Euroarms Rogers & Spencer 44 revolver

[Grenadier1758]

Take a look at @Dave Markowitz's Roger and Spencer. Yup, look at the loading lever, the frame, the curve of the grip, shape of the hammer, the front sight and @B P Arn's apology. Not mention the Dixie Gun Works description as a New Model Army 44.

A major reason why the Rogers and Spencer feels different from Colts and Remingtons is that it has a shorter hammer throw. In effect, it's a short action. I bought one by EOA from DGW in London Gray about 10 years ago.

View attachment 63095

It's probably my most accurate percussion revolver, next to my Ruger Old Army. I wish I had one of the target models with adjustable sights.

I have never had a cap jam with it. The large dished out areas around the nipples allow cap fragments to fall right out. It handles fouling better than Remingtons due to the bushing on the face of the cylinder. I've fired up to 42 rounds in one session without wiping or adding more lube, and the gun was still running fine.

I use .454 balls on top of 25 - 30 grains of 3Fg, although I've loaded up to 35 grains of 3Fg Triple 7 in it. That load really let you know you were firing a big bore sixgun! I have loaded .457s in it but they take significantly more effort to load and I don't see the need to strain the loading lever doing so. I'll reserve .457s for the Ruger.

 

[sourdough]

OK, I stand down. I guess I bought an ancient Remington NMA manufactured by DGG/Armi San Paolo/Euroarms. I don't have any Remingtons so I will take this as a bump in the road in the learning curve for me.

Thanks for pointing it out. And B P Arn's apology was not needed. I did what I did and now I own it.

Worse things have happened.

Thanks to all.

Regards,

Jim

 

[Zonie]

OK, I stand down. I guess I bought an ancient Remington NMA manufactured by DGG/Armi San Paolo/Euroarms. I don't have any Remingtons so I will take this as a bump in the road in the learning curve for me.

Thanks for pointing it out. And B P Arn's apology was not needed. I did what I did and now I own it.

Worse things have happened.

Thanks to all.

Regards,

Jim

Actually, if you bought the pistol shown in this picture, you did not buy a "New Model Army" Remington.

What you bought is a reproduction of the Remington-Beals Army revolver.

The Remington-Beals Army was Remington's first army size (.44 cal) revolver and only about 1,900 of them were made.
It's called a Remington-Beals for the man who basically designed the gun, Mr Beals.

This model was presented to the Army for testing and they found several things about it that they didn't like.
One of these things was the pistol would tend to get gummed up rapidly because of the fouling on the face of the gun. To correct this, Remington changed the shape of the frame in front of the cylinder to expose the threads at the rear of the barrel.
Notice how there is almost no gap in this area on the Remington-Beals. By exposing the barrel threads in this area, the sharp edges of the threads scrape off the fouling as the cylinder revolves.

Like the originals, these reproduction Remington-Beals tend to get gummed up after shooting several shots but it really isn't something that most modern shooters would have a problem with by simply scraping off the fouling when they reload the pistol.

Here's another picture showing both the Remington-Beals and the New Model Army.

The Italian companies that made the Remington-Beals quit making them years ago and switched to the New Model Army and Navy which is now the only models they now make.

 

[Kansas Jake]

Those old Remington Beals reproductions have a nice feel to them though. They seem to be a slimmer design than the current reproductions. At least I like mine. Big hands may be a problem with some folks though.

 

[sourdough]

Thanks, guys! I am feeling better about the purchase more and more.

I knew there was a difference between it and the Rem NMA ("1858" misnomer) but it appears I have a lot of learning to do since I am primarily a Colt guy and this will be my first Remington C&B of any type.

Warm regards,

Jim

 

[Bad Karma]

Thanks, guys! I am feeling better about the purchase more and more.

I knew there was a difference between it and the Rem NMA ("1858" misnomer) but it appears I have a lot of learning to do since I am primarily a Colt guy and this will be my first Remington C&B of any type.

Warm regards,

Jim

Come up smelling like a rose didn’t you Jim?

 

[sourdough]

Come up smelling like a rose didn’t you Jim?

In a way, it seems so. I like collecting older model repros as I think that is the way of the future with replicas. Dr. Davis was on the forefront of this over 12 years ago, but his RPRCA website lacked quite a bit insofar as minutiae concerning the revolvers he posted.

I know this revolver is a DGG/ASP but I will not know the date code and other things until I have it in hand.

I guess my quest for a R&S will go on. I will find one!

Thanks for the kudos.

Jim

 

[Dave Markowitz]

Unless you have very large hands I think you'll like that Remington-Beals. I have one from Euroarms. It is noticeable more svelte than my Pietta New Model Army replicas.

An interesting feature on my Euroarms Remington is that it came with chamfered chamber mouths from the factory. I shoot it with .454 balls and it swages them down nicely instead of shaving off a ring.

