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FOR SALE Hacked or scam?

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OK so, the only way to complete stop a scammer is to make it impossible for folks to post. Sorta the same question as how to make it impossible for a burglar to get into a house..., seal the house up so there are no windows nor doors...,

Correct, the long time members who have been "hacked" have allowed by accident a nefarious person electronic access to their PC. That person then has gone through files and found member ship here, and the password. That person can then do one of two things..., they can log on and monitor what the victim is posting without the victim's knowledge, so IF they are patient, they can wait until the victim makes an online purchase, and discover the victim's bank card number, expiration date and that special number on the back of the card. Then BAM! the account gets drained with some sort of "purchase" not authorized.

The other thing that the nefarious person may do, especially if they are impatient, is they can log onto any site where the victim is a member, and then change the email and password. The member is then locked out, but the nefarious person can masquerade as that member, offering a fraudulent sale. Which is what has happened in the past two times of which I'm aware.



Nope the account has been stolen so an every day member would catch it pretty quick. You could not log on as a member, BUT since the account is no longer linked to your personal email, THEN you could start a new membership to be able to post the hack to the rest of the members and get the hacker shut down. Then Angie could correct your original account, and delete the new, redundant one.

You can also (iirc) send a message from your private email to Angie by clicking on the "Contact us" tab in the lower right side of this page. This takes longer but if you suddenly found yourself banned, that would be an option to find out why if it was unclear to you.



As I've explained, the existence of a "paper trail" or anything identifying the subject generally does not garner prosecution, or if it does it's minor and when an addict is involved, they simply don't care.

To Thwart these guys....,
a) Check the post count and the date joined, and LOOK at what they have posted. IF they have recently joined, and done nothing more than greet other new members, or approve of posts without adding anything..., no actual knowledge of black powder shooting for example, this may be a scammer who is boosting their post count.
b) If they then offer something for sale that is at a rather low price, the "too good to be true" price, is another clue... OR..,
c) If a) above applies and then you get a private message that's a tip about a third person who is selling something, that's a clue. "Hey I saw you were looking for X, and I know a guy who is selling X, and here is his email"... that's likely a scam.
d) IF you're not sure, ASK the person to take a photo of the item in a manner that you specify, with an additional item that you request. "Can you send me a photo of the lock on the gun with two quarters and a nickle and a penny next to it?" IF they don't comply then halt the negotiation and ignore the seller. If they object about you questioning their honesty, a short explanation of why should suffice, and if not.... then halt the negotiation and ignore the seller. WHY the coin combination? You should use more than one coin, since folks will sometimes put a single coin into a photo online for scale..., and a scammer could simply repost an old ad with such a photo. A random coin combination means the seller must have the item at hand. OH and LOOK HARD that the photo isn't exactly like a previous photo of lock that magically now has the coins..., some scammers will try and photoshop one of the fraudulent photos to fool you. IF they don't comply, giving you a new photo with the coin combo...,halt negotiation and ignore the seller.
e) If you think the deal is good, then use a USPS money order, and get an address, not a P.O. Box.

Not fool proof as it doesn't stop a guy with a stolen black powder gun and a camera, some coins, an address and a bank account from simply saying "I will sell this to you", getting the money order, cashing it, and simply not completing the transaction.

LD
 
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Yessir, thank you LD. I probably need to change my password more frequently; at work, they make us change them every thirty days or we cannot log in to the system.
 

Old Hawkeye

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SAME HERE postal M/O the only way to fly..with a street address
If you are the seller, why not just accept a personal check? You can hold the item until the check clears & the money is safely in your account. At the same time the buyer has some protection if the check is lost in the mail, as he can stop payment on it. MO's are a PIA & if lost one must wait 60 days before even filing a claim. Then one has to go thru all the USPS BS & maybe get your money back. This is not the dark ages, as all bank transfers are electronic & at the speed of light. It is possible to confirm the check is good & transfer the money to your account almost instantaneously, but the banks don't. You can usually confirm the check is good & money transferred in a day or two depending on how busy your bank is. Just don't understand people's fear of a check. PayPal & other "new" payment methods leave everyone open to scam & theft & scare the Bejesus out of me. If you are a buyer, the bottom line is do your due diligence about who you send money to regardless of method & always remember, Caveat Emptor!
 

