Hatfield 50... should I buy it?

[drstrangelove]

Have a line on a Hatfield 50cal flintlock. Asking price is 1000. Take down is 3 screw. No pins. Nice curly maple, shiny bore, 7.5lbs. What sayest thou? Grab it? My only other rifle is a percussion CVA. This is a step up for me.

 

[EC121]

Go to www.Kiblerslongrifles.com and look at what about the same money will buy.

 

[drstrangelove]

I hear u there. Only downside is I want a lighter rifle in a 50. The SMR is only available in 45 At 6lb 10oz. And if I don’t want to finish it it will be 800 more. The Colonial is 9lbs 10oz in 50 and both are pin driveout barrel removal.

 

[Snooterpup]

I have to agree with EC121 and I own a Hatfield just like the one you are looking at (picked mine up used for $300 Very lucky). Don't get me wrong, the Hatfield is a good rifle, some 50 calibers were 1:48, some 1:65 twist, and fun to shoot but can't begin to compare with Kibler's swamped barrels and his CNC locks. That flintlock looks like the 4th of July when it fires.
For just a little more cash, and if you are handy and good at following directions, you can have an heirloom rifle either a Southern Mountain type or a Colonial rifle.

 

[GANGGREEN]

It's a big step up from a CVA (and a percussion rifle in my humble opinion. Hee hee hee). Whether it's worth $1000 is the question. If it were me and I really liked the rifle, I'd at least try to negotiate a slightly better price, but if it's close to "as new" it's probably not a horrible price either. The Kibler kit does make a better rifle I think, but as you pointed out, it's not an apples to apples comparison as there's no .50 in the SMR and you'd still have to build it (which isn't difficult and frankly is rather fun).

 

[tenngun]

Got to agree, a might high for the piece. Never owned one, always regretted not buying one when they first came out, but that’s higher then I would invest in one when cheaper options for more hc guns are around

 

[drstrangelove]

That’s good advice. Maybe the Kibler SMR is the better route. Anyone with mid grade maple feel it’s adequately attractive to pass on extra fancy?

 

[Throwdown58]

For what they get for a Traditions with no pretty wood and a cheapo lock, I would offer him $800ish for it. If you have a place to work and the time to work on it, the Kiblers is awesome, and a real treasure. But I have neither of those and would buy this in a heartbeat. A thousand is a little steep for it though. With all the free money flying around now, all bets are off. More money chasing the same or less goods. Guess what comes next?

 

[drstrangelove]

The equivalent Pedersoli Frontier is deluxe curle maple is $1650!!!
this is the least expensive curly maple I’ve found.

 

[Throwdown58]

Yeah that was my thinking as well. Good luck even finding one right now too. I've bought a few longrifles on here just for that reason. In the new stimmy reality you are going to have to grab what you can while the dollars still buy something.

 

[Scota@4570]

I owned one for a time. I got it free. Search the forum for discussions of the general quality and correctness of construction. These later ones are not all that. Try not to be enamored with $100 worth of curly maple. In short, I would not want one at all. I sold mine to a friend for 300 with the extra RPL lock.

Here is my old post:

I had a later Pedersoli. It had lots of shortcomings. The lock needed significant tuning. I bought an L/R but did not see any improvement. The original lock was OK after the necessary tuning. The breech plug is extremely long. The liner penetrates the side of the plug, like CVA. The hole down the plug was too small for reliability. After I drilled it out, and opened up the liner reliability became nearly acceptable.

Stylistically it has problems. The ramrod pipes are screwed to the barrel through the stock. This is a cheesie non HC way to do it. The trigger guard lays on top of the stock, same objection. The shaping of the stock is weird. The buttstock has a weird shape and teenie but plate. The wrist has a strange cross section. The forend it way to fat. Mine had no entry pipe or nose cap. I sold mine after addressing these deficiencies. The new owner likes it fine.

I can find fault with most anything, that is about me. After I sold the Hatfield I build three really nice traditional and HC long rifles. Problem solved. : )

 

[Throwdown58]

Must not have been much of a friend lol. What was your bad experience like?

