French Boucheron

[Runewolf1973]

To paraphrase what you wrote elsewhere, when one makes a very accurate repro of something, all the good things and faults of the original product are repeated.

Very much agree original knives like this often did not have the void filled with cutler's resin, though some did.

However, it is also true that it is much more difficult to keep or clean blood, gore and bits of flesh out of that area when used for hunting and butchering.

While it is my personal preference only, I don't want a knife that might wind up infecting or poisoning me when a period solution is available to preclude this from happening by filling that area with cutler's resin.

Please don't take this as personal criticism of you, but rather pointing out another problem with the period design.

BTW, I really like the other knives you posted as well.

Gus

Yah, these period knives just really weren't designed all that well IMO. Then again, I suppose they were still better in many ways than the stone alternative they had back then. I agree that getting blood and flesh and bacteria in the void does pose a potential risk. Interesting that back in those days getting infections or food poisoning would have been a really bad thing, but they probably had no idea that the knife handle design itself was of concern. I think pretty much everything was risky back then, lol, so this was of little concern in the grand scheme of things.

 

[D.Summers]

The giant F Dick knife is somewhat obsolete even in my professional kitchen at home. But it is still good for chopping thru deer ribs, and effortlessly quartering s big old watermelon! It makes short work of fragrant canteloupes and honeydews!!

 

[Runewolf1973]

It's interesting how knives in professional kitchens have changed. I have a F.Dick chefs knife that is heavy, and 18 inches long, 12 inch blade, quarter in wide at the bolster, that is a monster. Made maybe in the 30's. It's for dealing with the primal cuts that restaurants used to deal with. No longer. Cuts are brought in wrapped in sous-vide, cleaned and ready. Nowadays, prevalent knives are slim Japonese knives with great elegance, sharp and effective. But they wouldn't be too effective against the sides of beef, veal and lamb that were delivered to our restaurants in the late seventies, early eighties. Then you needed cleavers, heavy, and hacksaws. Chop chop thru the chines, and trim excess bone!

Precisely I think why they had the Hudson Bay Camp Knife, lol. It's like a big, heavy cleaver of a knife...

 

[D.Summers]

You should consider putting some of your knives for sale, here on the forum! They seem to be fine knives!!

 

[Runewolf1973]

You should consider putting some of your knives for sale, here on the forum!

I should do that. Do happen to know if I need a special membership or anything, or just go ahead and post for sale in the classifieds?

 

[D.Summers]

I think that you're good to go! You've been a member long enuf, and have adequate posts!

 

[Brokennock]

Even though it's dull, the heel of the knife seems poorly designed. I was a professional chef for 40+ years, and that looks like trouble. Granted, it's not a kitchen knife, but the sweet sweep at the heel to the business side of the blade looks like pain. I don't recall ever seeing a knife design like this. No bolster, no hilt? A pretty knife, for sure, but maybe one I'd steer clear of. JMPO. I hope folks can see what I'm saying

Bloody, tired hands slip. I've butchered I don't know how many animals, in kitchens and on tables in the yard. Skinned possums, muskrat, 'coons and foxes before I ventured into some great kitchens. Knives get bloody, and slippery. That single element seems poorly employed.

And the knife's tang should extend to the end of the handle. More strength, better balance.

These are all good, modern, observations. But, the diagram the o.p. shows regarding the source of his design and pin size is based on an actual artifact.
Bolsters were not common at the time, neither were "full tangs."
And, no one says you have to sharpen that rounded heal.

 

[Brokennock]

I made my pins 1/8" as per this drawing of an original French knife. Two pins on the French knives and 3 smaller pins on the English knives.

View attachment 88870

Well done sir.

 

[andy52]

I had a Boucheron a few years ago but it wasn't a knife it looked like this.

 

[Toklo Etee]

Runewolf.....that is a good looking knife....it has the details that one would look for for. French Knife of the 18th Cen.
I have a friend that specializes in French material culture of the 17th & 18th cen. He is a skilled blade smith and French Boucheron.....his name is Ken Hamilton .....do a google search and you may be able to find some images of his knife's. He well connected to many serious collectors and has had the opportunity to examine multiple extant knives/ axes of the period.

