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CVA drum and nipple

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Desperate Lee

45 Cal.
Joined
Jan 2, 2019
Messages
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Location
Texas
I see several CVA pistol barrels for sale on Evilbay without the drum and nipple. Most day they are from kits. The CVA kit I have has the nipple and drum installed already. Can these be purchased separately and installed by a novice? I want to build a Hawken style pistol and I want it 50 cal. Any help here is appreciated.
 
CVA breech construction is an oft discussed subject on the rifle forums. Those barrels without drum and nipple you see have undoubtedly been hopelessly damaged by improper removal. Do a search on this forum, you will find diagrams of how they are assembled. In short, they were meant to never be dissassembled. If you can get those barrels for about a fifty cents each, they might make good paperweights. Really, pass on them.
 
Some after-market replacement drums for CVA's may have a pre-drilled nipple hole while others don't.
A drum with a pre-drilled nipple hole may still need to be tapped to make the nipple threads.
The pre-drilled nipple hole may not line up with the hammer and could require careful fitting or a shim to
line up the hammer and the nipple and to make the drum fit tight against the barrel.

A drum without a pre-drilled hole will require more work & more risk in order to complete the installation.
If a person doesn't have experience then it could be a losing proposition to get involved with a barrel from eBay.
One mistake in completing the work and a person may need to start over with another replacement drum.

When buying barrels off Ebay, it's buyer beware and there's no guarantee that the project will work out in the end.
 
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Ok guys are there any instructions anywhere that tells you how to do this? Like a good rebuild instruction book. I have several gunsmithing black powder manuals but none say anything about removing a drum and replacing it. I like this kinda stuff.
 
I see several CVA pistol barrels for sale on Evilbay without the drum and nipple. Most day they are from kits. The CVA kit I have has the nipple and drum installed already. Can these be purchased separately and installed by a novice? I want to build a Hawken style pistol and I want it 50 cal. Any help here is appreciated.
All CVA parts are available, you can even convert a percussion to flintlock.
https://cva.com/
Keith.
 
Ok guys are there any instructions anywhere that tells you how to do this?
No, there never has been because it's huge liability issue. Each of that type of breech/drum system is individually indexed and made at the factory. Each individual has to take personal responsibility for changing or reconditioning the Spanish made breech system and it's never been advised here to do so.
Here is how it's done;
CVA1.jpg


There may be many here that have done a replacement and shared how they have done so,, but there is no "tutorial" available.
 
The hole at position "D" would have to be drilled after he drum was installed from down the bore. That requires a special long drill bit with a guide and stop. All the threads are metric.

The only way to use those barrels is to cut the plug off and start again. You will need, taps, dies, drills, and really a lathe to do a good job.The barrel is probably an odd metric size across the flats.

Looks like somebody is stripping guns for parts and does not realize he ruined the barrels for use. The drums that he is probably selling separately are useless. If a drum did not come off the exact barrel, there is about zero chance it will fit properly.

A barrel as described is junk. Just buy a good barrel from Green Mountain or other vendor of usable parts.
 
Uummm....
That above article/pic is exactly the way the breech/bolster assy is put together on my mountain rifle... which, unscrewing and removing the bolster has always been part of my cleaning routine, mostly because it seemed reasonable to do so.
Am I to acertaine that my clensing efforts were inconsistent with approved protocol, resulting in operational deficiency of the afore mentioned fieldpiece?
 
@LeLoup stated that a CVA "can even be converted from percussion to flint". I wish it were so! I have a CVA "Kentucky" rifle in percussion that I wish I could convert, but reliable B/P gunsmiths and many other people on this site have told me that this is categorically impossible. And, there is no information about older CVA models on their website; it is all about in-lines.
 
@LeLoup stated that a CVA "can even be converted from percussion to flint". I wish it were so! I have a CVA "Kentucky" rifle in percussion that I wish I could convert, but reliable B/P gunsmiths and many other people on this site have told me that this is categorically impossible. And, there is no information about older CVA models on their website; it is all about in-lines.

CVA essentially went under or into receivership around 1990 CVA traditional muzzleloaders became Traditions rifles and CVA began making other guns.
Back in the 1980's when CVA made traditional rifles it was Possible to order every part for every gun they made, they even published a parts catalog. You could buy a flintlock barrel and a flint lock and convert a percussion to flint.

As for CVA pistol barrels on ebay missing bolsters, I wouldn't touch them with a ten foot pole. CVA bolsters are not intended to be removed.
 
Uummm....
That above article/pic is exactly the way the breech/bolster assy is put together on my mountain rifle... which, unscrewing and removing the bolster has always been part of my cleaning routine, mostly because it seemed reasonable to do so.
Am I to acertaine that my clensing efforts were inconsistent with approved protocol, resulting in operational deficiency of the afore mentioned fieldpiece?
CVA and Traditions were quite clear that removing the drum / breech would violate their warranty.

