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Damascus (Twist) Barrels- Who shoots them?

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I have one I shoot. It's a percussion double 13 gauge marked London Fine Twist. It's a mid-19th century British import in good condition, field grade, nothing fancy or particularly valuable.

I keep loads fairly low, 50-60 grains 2F, equal volume shot, and have collected a few rabbits with it. I've always been impressed that the old originals handle very well, better than most replicas I've shot.

Spence
 
Hi,
I have an English W. Bond percussion double 12 ga. with fine twist barrels, it is a delight to shoot.
I does fine at the trap range and is without mercy on grouse.
If you can find a good Damascus shot gun, get it checked out and have some fun.
Remember it is not a 12 ga. magnum, keep you loads to one ounce and velocity to 1000-1100 fps. with black powder and your gun will last many years to come.
Question: How do I know my loads are doing 1000 fps., EASY load your gun with enough powder to pierce both sides of a soup can at 25 yds. About 80 grains of 2F should work.
Not very technical but it works.
Fred
 
I have one I shoot. It's a percussion double 13 gauge marked London Fine Twist. It's a mid-19th century British import in good condition, field grade, nothing fancy or particularly valuable.

I keep loads fairly low, 50-60 grains 2F, equal volume shot, and have collected a few rabbits with it. I've always been impressed that the old originals handle very well, better than most replicas I've shot.

Spence

Spence , i agree most replicas are almost clubby and don't handle like originals. This is a London made gun, and i can't wait to get it in my grubby hands.
 
Hi,
I have an English W. Bond percussion double 12 ga. with fine twist barrels, it is a delight to shoot.
I does fine at the trap range and is without mercy on grouse.
If you can find a good Damascus shot gun, get it checked out and have some fun.
Remember it is not a 12 ga. magnum, keep you loads to one ounce and velocity to 1000-1100 fps. with black powder and your gun will last many years to come.
Question: How do I know my loads are doing 1000 fps., EASY load your gun with enough powder to pierce both sides of a soup can at 25 yds. About 80 grains of 2F should work.
Not very technical but it works.
Fred

Thanks for the load info Fred...i use a Dutch oven for soup... does the shot have to penetrate both sides of it for 1000 fps?
But seriously, thanks for the info, I'll put it to use soon hopefully.

Btw, are your guns choked or cylinder bore?

Thanks
 
I shoot all of my Damascus guns from my 8 bore through 45/16ga. Cape Gun. The key element as already stated is to keep the pressures low (within what they were originally intended). I love the fact that there are so many old wives tales of death and destruction that I can buy an original Parker Damascus for half of the price of a Pedersoli!
 
I have shot original Damascus barrels in all bore sizes and different ignitions for the past 70 years . I use a volume load on all bore sizes for a 12 it is 2.3/4 drms of FFg powder to 1.1/8 oz of shot ,load has follows powder 2 1/8 card wads shot 1.1/16 over shot '
Feltwad
 
I don't understand this ' keep the pressures low' thing!
Pressures are already low compared to all the Damascus nitro (re) proofed original earea breech loaders!
Who recommends shooting more powder than shot in a reproduction muzzleloader shotgun anyway?
What evidence is there that Damascas is frail and is more dangerous than fluid steel?
I recall reading of tests conducted and nothing was found to be inferior with Damascas barrels.
Is it yet another lore that has become law?
 
Sir I use all my damascus barrelled arms, muzzle loading shotguns, and a jaeger rifle I even have an old Hollis breach loader that had been used with Black Ranger shells years before I got it. I might add I only use black powder cartridges in it as it was never proofed for nitro.
 
You can't cut rifling in to damascus iron because it would slice across the grain, one solution is a tape wound core o_O
sleeved2.jpg
 
I think what puts shooters off shooting original muzzle loader with Damascus barrel in the States is because they go more for heavy loads .Compared to what we in the UK class has a standard load some shooters in the States use a 10 bore load in a 12 bore which I find it is not needed
Feltwad
 
I think the idea that Damascus barrels were dangerous came about at the turn of the 20th century when smokeless powder became available to the average guy.
From what I've heard over the years, a LOT of Damascus shotguns that were made back in the black powder days blew up when people poured smokeless down their guns barrel.

Then, like now, shooting smokeless powder in guns made for using black powder was a poor idea but people back then didn't really know just how dangerous it can be.
 
