Hawkin rifles

[Alden]

Look, I get it. Some commercial items bearing the generic name are closer to what the generic, kinda average, typical, all-custom, no-two-alike Hawkens look like. And any custom gun can be a craftsman's mirror of whatever is in his mind or of a particular Hawken as well as any of their variable attributes. Besides, what idiot would possibly think these have any resemblance...




If we've gotten one internet parrot, those who pretend they're an expert because they drop the name of real expert gunsmiths, go out of their way to play all-knowing, hollier-than-thou judge, jury, and executioner of new posters or even shooters who DARE to use the name Hawken, just one to think twice about their silliness then we've elevated the discourse.

And maybe, just maybe, we'll never hear anyone refer to "the Hawken rifle" as though there was ONE again, or we'll know them for a poser.

 

[necchi]

This is the entire problem with this thread Alden.
Those two rifles do not look the same.
(and the modern example does not call itself a Hawken)

Many of us enjoy the detail and fine nuance of a rifle and it's school, nobody has to be an "expert" to see and understand the differences.

If you choose to not see the differences, that is entirely your choice.
But this thread has become nothing more than you mocking those that admire the detail.
Your comparisons are;
MD 20/20 and a 12yr old Cabernet are both Wine.
McAdams and Makers Mark are both Whiskey.
Yugo's and BMW's are both cars.


And if you would actually look at the work of some of the fine builders mentioned, maybe just maybe, you'd begin to see the difference.

 

[cynthialee]

Well I just showed Alden's pics above to my sweetie and asked if she thought the two guns were made by different men or if they are the same maker.
She was of the opinion that they looked like they were a little different than each other but probably the same model, and probably made by the same guy.
Oh and she thought the CVA Hawken looked like the better of the two guns.
Now she doesn't know the first thing about guns, so to the untrained eye they are similar enough they are basically the same gun.
Yes I can tell the differences here and there, but they are minor enough I think.

 

[necchi]

Good test Cynthia,

And those new to the sport and/or those uninvolved as your partner,, are those that Alden makes his argument too.

I remember well my beginnings, the times when I would not have seen a difference at all also.

I am not the term "expert" as Alden mocks the many, but the difference in the drop and comb alone are huge.
The Devil is in the detail for those that admire.

Alden's argument makes me think he's the kind of guy that would cut the mufflers off a Honda 750 Model K then tell everyone within ear shot;
"See, it sounds just like a Harley"
(they are both motorcycles)

 

[Rick Son]

What is the difference between a Red Ryder BB rifle and a Daisy Buffalo Bill BB rifle?????

:rotf: :blah: :blah: :grin:

MERRY CHRISTMAS YA"LL

 

[Shine]

I can tell the difference. One is wayyyyy cooler than the other. :hatsoff: Im fixin to live vicariously through my 4 year old son. Anyway this thread has harshed my mellow so bad im sellin THE HAWKEN RIFLE. Im done. :surrender:

 

[RedFeather]

You guys are embarassing. And I could quite easily spot you across the room in a day care center full of toddlers. You have facial hair. Pity the O.P. OK, some have deep wallets and can afford to sip their pre-war reserve while cuddling up to a $5,000 reproduction, estatic that the replacement nail hammered in to the buttplate is actually a forged nail found scavanged from a log cabin that Jim Bridger might have once asked for directions at ..... or not. And others here take a slug of the Mad Dog to quench their thirst after running twenty or thirty conicals from wheel weights as they dream of next week's time in the deer stand. We are none of us mountain men (nor women, although I do have that fetching calico in the closet). I can't believe how long this thread has crawled along. It may yet break the record run set by Miller Lite's "Tastes great! Less filling!" commercials.

