half cock after firing?

[hrt4me]

I have never before owned a muzzle loading rifle, but now I have my first: a .58 caliber muzzleloading 1863 Remington (Miroku Zouave). I have not yet fired it, but I noticed on some YouTube videos that upon firing a rifle, some shooters immediately cock their hammer to half cock before doing anything else.

Is this necessary? And if so, then why? What is the rationale behind this specific step?

 

[hawkeye2]

They may feel safer by doing so, half cock was the original safety. I would have to say a personal choice and it may make them feel more comfortable. Perhaps their range requires all firearms to be at half cock unless ready to fire.

In the N-SSA we shoot fast and loading is done with the hammer down on a spent cap to prevent fanning any embers in the barrel. Before anyone leaves the firing line they must snap a cap at shoulder arms with the muzzle pointed down range and another with the muzzle pointed at grass or gravel so they can see movement assuring the barrel is clear. After that everyone leaves the line with the hammer down on the last cap (as far as I have ever seen).

 

[Eterry]

I did it because the old man i shot with as a teen did it. I don't guess there's a reason to, but habits die hard.

 

[LawrenceA]

There is a theory that this lets air in so any smoldering ember will burn quick and go out. The counter is leaving the hammer down will suffocate a burning ember.

 

[dave951]

I have never before owned a muzzle loading rifle, but now I have my first: a .58 caliber muzzleloading 1863 Remington (Miroku Zouave). I have not yet fired it, but I noticed on some YouTube videos that upon firing a rifle, some shooters immediately cock their hammer to half cock before doing anything else.

Is this necessary? And if so, then why? What is the rationale behind this specific step?

Lots of misinformation on Utoob. With a Civil War musket, LEAVE the spent cap on with the hammer DOWN. It will keep an ember from flaring during loading the next shot by not allowing any fresh air from any source back into the barrel while loading. Civil War muskets with minies are also designed to NOT be wiped between shots like PRB guns.

Supporting proof from the ODG- look at muzzleloading artillery procedure. One of the cannoneers is detailed to keep his thumb closed on the vent using a thumbstall during the entire reloading procedure. Leaving the cap on is the same effect.

 

[hrt4me]

Lots of misinformation on Utoob. With a Civil War musket, LEAVE the spent cap on with the hammer DOWN. It will keep an ember from flaring during loading the next shot by not allowing any fresh air from any source back into the barrel while loading. Civil War muskets with minies are also designed to NOT be wiped between shots like PRB guns.

Supporting proof from the ODG- look at muzzleloading artillery procedure. One of the cannoneers is detailed to keep his thumb closed on the vent using a thumbstall during the entire reloading procedure. Leaving the cap on is the same effect.

the shooter/YouTube channel to which I am specifically referring is that Hungarian dude, 'capandball'... I tended to think his videos and content were somewhat decent, but maybe he is not necessarily as much of the self-proclaimed expert he thinks he is because he always automatically half-cocks the hammer whenever he fires a rifle...

 

[jdw276]

He will chime in sometime. He is a member and pretty active on this forum......he will tell us why i am sure....

 

[Hatchet-Jack]

If you do that at Friendship the range officer will check you and possibly send you home. It's unsafe to leave it in half cock and load it. Don't ask me how I learned this A lot of us that used to shoot percussion have a habit of putting it into half cock because we're used to half cocking right after shooting to remove the spent cap.

 

[dave951]

Leave the spent cap ON with hammer DOWN

 

[TFoley]

the shooter/YouTube channel to which I am specifically referring is that Hungarian dude, 'capandball'... I tended to think his videos and content were somewhat decent, but maybe he is not necessarily as much of the self-proclaimed expert he thinks he is because he always automatically half-cocks the hammer whenever he fires a rifle...

Ah, you mean Dr Balász Németh, former and future competition secretary and organiser for the MLAIC, the Muzzleloading Association International Confederation, and many-times Hungarian national BP rifle shooting champion. He'll be organising the 2022 long-range rifle competitions, in Hungary next year, as well.

Quote from his company website - 'In 2005, I was elected chairman of the Hungarian association and later I became a member of the board of the Hungarian Sportshooting Federation. Another great responsibility is being a member of the MLAIC Commission, that I have been for five years now – and the community we serve deserves great respect'.

What does HE know, eh?

 

[tenngun]

I never got in to minnie ball guns. I like round ball and I shoot mostly rock in the locks. However I started leaving the gun on half cock in a percussion gun so I could get that woosh of air out of the nipple that told me the fire channel was open.
I noted when I left the cock down it was harder to push the ball down
After a few shots even a minnie has some resistance going down as a cushion of air can build up behind it.