 

[Loja man]

Precisely I think why they had the Hudson Bay Camp Knife, lol. It's like a big, heavy cleaver of a knife... View attachment 88872

This is a great rendition of the Hudson Bay! What’s the thickness at the spine? Do you do your own heat treat?
I agree with all the comments up to date about the void in the handle. Not practical, would hold gunk, a greater pain in handle fitting etc. It seems strange…..yet I guess quality was not focal in these trade knives.

 

[Runewolf1973]

This is a great rendition of the Hudson Bay! What’s the thickness at the spine? Do you do your own heat treat?
I agree with all the comments up to date about the void in the handle. Not practical, would hold gunk, a greater pain in handle fitting etc. It seems strange…..yet I guess quality was not focal in these trade knives.

The Hudson Bay is 3/16" thick at the spine and yes, I do my own heat treating.

 

[shorthair]

This is more the style that I am accustomed to making. It is not exactly "period correct", but they are very user-friendly. I personally dislike metal bolsters because they just seem to add too much extra weight.
View attachment 88871

I am simply envious of your talent.

 

[Loja man]

I’m still working on one! The handle is just a mock up out of popular. It’s been on my work bench since Christmas. Life is just busy.

 

[Runewolf1973]

I’m still working on one! The handle is just a mock up out of popular. It’s been on my work bench since Christmas. Life is just busy. View attachment 88904

Looks good,! Nice shape to it. I understand what you mean...life does get busy.

 

[JaeBeah]

This is my first attempt at recreating the French boucheron scalping knife. I tried going as historically correct as possible. It is based off of a drawing of an original. The blade is 1084 steel, 6" long and 1/8" thick tapered in both directions with 1/8" pins peened in place. The oversized, octagonal handle is made of Beech. Other than the "aged/darkened" appearance I gave the blade and the wood (which I prefer anyways), I think it is fairly accurate. What do you guys think?

View attachment 88823
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Fine looking knife!

 

[oldhunter1954]

You have crazy talent. How did you learn to make knifes? I don't think there is a Knife School ?

 

[LRB]

And the knife's tang should extend to the end of the handle. More strength, better balance.

NO, not for a French bouc

To paraphrase what you wrote elsewhere, when one makes a very accurate repro of something, all the good things and faults of the original product are repeated.

Very much agree original knives like this often did not have the void filled with cutler's resin, though some did.

However, it is also true that it is much more difficult to keep or clean blood, gore and bits of flesh out of that area when used for hunting and butchering.

While it is my personal preference only, I don't want a knife that might wind up infecting or poisoning me when a period solution is available to preclude this from happening by filling that area with cutler's resin.

Please don't take this as personal criticism of you, but rather pointing out another problem with the period design.

BTW, I really like the other knives you posted as well.

Gus

Problem is Gus, nary even a trace of resin has been found on any of the recovered / dug trade knives. Nor the English blades either. Unless something new has turned up.

 

[Artificer]

NO, not for a French bouc

Problem is Gus, nary even a trace of resin has been found on any of the recovered / dug trade knives. Nor the English blades either. Unless something new has turned up.

I never consider such information a problem, actually I was very interested to read it. Thank you.

Gus

 

[LRB]

This is my first attempt at recreating the French boucheron scalping knife. I tried going as historically correct as possible. It is based off of a drawing of an original. The blade is 1084 steel, 6" long and 1/8" thick tapered in both directions with 1/8" pins peened in place. The oversized, octagonal handle is made of Beech. Other than the "aged/darkened" appearance I gave the blade and the wood (which I prefer anyways), I think it is fairly accurate. What do you guys think?

View attachment 88823
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Looks very good to me. Ken Hamilton now seems to believe the common boucheron had a third pin near the end of the grips and they being a 2 piece construct. A few hundred, as I recall, turned up together in a river where a large French trade canoe turned over. They were 2 piece slab grips with the third pin. Could be just another variation, or the true common method.