One thing is certain. Go into ANY big box/sporting goods store and see if you can spot the true Hawken copy, "traditional" CVA, T/C, Traditions or Pedersoli "incorrect" Pennsylvania Rifle amongst the Remington 700 replicas? You have better odds of winning the Megaball lottery. Look at the latest Navy Arms and Dixie catalogs compared to circa 1975. Selection whittles down every year. Can't we all just enjoy what brings us to this forum? Lookit all the range time wasted. People don't sign up here to become museum curators.

Anyway, happy holidays, whichsoever you observe. And I hope I don't see you in the New Year ....... inthis thread, that is. ;-) Make peace, but make smoke! Ciao! (That's Eye-talian for all us MD 20/20 drinkers here.)

 

[Idaho Ron]

:applause: :applause: :applause:

 

[Shine]

It does no good to insult me. In day care today I learned that sticks and stones thing.

 

[Idaho Ron]

I live in a daycare.
Ron

 

[S.Kenton]

It does no good to insult me. In day care today I learned that sticks and stones thing.

I laughed out loud at that!... :rotf:

 

[S.Kenton]

hey Chief, WHERE did you get that " All of My Heroes" poster at??? I WANT that!!!!!!!! Wanna sell? ff

 

[Rick Son]

We can't even go out and shoot a Hawken if we wanted to,the smog in the San Juaquin Valley is so bad the drive thru at the pharmacy is over crowded!Hearing make smoke is not good right now,everybody here is sick right now...But it's the thought that counts,make smoke LATER! We give up! :surrender:

 

[S.Kenton]

As usual Necchi, you and Zonie are, IMHO correct..the devil IS in the details.. and it appears the details are missed by a few posting on this thread. If ya'all want to drive a Chevette and call it a Corvette, well thats up to you., BUT don't try and tell me that my double wedge, maple stocked, buckhorn sighted, 34 inch by 1 1/16 inch across the flats barreled and all browned, steel furniture clad, Hawken resembles a CVA or a T/C Hawken...

 

[Alden]

Shine is sellin' his "exacting" acceptable-to-you all custom replica's of a famous (probably made-up history) original Hawken. The other is a big mass-marketer using the Hawken name. Ruh ro shaggy, which is which!?







Look the same don't they, oh, and one is 30% less, new, comes with a warranty, and parts are available...

LOL OK, it's not the T/C but a few of you guys, it is clear, really just want to be in "the club" by stepping on others and their guns. It's like listening to the typical obnoxious Dallas Cowboys or NY Yankees fan who thinks they're a player 'cause they sound like Rain Man about statistics and bought the $80 T-shirt. Somebody used the word posers...

"Not a Hawken, not a Hawken." "The barrel flat was often 1/32" wider, the barrel flat was often 1/32" wider." "The furniture was usually steel, the furniture was usually steel."

 

[Shine]

Your rear sight is on backward.

 

[Alden]

Necchi;
Great posts. The Honda Shadow had their transmissions knocked back a gear and their engines made a tad out of balance to imitate a Harley. Oh, and cheap mufflers. Yeah, you're an expert alright.

Stop pretending I am saying there is NO difference, but it isn't enough for you guys to pull out some thinning hair and look for opportunities to knock people. And if you think comparing the CVA Mountain Rifle or a Pedersoli perhaps and someone's custom "Hawken" is like a BMW vs. a Yugo you are delusional. Or just, what was it Madonna called it, "vogueing."

 

[Alden]

Shine;
LOL I saw that and wondered myself. It's not my gun, it's Cherry's' pic of a Pedersoli Rocky Mountain Hawken I'd probably still buy over an old, used, too-small-for-their-average-caliber alleged Hawken replica...

...and then go Christmas shopping with the savings.

:wink:

 

[Shine]

Well cherrys has a warrantee no worries.

 

[Alden]

Or maybe that's the way an original Hawken was made and that's the particular one whose sight they copied -- they were all different ya know.

And for the admission price of buying your father's sportiest new car you can go to a vacant lot on the weekends with other guys "in the club," park it, open the hood, and stand there to be admired by the unwashed masses every weekend... It's better than knocking new posters/shooters.