Loyalist Dave

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So far the scammers are targeting folks who buy, not the sellers because they then would need to liquidate the item after it arrives, further delaying their money <LD knocks on wood>
The problem when you use a personal check as a buyer is the seller then has you bank account info and bank routing number as it appears on your check, which may allow them if they are a scammer to extract money from your account.

LD
 

Brokennock

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So far the scammers are targeting folks who buy, not the sellers because they then would need to liquidate the item after it arrives, further delaying their money <LD knocks on wood>
The problem when you use a personal check as a buyer is the seller then has you bank account info and bank routing number as it appears on your check, which may allow them if they are a scammer to extract money from your account.

LD
You said something in your longer post about avoiding scammers and how they have likely been operating here, and how accounts behave when hacked, that caught my eye.
You said that once the hacker/scanner logs in as the member and changes the email and password for the account, the hacked member could open another account and post about the hack because their email is no longer associated with their original screen name. Are you sure about this?
I seem to recall Zonie and @Angie telling me that a second account could not be opened from the same i.p. address when I was being threatened by a former member.

Also, can 2 step security be implemented, at least as an option, for things like password changes?
I'm speaking of the member having a cell phone number on file and when a password change request is made, a 6 digit code is texted to the cell phone and needs to be entered before the password change form can even be accessed. This way anyone wanting to change a password would have to have access to the member's cell phone as well as their account here.
 
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What is a skype call?
That's when you can see the person that you are talking to live on your phone. We did it weekly when our AF son was in Germany. It was very comforting to see him safe. If you skype with a seller, he can show you the gun under consideration. Doesn't mean he will send it, but it's better than blind trust.
 
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Thinking about all this while trying to get to sleep last night...

Besides the obvious, what’s really wrong about “i like your rifle you’re selling. I’ll take it. I’ll send you my shipping address and you send it to me. If it gets here, i’ll know you’re an honest seller and i’ll send you a check.”

Seriously, what’s the difference? Granted, there’s always a risk somewhere. Is it just accepted that it falls on the buyer?

Maybe i’m missing something, but there are a number of you here that i’d be willing to deal with in that way. Of course, i’d post pictures....

don
 

FishDFly

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Some here I trust and some not.

Unfortunately, I have become very gun shy about buying now with the way things have become here and at the Modern Muzzle Board. It was not this way before.

I may have to set a maximum not to exceed that I am willing to lose here just in case.

In the case of higher dollar guns, I believe the dealer to dealer way is the only safe way.

Another way is to watch TOF and The Gun Works for wants and needs. I have bought from both with no regrets.

Did have a thought, mostly on new joiners and sales which I am leery of for reasons already mentioned. I might have to consider a new joiner if they are a MLF Supporter. I presume that Angie has information where they can be found or located from their payment to MLF when joining if there were problems with a sale.. Maybe LD can share some insight on Supporters.
 
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Watch out with Paypal. I have been defrauded on Paypal and they did not get
my money back--it was a non-firearm transaction. Paypal has also stated that
they will begin notifying the Government about "questions" in their accounts.
Paypal has joined the fight against Trump Supporters as domestic terrorists.
 
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I recently bought a mold from a member and due to not having time to run the gauntlet I sent the man cash and got my mold and we are both gleefull and happy. NOT MANY but this member has been here for a long time and most folks like that I can trust for minimum cost items!
 
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Paypal tried to pay the scammer from my bank account this morning, but since I blocked all payments to them at the bank I got an email from paypal saying that my payment to the scammer wasn't made. Small victory.

By contrast, I won a bid for a project revolver on gunbroker the other day. Since it was the weekend, I emailed the seller and told him I would put a PMO in the mail on Monday. Early Monday morning he sent me an email and said that because I had good feedback on gunbroker and since he had to go the the post office anyway, he had already put the gun in the mail to me. There are still good folks out there. Thank y'all for your comments and support.
 
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