 

[sourdough]

The Remington realm is a new one for me, and I have a lot to learn. I have small hands but long fingers. I am very curious as to how it fits the hand since I am an 1851 Navy aficionado and they fit my hand well.

Thanks!

Regards,

Jim

 

[jsasser]

New member here digging up a new old post. I have a R&S revolver that experienced a major malfunction at a skirmish. The cylinder jammed up on the line with 5 rounds still hot and ready. The safety guys there completely disassembled the gun on the line to get the cylinder free. I believe now I am in need of a new cylinder. I’ve replaced all the other small parts internally with new, I can’t find a cylinder. Anyone have a line on one??

 

[hawkeye2]

I honestly can't help with a cylinder but why do you think you might need a new one? Can you post some detailed photos of yours? Did the damage to the internals come as a result of the cylinder locking up or did the cylinder lock up because of damage to the parts? Have you assembled the gun with the original cylinder and tried it for function? I'm sorry for all the questions but the R&S is a fairly rugged and trouble free revolver.

 

[hrt4me]

New member here digging up a new old post. I have a R&S revolver that experienced a major malfunction at a skirmish. The cylinder jammed up on the line with 5 rounds still hot and ready. The safety guys there completely disassembled the gun on the line to get the cylinder free. I believe now I am in need of a new cylinder. I’ve replaced all the other small parts internally with new, I can’t find a cylinder. Anyone have a line on one??

So *why* did you replace all the internals?

And *where* did you find new parts?

 

[jsasser]

I’ve found new parts here and there. Dixie gun works, some vendors at one of the nationals for the NSSA, a local guy had some at one of the regionals I shoot at. I am not familiar with the gun at all as far as it’s history goes. So when it locked up, they disassembled it, I had another pietta to shoot with and honestly forgot about the S&R. This all happened a couple years ago. I’ve recently “found” the gun again and it’s all rusted to hell. The new parts are still in their packaging. But the frame and barrel and trigger guard/frame, and cylinder were all rusted very bad. I’ve managed to remove all the rust from the frames and barrel, and polish everything back out. the cylinder is proving to be a pain, and it suffered the most damage. So I’m assuming with the damage it’s suffered from the rusting and the problems that were presented when it locked up, the cylinder is the only thing left to replace. I can’t recall all the names of the parts, but the trigger and stop spring, cylinder stop, hammer, even the trigger are all new.

 

[jsasser]

I should add, the new parts haven’t been assembled into the gun yet, and I still have all of the old parts. The gun is “complete” it is just completely disassembled at the moment too.

 

[jsasser]

Here is the gun assembled with old parts. Notice the amount of pitting on the cylinder.

 

[B P Arn]

Jsasser, I just sent the dis-assembly pictures to you.

The gun should work, providing nothing was damaged when it was taken apart. Unless whoever disassembled the gun used force, the old parts will probably still be good, or at least salvageable.

Keep in mind that the new parts you bought will not just drop in. They will have to be fitted by someone who knows what they are doing.

 

[springfield art]

I recently came into a Euroarms Rogers & Spencer revolver made in 1979 which has a couple of interesting attributes. It appears the previous owner removed the finish to bare metal in the interests of aging the gun. The fellow member I bought it from told me he acquired a large collection from a recently deceased Civil War 'skirmisher' which I took to mean re-enactor. It also appears he replaced the original barrel with either a custom barrel or a special order from Euroarms. He dovetailed a larger front sight blade and the barrel features load info for the gun under the loading lever !
Mechanically it appears to be tight and indexing perfectly. The bore is as new indicating it may not have been shot much if at all.
I was surprised to find that cocking the gun feels nothing like cocking a Colt open top. Those of you who have one of these know what I mean, it's just.. different.
I've yet to shoot the gun but I intend to start with the load info under the barrel. I understand the Rogers & Spencer is an accuarate shooter, am looking forward to some range time and will post results. I would very much like to hear from other Rogers & Spencer owners to learn of any quirks, tips or info.
Here are a few pics;

Nice. BTW, the N-NSA shooters, who do live firing, call themselves 'skirmishers", as opposed to the re-enactors, although there's no hard-fast rule. I got a R&S several years ago at an auction for about $275, un-fired, no box, hidden under the tray of a tackle box; the auctioneer didn't even know it was there. They do have a different "feel" because of the high-hat hammer; I can't cock mine with only one hand; too awkward. Good luck! Nice find! Mine made about late 80's?

 

[springfield art]

It is my understanding that the R&S was not issued during the war and were finally sold to Bannerman's in the late 1800s and sold by them as surplus. There may have been a very few used during the war. I doubt they were available until Bannerman's aquired them. But that is speculation on my part.

You're right. Almost all orig. ones are un-fired, were 'as new' surplus.

 

[Relic shooter]

I have an older Euroarms marked Rogers & Spenser with serial number 009987, anyone have an idea what year it was made ?

 

[FishDFly]

There should be a two (2) letter code stamped on it, with that and the code table you can find out when it was made.

Code would be something like "BN".