Gain Twist rifling...does it work

Discussion in 'General Muzzleloading' started by pamtnman, Aug 23, 2019.

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  1. Aug 23, 2019 #1

    pamtnman

    pamtnman

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    Anyone with experience shooting gain twist rifling, your opinion or observations are welcome. Gunmaker Bill Slusser swears by it. Historic British gunmaker Charles Lancaster made cutting edge cannons and rifles with it. But should we use it today?
     
  2. Aug 23, 2019 #2

    rich pierce

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    The ball or bullet starts spinning slowly and starts increasing rate of spin as it moves down the bore. Theoretically less stripping or blow by.
     
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  3. Aug 23, 2019 #3

    Phil Coffins

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    The book “ The Bullets Flight “ by Mann will answer your question in detail. Unlike opinions with little data he did very detailed testing with barrels made for him only for the tests. I highly recommend it.
     
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  4. Aug 23, 2019 #4

    pamtnman

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    Will you share his conclusions with us here? Don’t be shy or coy. I feel like I have to slip a dollar bill in to get a little sense of what you mean
     
  5. Aug 23, 2019 #5

    Phil Coffins

    Phil Coffins

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    I haven’t read the book lately but as my bunny tail memory ( short and fuzzy ) recalls gain twist wasn’t any better. The library got the book for me threw enter library loan so I don’t have it at hand.
    No money is required to get my thoughts, I hate typing.
     
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  6. Aug 23, 2019 #6

    hanshi

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    I actually posted in your duplicate post by mistake. I have only one GT barrel on a rifle I've owned for nearly 55 years. It's as accurate as any other barrel I've fired. Is it more accurate than uniform twist? I don't know and can't shoot well enough to tell.
     
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  7. Aug 23, 2019 #7

    pamtnman

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    Colerain makes gain twist barrels and I’m intrigued. The British used gain twist on all their sporting rifles. Must be something to it
     
  8. Aug 23, 2019 #8

    nkbj

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    I've read the same thing about there being no loss or gain in using gain twist.
    And that surprised me because changing the shape of the rifling should (my way of thinking) mess up the fit of the muzzleloaded projectile.
     
  9. Aug 23, 2019 #9

    Grumpa

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    Colt used gain twist on his revolvers. I haven't shot my original 1860...but I am going to...but I have nothing to compare it to - all the originals are gain twist, and comparing it to a repro would be "apples to oranges" on many levels.

    Richard/Grumpa
     
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  10. Aug 24, 2019 #10

    RAEDWALD

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  11. Aug 24, 2019 #11

    Westbrook

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    I believe the advantage is, you have a barrel that shoots a PRB and elongated bullets well.
     
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  12. Aug 24, 2019 #12

    LANEY REECE

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    May I ask what is a grain twist rifle ?
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2019
  13. Aug 24, 2019 #13

    EC121

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    The rifling twist in a gain twist barrel is slower at the breech and gradually increases as it goes up the barrel. It is supposed to let you use a heavier load that won't jump the rifling, blow a patch, or turn the gun at the start, and some think it is more accurate. I have a Hoyt gain twist barrel in one rifle and can't see the difference. A good load work up is more important.
    ;) However, saying you have one in your rifle makes you sound like a real pro.
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2019
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  14. Aug 24, 2019 #14

    LANEY REECE

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    Thank you sir. Laney
     
  15. Aug 24, 2019 #15

    Pukka Bundook

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    Pampntonman,
    Quote,:The British used gain twist on all their sporting rifles. Must be something to it"

    Some British makers used gain twist, but some did not. All kinds of experimenting carried out. Wide grooves, narrow, different rates of twist, etc. etc.

    All the best,
    Richard.
     
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  16. Aug 24, 2019 #16

    EC121

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    What Pukka said!! The old gun makers would try anything to get an advertising edge on their competition.
     
  17. Aug 24, 2019 #17

    52Bore

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    I agree, no different than today.

    Have not seen an original Percussion Gibbs/Metford Match Rifle shoot any better or worse than a Rigby. There’s a lot more than the rifling to get one to shoot well.
     
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  18. Aug 24, 2019 #18

    Larry Akers

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    One of the types of firearms I build is target pistols for which I make barrels with a gain twist. I have not seen any advantage over uniform twist as far as accuracy is concerned, but I use gain twist to reduce torque. I think anything I can do as a builder to contribute to the stability of the pistol will enhance a shooters accuracy. I also make single set triggers that do not jump away from the finger--again for stability.
     
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  19. Aug 24, 2019 #19

    GREENSWLDE

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    Wasn't gain twist developed to keep a better shot seal by changing the angle the bullet was engraved preventing gas leakage as with decreasing depth as per Enfield pattern 53 onwards ??

    OLD DOG.
     
  20. Aug 24, 2019 #20

    Loyalist Dave

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    It was last "formally" used in a 20mm, auto loading, anti-tank gun, in the United States Army, back in the 1950's, and in some versions of the Vulcan gun on modern fighter planes. Today it's being reexamined by high speed, long range rifle shooters. I think in both cases it helped/helps with projectiles going faster than Mach 2....which isn't us, of course.

    IF you take a gander at The Muzzle-Loading Cap Lock Rifle by Ned Roberts, you will see I think more advantage when using a "tapered bore" than a gain-twist. A tapered bore actually constricts around the bullet a few inches before it reaches the muzzle. The bullet being very snug when loaded, after descending a few inches, is then easier to load. When fired the base of the bullet upsets.., and so grabs onto the lands and grooves. As it nears the muzzle the seal is further improved. Roberts (iirc) was using paper patched, muzzleloading conical bullets, and (iirc) it was used by almost all of the champion shooters of his era. They were shooting at least 220 yards (40 rods) and farther.

    LD
     
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