I think the idea that Damascus barrels were dangerous came about at the turn of the 20th century when smokeless powder became available to the average guy.
From what I've heard over the years, a LOT of Damascus shotguns that were made back in the black powder days blew up when people poured smokeless down their guns barrel.

Then, like now, shooting smokeless powder in guns made for using black powder was a poor idea but people back then didn't really know just how dangerous it can be.
Exactly, the old human trait of blaming something else for their own error!

If I try to run my diesel engine on regular gas and it destroys the engine does that mean diesel engines are trash? No, it means I am a numbskull!
 
I think the idea that Damascus barrels were dangerous came about at the turn of the 20th century when smokeless powder became available to the average guy.
From what I've heard over the years, a LOT of Damascus shotguns that were made back in the black powder days blew up when people poured smokeless down their guns barrel.

Then, like now, shooting smokeless powder in guns made for using black powder was a poor idea but people back then didn't really know just how dangerous it can be.
Most of the old smokeless powders such has Smokeless Diamond , Schultze and other did have printed on the container {Not for Muzzle Loaders] . Damascus barrels on early breech loaders were also for black powder but with the introduction of smokeless most were reproofed at the proof house for nitro . This was a advantage for guns of that period here in the UK because of the lack of a proof house in the States.
Feltwad
 
Most of the old smokeless powders such has Smokeless Diamond , Schultze and other did have printed on the container {Not for Muzzle Loaders] . Damascus barrels on early breech loaders were also for black powder but with the introduction of smokeless most were reproofed at the proof house for nitro . This was a advantage for guns of that period here in the UK because of the lack of a proof house in the States.
Feltwad
Feltwad has it spot on. Damascus barrels took re proofing for nitro readily.
In muzzleloaders the danger from smokeless is not barrels bursting. No, it's the higher pressure venting via the nipple and old nipples were more open or less strong than modern ones.
If some survived no loss of sight that's brilliant but eventually someone somewhere would burst a barrel with nitro in a muzzleloader.
The nasty experience would taint their opinion of Damascas barrels and they would repeatedly spout the tale so much that everyone ends up thinking how bad Damascas barrels are!
It's no different than certain cars or motorcycles being given the name of 'widow maker's! Or was it a lack of understanding on the driver or riders part that killed him!!

B.
 
I think the idea that Damascus barrels were dangerous came about at the turn of the 20th century when smokeless powder became available to the average guy.
From what I've heard over the years, a LOT of Damascus shotguns that were made back in the black powder days blew up when people poured smokeless down their guns barrel.

Then, like now, shooting smokeless powder in guns made for using black powder was a poor idea but people back then didn't really know just how dangerous it can be.
Damascus are more dangerous with more bursts due to a obstruction than black powder. The worst offender is snow, and soil in the muzzle this is followed with a close second to using thin card wads which often are bypassed by the ramrod and left on the barrel wall which when fired becomes a obstruction. To explain my meaning enclosed is a image of a burst Damascus barrel caused by using too thin card wads .
Feltwad

Burst Barrel
 
Damascus are more dangerous with more bursts due to a obstruction than black powder. The worst offender is snow, and soil in the muzzle this is followed with a close second to using thin card wads which often are bypassed by the ramrod and left on the barrel wall which when fired becomes a obstruction. To explain my meaning enclosed is a image of a burst Damascus barrel caused by using too thin card wads .
Feltwad

Burst Barrel
Good it burst the way it did!
 
I well recall in the late 60s/ early 70s almost every box of shot shells had a warning to the effect.."don't shoot these in Damascus barrels or it could explode".
I knew many who had a breach loading twist barrel who stopped shooting them because ammo wasn't available. And many old breach guns were 2 1/2" and a 2 3/4" would be dangerous.
A good friend still loads 2 1/2" black powder shells and enjoys shooting trap. But a few nitro magnum 2 3/4" shells would ruin it.
 
I well recall in the late 60s/ early 70s almost every box of shot shells had a warning to the effect.."don't shoot these in Damascus barrels or it could explode".
I knew many who had a breach loading twist barrel who stopped shooting them because ammo wasn't available. And many old breach guns were 2 1/2" and a 2 3/4" would be dangerous.
A good friend still loads 2 1/2" black powder shells and enjoys shooting trap. But a few nitro magnum 2 3/4" shells would ruin it.
Here in the UK most boxes of 2.3/4 inch cartridges had a warning {Not to be used in 2.1/2 inch chambers} also Damascus barrels with some choke were Stamped {Not For Ball}.
Feltwad
 
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