was totally covered in rust as was the adjacent surfaces including the breech plug threads. The areas of the bore above the ball was only lightly rusted.

This seems to validate the idea that because a muzzleloader is not a sealed breech gun, storage of a gun loaded with black powder in a very humid location for a long period of time is a bad idea.

 

[springfield art]

Actually, the charcoal in black powder is hygroscopic . It can and does absorb moisture out of the air. This doesn't have much effect on the burn rate of the powder but, left for a long period in a bore, it can cause rust.

This was proven by the Bevel Brothers by "loading" a length of barrel with a vent hole in it like a flintlock and placing it in their humid basement.
They left it there for about a year and then tried to remove the ball. It wouldn't budge.
They tried to remove the breech plug. It also wouldn't budge.
After they sawed the barrel apart, they found the entire area where the black powder was was totally covered in rust as was the adjacent surfaces including the breech plug threads. The areas of the bore above the ball was only lightly rusted.

This seems to validate the idea that because a muzzleloader is not a sealed breech gun, storage of a gun loaded with black powder in a very humid location for a long period of time is a bad idea.

I read the Bevels as well!

 

[springfield art]

Someone I believe here did a test. He put BP, Pyrodex and if memory serves 777 on a flat piece of steel and burned them. They he took pictures every day for a few days to show how much corrosion/rust each got. Pyrodex was the worst as some already knew.

I don't like the "substitute" stuff; real BP is the real deal! Interesting experiment!

 

[Britsmoothy]

Actually, the charcoal in black powder is hygroscopic . It can and does absorb moisture out of the air. This doesn't have much effect on the burn rate of the powder but, left for a long period in a bore, it can cause rust.

This was proven by the Bevel Brothers by "loading" a length of barrel with a vent hole in it like a flintlock and placing it in their humid basement.
They left it there for about a year and then tried to remove the ball. It wouldn't budge.
They tried to remove the breech plug. It also wouldn't budge.
After they sawed the barrel apart, they found the entire area where the black powder was was totally covered in rust as was the adjacent surfaces including the breech plug threads. The areas of the bore above the ball was only lightly rusted.

This seems to validate the idea that because a muzzleloader is not a sealed breech gun, storage of a gun loaded with black powder in a very humid location for a long period of time is a bad idea.

I disagree that charcoal alone in black powder is hygroscopic. And the implication it causes corrosion or rusting.
I understand potassium nitrate is also hygroscopic. And being a salt aids corrosion.

My own tests to have seen loose powder gain weight if left open to the atmosphere.
Always seal a nipple or plug a vent on a loaded gun if kept loaded.

 

[hanshi]

Steel in any humid environment will absolutely rust with or without black powder. It pretty much has to be particularly humid for unburned black powder to absorb any significant amount of moisture. And guns should never be stored in humid locations without frequent care. Fouling will suck moisture out of the air like a sponge unless you live in an arid climate. In arid conditions you can get away with being lazy about cleaning your pets but don't push your luck otherwise.

 

[Cap'n Ball]

Luckily I live in a low humidity enviroment because I am lazy. However, I give a quick, generous wipe with Balistol when I case my gun and may not actually clean the gun until tomorrow or maybe next Saturday. The oil seems to stabilize any activity. I haven,t noticed any rust but I think the longest delay was about a week.

 

[Half-Cocked]

I would do anything to avoid cleaning my bp toys on the day of use. I do clean them the same day of shooting due to fear of rust forming.

When I go to the range I may have my bp rifle and SEVERAL modern firearms to make the trip worth it. I do not know from experience if rust forms that quickly. I don't want to chance it though even with my 200 dollar bp toys.

 

[arcticap]

Here's 2 experiments from the CT Muzzle Loaders Experiments page that involves black powder, rust and lubricants.

1. Anti-Corrosion Properties of Patch Lubes and Lubricants
2. Corrosion Prevention - Second Round

 

[Britsmoothy]

Here's 2 experiments from the CT Muzzle Loaders Experiments page that involves black powder, rust and lubricants.

1. Anti-Corrosion Properties of Patch Lubes and Lubricants
2. Corrosion Prevention - Second Round

That's why we don't keep the guns in a damp environment. Traditionally they lived above the fireplace and for good reason!

 

[springfield art]

That's why we don't keep the guns in a damp environment. Traditionally they lived above the fireplace and for good reason!

I gotta wonder about storing anything above a fireplace; The extreme heat rising up would damage almost anything hanging there. I've always thought that the traditional illustrations of a rifle hanging above the hearth was an invention of the modern illustrators. (Christmas cards, Norman Rockwell, etc.)Also, the movie industry's set decorators.

 

[Carbon 6]

I disagree that charcoal alone in black powder is hygroscopic. And the implication it causes corrosion or rusting.
I understand potassium nitrate is also hygroscopic.

Most correct answer so far, but I'll add to it.
Both charcoal and saltpeter are hygroscopic.
Sulfur technically is not, but because it is ground fine, it act's like it is hygroscopic.

Charcoal never fully dries out from the manufacturing process, as shipped gunpowder will contain about 8% moisture contained mostly in the charcoal.

 

[Carbon 6]

I gotta wonder about storing anything above a fireplace; The extreme heat rising up would damage almost anything hanging there. I've always thought that the traditional illustrations of a rifle hanging above the hearth was an invention of the modern illustrators. (Christmas cards, Norman Rockwell, etc.)Also, the movie industry's set decorators.,

Perhaps in a modern house, but in an old period style house with no insulation and single pane windows where the outer walls were frosty on a winters night ?

I don't think so.