 

[Snooterpup]

A few more details about the Hatfield. The one you are considering is probably made by Pedersoli, like mine, even though the lock is marked Hatfield. I love mine and won't part with it, BUT there are a few annoying things I've discovered. #1 is the long chambered breech. You only find out about it if you ever remove the breech plug. REMOVE THE LINER FIRST! It is threaded not only in the barrel but also in the breech plug. The chambered breech has just a 1/4" channel down to the liner in the .50 caliber barrel. This small hole lengthens the time for the charge to go off and makes cleaning the rifle more of a challenge. Fouling can get pushed down into this channel and cause ignition trouble. Also, if you happen to break the mainspring, good luck finding one easily. I had to do lock plate modifications to get one of L&R's springs to work and grind the spring somewhat. Works great now but no fun. Or you could replace the lock with one of L&R's Pedersoli's Frontier locks, further driving up the price of the rifle substantially. You can only guess why I know these things!

 

[drstrangelove]

I’m getting the picture pretty well here. Thanks for all the input. Y’all saved me 4hrs of driving this weekend.

 

[Snooterpup]

I owned one for a time. I got it free. Search the forum for discussions of the general quality and correctness of construction. These later ones are not all that. Try not to be enamored with $100 worth of curly maple. In short, I would not want one at all. I sold mine to a friend for 300 with the extra RPL lock.

Here is my old post:

I had a later Pedersoli. It had lots of shortcomings. The lock needed significant tuning. I bought an L/R but did not see any improvement. The original lock was OK after the necessary tuning. The breech plug is extremely long. The liner penetrates the side of the plug, like CVA. The hole down the plug was too small for reliability. After I drilled it out, and opened up the liner reliability became nearly acceptable.

Stylistically it has problems. The ramrod pipes are screwed to the barrel through the stock. This is a cheesie non HC way to do it. The trigger guard lays on top of the stock, same objection. The shaping of the stock is weird. The buttstock has a weird shape and teenie but plate. The wrist has a strange cross section. The forend it way to fat. Mine had no entry pipe or nose cap. I sold mine after addressing these deficiencies. The new owner likes it fine.

I can find fault with most anything, that is about me. After I sold the Hatfield I build three really nice traditional and HC long rifles. Problem solved. : )

• Snooterpup
• 1 minute ago

Good morning Scota@4570, I saw your post about the Hatfield right after I sent my post saying virtually the same thing as you. I own a Hatfield too and have considered drilling out the breech plug for some time. I noticed you had done so and saw a benefit from that. I am wondering what size drill did you use to enlarge the flash channel in the Hatfield plug? Thank you! Snooterpup

 

[GANGGREEN]

I wouldn't mind seeing photos if one of you does (or have) drilled out the breech to make cleanup and ignition better. I had a Cabelas Blue Ridge rifle for years and it was reliable and fine for me, but I do like the old Hatfields and want to get one at some point. I'm more comfortable with "gun building processes" now than I used to be and would like to make it as reliable and trouble free as possible if/when I do.

 

[dave_person]

Hi,
Let me be blunt, there is no comparison between a Kibler kit and any Hatfield or Pedersolis rifles. Hatfields are one of the most over rated and hyped mediocre guns ever made. Pedersolis rifles are just the same. I saw the Hatfields when they first came out in the 1980s and they were such darlings with the dealers. They were their "high end" offerings and touted as a big step up from the TC Hawkens and CVAs and their ilk. I could never understand how they could be "high end" when they did not even have inlet trigger guards. Kind of like cheap trade guns used to be. If you have a thousand dollars to spend I urge you not to waste it on a Hatfield.

dave

 

[Critter Getter]

I own two early Hatfield percussion guns. Also own a Pedersoli flintlock as well as a percussion. I will agree there is very little historically correct about them but if that doesn’t matter to you, The Hatfields that I own are two of my favorite black powder guns for one simple reason........they just flat out shoot offhand at 50 yards!! In my eyes they are very attractive. I also own some flintlocks by very well known makers and those are very nice as well. I’m not a huge fan of the Pedersoli I have but for those not wanting to spend a bunch, they are ok. I agree that if I was going to lay down a grand or more for a flintlock the Kibler is a great option. I have looked at those at CLA shows and very impressed with his kits! Greg

 

[Critter Getter]

Nm......

 

[Tom Compton]

Pass on the Hatfield.