Cylinder locked Pietta 1860 Army

[1950DAVE]

Before I disassemble I would like to have some insight as to what might be wrong. I posted this a few weeks ago when I acquired it. It came with a conversion cylinder but I intend to get the BP cylinder for it. My son has everything to load 45LC for it but I would fell much safer with black. It appears to have never been fired , 2019 mfg date.It has locked and will not rotate. Hammer is at half cock. It will go to full cock and when trigger is pulled hammer will only fall to half cock. When barrel and cylinder are removed there is no change. Never had a problem like this with my 1851.
Dave

 

[hrt4me]

my speculation is the hand is binding somewhere on something, preventing the cylinder from rotating and also preventing the hammer from rotating all the way forward...

the fact you can remove the cylinder shows the bolt is not raised fully into its cylinder notch

 

[Phil Coffins]

I‘d be expecting the bolt/trigger spring. The leg that returns the bolt in particular.

 

[Brokenbear]

Were it mine ..and if I understand your presentation ..I would contact A Pietta repair center and see what the cost of sending them the pistol sans the cylinder and have them fit a BP cylinder and straighten up the internals in the process
I have ZERO experience with Pietta nor with a conversion cylinder but in applying some reads and logic ..I read not all attempts to use "conversion cylinder" are simple drop in operations ..in my mind if that is true then is it possible the conversion cylinder was incorrect in application or needed fitting beyond the previous owners ability to field fit??
And if the cylinder attempt was "forced" you may have internal "stuff" going on beyond normal clean up measures
Hopefully you are into it cheap enough to professionally right it ..and good luck and happu new year

Bear

 

[m-g willy]

When you put it on full cock ,,,hold the hammer back with your thumb and pull the trigger while holding the hammer back.Then with the trigger pulled,,lower the hammer with your thumb while holding the trigger back,,See if the hammer goes all the way forward then.

 

[45D]

Before I disassemble I would like to have some insight as to what might be wrong. I posted this a few weeks ago when I acquired it. It came with a conversion cylinder but I intend to get the BP cylinder for it. My son has everything to load 45LC for it but I would fell much safer with black. It appears to have never been fired , 2019 mfg date.It has locked and will not rotate. Hammer is at half cock. It will go to full cock and when trigger is pulled hammer will only fall to half cock. When barrel and cylinder are removed there is no change. Never had a problem like this with my 1851.
Dave

Sounds like the cam is a little proud and can't push the bolt arm over and/or the "return bevel" is not enough or non-egistant. The return bevel is the angle cut on top of the left bolt arm that allows the cam to push the arm over as the hammer falls. So, sounds like the bolt arm is stopping the hammer since the cam can't do its job.

Mike

 

[1950DAVE]

When you put it on full cock ,,,hold the hammer back with your thumb and pull the trigger while holding the hammer back.Then with the trigger pulled,,lower the hammer with your thumb while holding the trigger back,,See if the hammer goes all the way forward then.

Thanks m g. Doesn't work.

Sounds like the cam is a little proud and can't push the bolt arm over and/or the "return bevel" is not enough or non-egistant. The return bevel is the angle cut on top of the left bolt arm that allows the cam to push the arm over as the hammer falls. So, sounds like the bolt arm is stopping the hammer since the cam can't do its job.

Thanks Mike for the reply. After printing out a diagram of the parts suspect something along this line. Having bought it really reasonably I will disassemble and check it out as I go. Maybe a little deburring will help.
Dave

 

[ZUG]

Sounds like you purchased a revolver from "BUBBA". He could not get it to work so he sold it to you .

 

[Pphillips]

I recently rebuilt mine . It's a 51 navy but they are close. While rebuilding mine I had the exact problem. Mine was a to stiff trigger/stop spring.i put in one not so stiff and it works great now

 

[45D]

I recently rebuilt mine . It's a 51 navy but they are close. While rebuilding mine I had the exact problem. Mine was a to stiff trigger/stop spring.i put in one not so stiff and it works great now

I doubt that was a fix for the hammer only falling half way. The two are totally unrelated. With the trigger pulled, the trigger spring has no effect. The bolt spring just keeps the bolt in locked position. That being the reason for looking at the cam / bolt arm interface.

Mike

 

[m-g willy]

Ok ,,here you go,,take the back strap off,,( three screws) pull the grips off,,Then take the main spring off,,Now see if the revolver cycles,,There is a chance some rube put a main spring on that is to long and jamming the works,,This is a wild shot but I seen an extra long main spring cause problems on single actions before.

 

[1950DAVE]

https://www.cascity.com/pdf/Tuning_the_Pietta_Part_One.pdfFound the problem hammer cam ( B in the first pic on page 17) was loose and was jammed against bolt. Pressed back in place now it works smoothly.
Thanks for all the replies folks.
Dave

 

[Pphillips]

They can be a pain in the, but it's so worth it. Just rebuilt my 1970 Armi . The Italian company went out of business on the 70s. No parts anywhere. UT it looks just like the 51 Pietta 44 Navy. I bought intern Pietta parts, and with a file and a dremel I made them fit. There was a lot of taking apart and putting together. But she shoots like a dream. Don't be afraid to grind on something a little. So enjoy the pistol and I hope all goes well

 

[Dude]

What's to prevent a repeat? I'd get some Red loctite in there, or wicking loctite.

 

[Phil Coffins]

Just go‘s to show that 45d knows his stuff!

 

[hawkeye2]

Just go‘s to show that 45d knows his stuff!

One of the best.

 

[Columbus]

They can be a pain in the, but it's so worth it. Just rebuilt my 1970 Armi . The Italian company went out of business on the 70s. No parts anywhere.

A lot of ASM parts are available from Deer Creek, they list for the 1851, 1860, and 1861 ASM revolvers.

1851 Colt ASM Revolver Parts (deercreekproducts.net)

 

[1950DAVE]

Thanks to forum member " poker" I got my BP cylinder today. A really nice guy to deal with. Looking to shooting it soon.
Here it is.

 

[Tazman1602]

https://www.cascity.com/pdf/Tuning_the_Pietta_Part_One.pdfFound the problem hammer cam ( B in the first pic on page 17) was loose and was jammed against bolt. Pressed back in place now it works smoothly.
Thanks for all the replies folks.
Dave

THANK YOU for that link. I’ve got a NIB 1851 and 1860 and I will be going through them both with this document.

Art

 

[1950DAVE]

Art, i find this stuff the most helpful. Videos are ok but I am old school and do best with print and pics.
Enjoy shooting your pistols.
Dave