 

[hrt4me]

Ah, you mean Dr Balász Németh, former and future competition secretary and organiser for the MLAIC, the Muzzleloading Association International Committee, and many-times Hungarian national BP rifle shooting champion. He'll be organising the 2022 long-range rifle competitions, in Hungary next year, as well.

What does HE know, eh?

I have no idea as to the identity nor background of the owner of the 'capandball' YouTube channel, so I cannot speak to that... I did merely note that 'capandball' always seems to first half-cock the hammer immediately after firing a caplock percussion rifle, and other posters in this thread have commented such procedure is not necessarily correct... maybe they do things differently in Hungary*?
(NB: my father's genealogy traces back to Hungary in the not-too-distant past, and I have always enjoyed my visits there!)

 

[TFoley]

Well, Sir, now you DO know. It's not a matter of doing it the way they do it in Hungary, it's a matter of compliance with the range rules of the MLAIC, which, as the name implies, is truly international. However, as you live in the USA, and may not take part in that kind of competition, you can feel free to ignore its rules.

 

[Grenadier1758]

For a lot of us the answer depends on what type of shooting and where we are shooting.

In the N-SSA, shooting is done with speed and safety in mind. You want the hammer down on a spent cap to snuff out any embers. This is a good practice for hunting when you need a second shot loaded.

At the informal target range, it will depend pretty much on how you want to load and how you want to control the condition of the barrel between shots. Leaving the hammer down on the spent cap for loading should using a paper cartridge is a good procedure. If you are a wipe the bore between shots, then you want the rifle on half cock with the cap cleared so the rush of fresh air and the damp patch will extinguish any embers. Not to be ignored is the fact that having the hammer at half cock with the cap debris cleared keeps the barrel open for ease of loading as you are not fighting air pressure when loading the round.

If you are shooting a patched round ball, especially for scored targets, I would put the hammer at half cock after firing to clear the cap debris and wipe the nipple. I would lower the hammer to rest on the nipple before I returned to the loading bench for a wipe of the bore and reloading for the next shot.

If the range rules require a specific procedure in accordance with their safety regulations, I would follow the range rules. Not enough reason as long as a safe procedure is followed to argue against the range rules.

Note for full disclosure: I mostly shoot flintlocks. After shooting, the touch hole is open and makes no difference if the lock is at half cock or down, nothing is impeding the flow of air. I do follow the procedure of wiping the pan, flint and frizzen and verifying the hammer is down before reloading. I wipe the bore between shots to eliminate embers and to maintain a consistent degree of fouling.

 

[hrt4me]

Well, Sir, now you DO know. It's not a matter of doing it the way they do it in Hungary, it's a matter of compliance with the range rules of the MLAIC, which, as the name implies, is truly international. However, as you live in the USA, and may not take part in that kind of competition, you can feel free to ignore its rules.

I can certainly understand if that procedure has been implemented as a specific range and/or competition rule.

From a purely historical or practical aspect, however (range rules aside), is there any particular reason for or against that action? Posters have already responded in terms of residual embers (both for and against), and apparently such action is not allowed at Friendship here in the U.S....

 

[tenngun]

I do blow down a bore after the shot. And I’m sure that’s po pooed on many ranges. However it has been years since I blew off my head doing that, and think I’ll continue
I do like knowing my channel or touch hole is clear.

 

[hrt4me]

Thank you, @Grenadier1758, for taking the time to share your thorough response.

As I initially noted, I now own my first muzzleloading rifle, and I have not even fired it yet, as I want to do plenty of research beforehand so I eventually fire it correctly and safely. This is quite the learning process for me!

I sincerely apologize, hat in hand, if I have ruffled any feathers in my quest for knowledge here.

 

[dave951]

When reading this entire thread, what should be understood is that there are different procedures for different types of guns and shooting. PRB percussion, half cock isn't an issue as you're wiping. Same for flints. The original post was concerning a gun designed to shoot minies and as such, that is the deciding factor. Minies were the last word in military tech prior to cartridges and were specifically designed to avoid wiping and PRB issues.

 

[Grenadier1758]

I do blow down a bore after the shot. And I’m sure that’s po pooed on many ranges. However it has been years since I blew off my head doing that, and think I’ll continue
I do like knowing my channel or touch hole is clear.

I find that the plume of smoke flowing out of my touch hole or nipple is evidence enough of a clear flash channel. I, too, like to know the flash channel is clear. That's a reason I use vent picks, but that's a flint lock procedure and not applicable to percussion locks. The damp patch seems to do a better job of moistening the fouling than blowing down the barrel. I do have to use a properly sized jag and patch to minimize the amount of fouling pushed down the barrel

 

[dave951]

Riddle me this. If you're doing wiping with a damp patch and get some smoke out the vent and hear a whoosh of air, then why pray tell are you putting your oral orifice on the muzzle to put positive atmospheric pressure inside the bore?