First Shot Misfire

[renovato]

I haven't read all of the replies, so this has probably already been suggested, but you might try enlarging the vent hole. This ends a lot of misfires and it makes the ignition time faster. I used a .70 drill on my Austin & Halleck, and slightly coned the outside with a countersink. If you poke around through the posts, you'll see several very informative threads about doing it properly.

 

[RONNIE struble]

I have a TC 50 flint using pirodex pellets and are having miss fires! Is letting charge in gun a problem! Flash pan does go off!

 

[SDSmlf]

Try loose real black powder instead of Pyrodex pellets. Pyrodex (and other subs), pellets or loose powder, will NOT work reliably in a flintlock.

 

[RONNIE struble]

So there is no way to use pellets in a flint lock?

 

[Griz44Mag]

So there is no way to use pellets in a flint lock?

NO - do not use them in a flintlock.

 

[SDSmlf]

You can load pellets on top of a charge of real black powder. Pricey option. Some have reported burning pellets leaving the barrel like signal flare. Makes little sense not to just use black powder.

 

[Griz44Mag]

I've been having this same problem every time I take my gun to the range. Hoping you folks might have some suggestions.

Every time I go to the range my first shot is a misfire. The priming charge goes off, but it's a classic "flash in the pan." This typically continues to happen until I literally pour some FFFFg into the flash hole in addition to what's in the pan. Then the gun will finally go off, but the lock time is terrible. So that first shot is kind of a waste. Then for the rest of the day it shoots fine. It's just that first shot.

It's like there's an oil bubble in the flash hole. But I always clean out the flash hole with my pick prior to loading it. Could there be something I'm leaving behind in the barrel that's corrupting my first powder charge? Moisture or something?

I tried cleaning it out with GunScrubber degreaser this time after cleaning the barrel in the hopes that will help. That stuff looks like it burns off whatever is in there and then dries itself pretty quickly. Should I take a patch and leave it down there to absorb moisture after I clean the gun? It seems like that would also trap moisture, promoting rust. The air is pretty dry here in VT this time of year, so I tend to think that moisture isn't the problem. I do oil the outside of the barrel and the lock each time after I clean it. Is it possible that oil is working its way down into the flash hole?

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Ben

After cleaning - for the next 24 hours at least, store the gun muzzle down. Let any excess cleaner drain out instead of into the breech.

 

[Zonie]

So there is no way to use pellets in a flint lock?

Whether pellets work in a flintlock depends on which flintlock your talking about.

The flintlock guns that have a vent hole that goes directly thru the wall of the barrel into the bore can only use pellets if you do like SDSmlf described and even then it will only work if the initial amount of real black powder is higher than the distance from the breech plug face to the vent hole.
The reason for this is, if the black powder is not taller, only the side of the pellet will be exposed to the flash and the heat from the powder flash in the pan is not enough to light the synthetic powder the pellet is made from.
The people who make those pellets know that even the flash from a percussion cap won't ignite a pellet if it is made using just the synthetic powder. That's why pellets have a layer of real black powder, mixed with a binder on one or both ends of the pellet.

Thompson Center made one model of their flintlock Hawken rifles that were supposed to work with pellets. I guess they work sometimes but I read quite a few comments by people who owned them that indicated they weren't very reliable if only pellets were used.
These TC guns had a special breech plug that was supposed to guide the pan flash in the pan directly to the black powder base on the pellet.

This said, the only reason I can think of for using pellets is the speed that they can be loaded into the barrel.

On the negative side of using pellets, they cost a fortune compared with loose black powder. They also restrict the powder to one or two amounts of powder which is not conductive to good accuracy. (Usually, the most accurate shots from a muzzleloader will be a very different amount of powder than the 50 or 100 grain pellet sizes). For instance, my .50's shoot best with a 70 grain powder load and my .54's shoot best with a 80 grain powder load. (Yes, these are good for hunting deer.)

 

[SDSmlf]

Thompson Center made one model of their flintlock Hawken rifles that were supposed to work with pellets.

The TC flintlock was called a Firestorm and I have one in the safe. There is a cone on the breech plug face that the pellet sits on when loaded that is supposed to allow the heat/flame from the pan to ignite the pellet on the back as it is held off the breech plug face. Supposed to. Tried the gun with a number of different pellets, Pyrodex, 777 and maybe White Hots. Ignition was sporadic at best, and I remember one type would not ignite at all. With black powder kicker actually had a few pellets leave the barrel without igniting, although never saw the signal flare effect.

