Hot Soapy Water?

[Flash Pan Dan]

Could someone inform me of the benefits of using hot soapy water instead of cold soapy water? Why is black powder fouling more susceptible to hot water than cold? What chemical reaction occurs with fouling when using hot water instead of cold water?

For years and to this day, on this very forum, I read about using hot soapy water to clean black powder guns, yet I can’t find any reference to why hot water should be used. In my other black powder pursuit using those brass thingys to load, no one I know of uses how water. So what is going on with a muzzleloader that requires hot water to clean them?

 

[LRB]

May depend on location, but I always got flash rust with hot water. Can't see any difference in results between the two. Cold works as well as hot for me, and without the flash rust. Many believe flash rust is harmless if wiped out quickly, but it is really steel from the bore turned to iron oxide.

 

[Squeeze]

Think its just supposed to be tepid (warm) but after reading dutch Schoultz papers, and swabbing a barrel I know was shiny clean the day before a few times,and seeing a new rust form, I quit using water alltogether for cleaning. I use windex or window cleaner at the range, But for cleaning its just hoppes #9 or some type of gun oil now. I know some use an alcahol/peroxide mix and swear by the foaming clean action. But for me, 99% of the time Its just good old Hoppes #9

 

[Black Hand]

Could someone inform me of the benefits of using hot soapy water instead of cold soapy water? Why is black powder fouling more susceptible to hot water than cold? What chemical reaction occurs with fouling when using hot water instead of cold water?

There is no significant difference, though some solutes will dissolve faster in warm/hot water than cold (think of what happens to table salt when placed in cold vs warm vs hot water). On the other hand, grease/wax does seem to dissolve better/quicker in hot soapy water than cold.

 

[Grumpa]

I've always thought that the hot water (I use boiling) heats up the barrel, so that you are getting out fouling that worked down into the pores of the metal when it was hot from firing. Similarly, I've found that cleaning barrels immediately at the range works better, for the same reason ( the barrel hasn't had time to cool).
This accounts for the phenomenon of cleaning a barrel when you get home, then, a day or two later, you clean it again and find more fouling!
that has worked its way out of the metal.
I seem to recall reading about Civil War soldiers having a kettle of water boiling, just for cleaning their rifle barrels.
I will confess to wiping it out with WD40, to get rid of any water that hasn't evaporated, then a patch of bore butter, to preclude rusting.

 

[Wes/Tex]

The original thinking was that hot water raised the temp of the barrel itself and aided in drying. Don't know how true that is but seems to work. You just have to be thorough and oil the bore ASAP after using the hot water treatment.

 

[M. De Land]

I use warm soapy water to clean then warm clear to flush then wipe dry and anoint with Hoppe's 9.
Been trying Gunzilla lately and it seems to work just as well if not better than the Hoppe's and has no water or petroleum in it.
The directions say it will eliminate the need for water to clean black powder arms and oil to lube them for protection.
I'm still testing it and so far it seems to live up to the claims although I have not yet had the guts to use it exclusively and forgo the water and Hoppe's treatment. Mike D.

 

[Claude Mathis]

Could someone inform me of the benefits of using hot soapy water instead of cold soapy water?

From an early age, I noticed that washing my hands in warm water seems to work better than cold. Perhaps the dirt dissolves better? Perhaps it's the same with black powder?

 

[George T.]

I'm with the others here that heard or thought it was to heat up the steel so it would dry faster. I never got flash rust as I dried and oiled it right off. There has been a lot of time and money spent over the years trying to improve on the soap and water mix. I have found nothing that works better. Geo. T.

 

[Flash Pan Dan]

Thank you all for your insights. I’ve always had trouble with flash rust when using hot water. So I started using tepid or cold water to clean and had no more flash rush and the barrel seem to be just as clean. So I asked this question because when I read here of people cleaning with hot water I’m thinking they are going to have problems.

Could it be the humidity or the content of my tap water? I don’t understand it.