You are correct that you are not cleaning your rifle according to approved protocol. To clean your mountain rifle, remove the wedges and remove the barrel. Remove the nipple and put the breech in a pail of cleaning solution (water with maybe a few drops of dishwashing soap) and pump your cleaning patched rod to flush out all the fouling.

Now if you were getting the drum to align with the hammer and you could still get the rifle to fire a cap, then you did not incur an operational deficiency. You certainly do not need to remove the drum or for that matter, the screw at the end of the drum. I encourage you to simplify your cleaning regimen.
 
I see several CVA pistol barrels for sale on Evilbay without the drum and nipple. Most day they are from kits. The CVA kit I have has the nipple and drum installed already. Can these be purchased separately and installed by a novice? I want to build a Hawken style pistol and I want it 50 cal. Any help here is appreciated.

Dixie sells CVA drums and nipples
 
The CVA drum and nipple (https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index/page/product/product_id/4041/category_id/386/category_chain/350,384,386/product_name/NP0905+CVA+Drum+&+Nipple) is not the replacement for the drum and nipple for a mountain rifle or any of the CVA / Traditions breeches illustrated in necchi's post #6 above. That drum provides less than half of the threaded section that supports the breech.

There are some CVA breeches that do not use the drilled through drum and the Dixie drum and nipple is threaded correctly for that breech. The drum and nipple offered in the Dixie catalog is for the conventional breech plug with the drum installed in front of the breech plug. Of course you must realize that with the nipple installed, getting the nipple to be aligned with the hammer is an installation nightmare. There is no likelihood that the threads in the barrel will match the threads on the drum. Just not a practical solution for replacement of the drum or converting a conventionally breeched CVA flintlock to percussion.
 
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I have purchased barrels for gun building off e-bay and as many things on e-bay some klutz has tried to be a master gunsmith and damaged the piece. Expecting this when I purchase the barrel I expect to cut and install a new breech plug. I got out of the habit of e-bay because of this. By far ahead purchasing a new barrel. Then concentrate on the lock and furniture to wood fit. My opinion.
 
Dixie sells CVA drums and nipples
Yes, and they are cheap too. So why didn't the ebay seller buy and install new bolsters on the barrels before he listed them, making them whole again?
Hmmmm.

It also raises the question of "how the barrels came to be without bolsters in the first place?"

Again I wouldn't touch them with a ten foot pole.
 
Some things are put together with a 1000# torque tool so leave alone. Bolsters and drums need not taken off. I use a tool to get the nipple holes aligned to the hammer after the drum is tight. A clean out screw can be removed for a better flush but use anti seize on the threads. Same for a nipple.
I have the tool to remove the plug on TC's but no vise will hold the barrels when a 20# sledge is needed.
 
I recently picked up a CVA Mt. Pistol at a flea for cheap. I knew there was problems with the rusty bore. Once I got it home I dropped a rod down and it is loaded, perhaps even double charged. It is also rusted in place. Does the Mt. Pistol have the threaded through bolster as is seen in the Mt Rifle? I think I am going to have to pull the breech plug to clear this mess. I have 2 of the US made Mt. Rifles, and the bolster is easy to remove from both of them. Never tried to remove the breech plug. Thanks for any info about the pistol bolster.
 
Just took a look down the barrel of my Mountain Pistol. The answer is yes, it does have the through breech plug drum. Start soaking that stuck ball with Kroil or your favorite penetrant oil. You are probably going to need penetrating oil on the drum as well. Pull the nipple and start soaking.
 
I see several CVA pistol barrels for sale on Evilbay without the drum and nipple. Most day they are from kits. The CVA kit I have has the nipple and drum installed already. Can these be purchased separately and installed by a novice? I want to build a Hawken style pistol and I want it 50 cal. Any help here is appreciated.

This is not as complicated as it seems. I had occasion to replace a drum in a CVA and it was no more difficult than installing in a barrel wall. If anything, the CVA/Traditions method of installing a drum is much safer and secure than installing a drum in a barrel wall. All just my opinion after having replaced a CVA drum and installed a few drums through the barrel wall.

First off, the actual installation is not as pretty as the picture that CVA published. Below are a couple pictures of the drum I removed because the nipple threads had been buggered beyond any repair.

drum1.jpg


drum2.jpg


You can see that the end of the drum was not neatly drilled with a hole and with the threads extending beyond the hole as shown in the CVA diagram.

To replace, you get the correct drum with the correct thread pitch and length of threads and turn it in tight. Mark the forward face of the drum with a marker and remove it. Use a rat tail file to file a groove in the forward facing portion of the end of the threads at a 45* angle to achieve the approximate shape of the drum above. No drill down the bore needed!

Use a drum that is NOT drilled and tapped for the nipple. At the same time that you marked the front face of the drum for direction, place the barrel in the rifle and mark the position where the hammer tells you it wants to strike the nipple. Drill and tap for a nipple and then replace the drum in the barrel.

Done in less than an hour.
 

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