 

[45man]

Pellets are the problem. They are designed to be ignited from the rear and have a hole to promote ignition. Some even have a quick start coating on the bottom. FFFFG in the touch hole with a pick should work all the time.

 

[Stumpkiller]

You can load pellets on top of a charge of real black powder. Pricey option. Some have reported burning pellets leaving the barrel like signal flare. Makes little sense not to just use black powder.

Not if you follow the safety instructions on the black-powder. At least the Goex I have. "Do not mix with other powders".

You are mixing it with a self-oxidizing powder and may get unexpected results. Though it certainly has been done: to add "a pinch" before the pellet(s) and then prime with blackpowder. Easier to just use one powder for everything.

 

[RONNIE struble]

Whether pellets work in a flintlock depends on which flintlock your talking about.

The flintlock guns that have a vent hole that goes directly thru the wall of the barrel into the bore can only use pellets if you do like SDSmlf described and even then it will only work if the initial amount of real black powder is higher than the distance from the breech plug face to the vent hole.
The reason for this is, if the black powder is not taller, only the side of the pellet will be exposed to the flash and the heat from the powder flash in the pan is not enough to light the synthetic powder the pellet is made from.
The people who make those pellets know that even the flash from a percussion cap won't ignite a pellet if it is made using just the synthetic powder. That's why pellets have a layer of real black powder, mixed with a binder on one or both ends of the pellet.

Thompson Center made one model of their flintlock Hawken rifles that were supposed to work with pellets. I guess they work sometimes but I read quite a few comments by people who owned them that indicated they weren't very reliable if only pellets were used.
These TC guns had a special breech plug that was supposed to guide the pan flash in the pan directly to the black powder base on the pellet.

This said, the only reason I can think of for using pellets is the speed that they can be loaded into the barrel.

On the negative side of using pellets, they cost a fortune compared with loose black powder. They also restrict the powder to one or two amounts of powder which is not conductive to good accuracy. (Usually, the most accurate shots from a muzzleloader will be a very different amount of powder than the 50 or 100 grain pellet sizes). For instance, my .50's shoot best with a 70 grain powder load and my .54's shoot best with a 80 grain powder load. (Yes, these are good for hunting deer.)

I want to thank you guys for your quick response! I will be going back to black powder! I was using 100gr pellets in my 50cal Hawkins do you think 90gr black powder is equivalent to or close to 100gr pellets.?

thanks in advance!

 

[Grenadier1758]

For many reasons, loose black powder is superior to pellets.

 

[Kansas Jake]

In a 50 caliber somewhere between 60-90 grains will be more than adequate for most hunting situations. Maybe a 50 for target work if it is accurate. I've had good luck with around 70-80 grains of ffg and fffg in a TC Hawken capper. No need to try to make a magnum out of a muzzleloader in my book.

 

[Col. Batguano]

That was an interesting comment on the bored out breech plug as a safety measure in case someone loads smokeless instead of the right stuff. Sort of like having a sub-caliber chamber for powder on a howitzer or Coehorn mortar. That would tell me that pressures are greatest right under the ball, and, that breech plug threads are the least likely thing to yield / rupture in an over-pressure situation. Correct?

 

[ADK Bigfoot]

I have seen many pellets leave the bore of a gun and act like tracers toward their targets. The shots all fell short, like a squib load.

A local doctor, who was always getting the newest and finest muzzleloaders, brought me a fancy new gun that would not shoot good groups at 100 yards. He gave me all the pellets and bullets he had been using. After the first few groups I tried, I threw the pellets away and started using loose powder. Groups shrank immediately, and ignition was no longer an issue. No "smoke trailing pellets" and nice, consistent groups. How can pellets be any faster to load than dumping a pre-measured loose powder load from a plastic tube into the barrel? Marketing nonsense.

Use loose 3F ( 2F is it prefers) in the bore, tap the breech when you load, and prime with 4F or Null B (Swiss) and then sit back and enjoy consistent, regular ignition and groups. Keep your flints sharp and your fizzen dry.

Just my .02. ADK Bigfoot