 

[LaBonte]

Also many soaps are acidic which contributes to rust

 

[dikman]

Shades of Froglube! Gunzilla is another one of those wonder things made from all natural products, is capable of dissolving lead, copper, powder etc yet is safe for the environment. Their website says to compare the MSDS to other similar products to see how safe it is, but when you look up the MSDS it says nothing about what's in it. Bit hard to compare, hmm? The MSDS does, however, mention that it can have, shall we say, unpleasant side effects on skin, eyes, digestive system etc. More hmmm.

One chap posted a photo of a styrofoam cup that he sprayed it on - it dissolved!

I really hate it when a company makes claims like this (safe, harmless, environmentally friendly etc), but they can't be verified. Always makes me suspicious.

In the meantime, I shall use water (sometimes hot, because it shifts the greasy lube buildup better, or cold, if that's what's available) and finish off with my WD-40 look-alike.

 

[Billnpatti]

Since joining the forum, I have learned one thing and that is that there are about as many "best" ways to clean a muzzleloading rifle as there are recipes for the "best" lubricant. :hmm: I have used cold, warm and hot soapy water to clean my rifles. All seem to work but it seems to me that hot soapy water cleans a bit faster and perhaps a bit better than cold soapy water. My imagination? I don't know. :idunno: The next verse to this song is that I don't care. I use hot if I have it and cold if I don't. In either case, I get my rifle just as clean and I don't have any flash rust problems. Cold soapy water may require a bit more swabbing but however you choose to do it, once you get it clean, it is absolutely imperative to get all of the water out of the bore.....bone dry and then wipe it with a product that has a rust preventive in it. But that is just how I do it because it has worked for me for over 40 years. :hatsoff:

 

[Bill Hall]

I like the way Claude put it, hot water just cleans better. As to why, probably something to do with less surface tension or less density, so the water can penetrate better.

Many years ago I used very hot water to clean my barrels. Got flash rust every time. I switched to cold water and got no rust. If there is a difference in cleaning power between hot and cold water, I have never noticed it, they both seem to clean the same to me. So the switch was a no-brainer. I think all the magic is in the soap. Bill

 

[pargent]

+1 Always found warm or hot water works best ,once one has been taught from an early age to properly clean and maintain a gun in the field and at home it becomes no harder then breathing in and out

 

[Dphar]

Soap is corrosive. So the barrel needs to be well rinsed with clear water after its use.
I generally use room temperature water. Hot water causes flash rusting.
Hot water is needed for Pyrodex, however, its better at dissolving the salts in the fowling.

Dan

 

[ryoung14]

As a Bore Butter user, I'd always see yellow streaks on the cleaning patches after cleaning with tepid or cold water. This would get worse after multiple cleanings and accuracy would suffer. The dreaded Bore Butter build-up, I guess.

When I used hot water, there would be no yellow streaks, but there would be flash rust. Accuracy held up fine through multiple cleanings.

Pick your poison. I've gone with hot water as I like accurate guns. I also don't think flash rust is a big deal.

 

[roundball]

I don't know what was used back in the day...but in my lifetime its been ingrained in me that "hot water & soap" is the thing to use for washing up, for washing clothes, its what automatic dishwashers use, etc, etc. And a simple example that makes the point clear to me is this:

Hold a breakfast plate with sticky egg residue on it under a cold water faucet and it just sits right there on the plate.
Switch that tap water to hot and the sticky residue melts and slides right off.

So for all the above reasons it always just seemed natural to use hot tap water with a squirt of dishwashing detergent, and it's always kept my barrels squeaky clean for me.

 

[pargent]

Using a good oil straight away while the barrel is still warm stops my guns getting what you call flash rust (3 in 1 , bore butter ,TC lube and olive oil all work just as well ) . Trick seems to be to get the barrel dry .

 

[necchi]

I don't think it has a lot to do with Hot, Warm or Cold water being best.
It has to do with how each person learns to clean his gun thoroughly.
What ever each person uses that works for that person. Each person does things a little different and many end up with the same basic results, a clean rust free barrel.

The trick to it all is just staying at it till the job is done. The more you do it the better you'll get and the job get's easier. :idunno:

That being said I prefer tepid/baby bath water temps and a couple drop's of dawn dish soap