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Cracked stock- need repair advice.

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RhinoDave

40 Cal.
Joined
Sep 22, 2009
Messages
186
Reaction score
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Location
Southeastern Mi.
This is a Richland Arms Yorkshire rifle. I would like to repair this without having to restock it. I'm thinking about running a dowel up through the rear trigger guard mounting area to hide it but I can't get quite as good an angle as if I went down through the wrist area which would leave a visable pin. Any ideas and suggestions are needed as I've never done this and I want to make sure it's safe to shoot. Dowel size and length suggestions would be appreciated.
2946919800104169197S600x600Q85.jpg

More pictures are here
 
Ive seen where a screw or two was used and hidden of course you would pre drill and get a long enough screw's is it cracked through or is it just a surface thing ?
 
FWIW for my gunsmithing I've switched from wood dowels with grooves or lines cut in them (to allow the glue to make a mechanical lock, plus air to escape) to graphite arrow-type shafting or fishing rod material.

I'll cut a few 1/16" to 1/8" holes every inch or so, so that the air can ESCAPE the blind hole and the joint stays fully wetted. Putting a solid dowel into a blind hole with too tight a fit is one sure way to make a dry joint!

These graphite tubes work slick, albeit non-PC, haha!! Plus the cut holes also serve as a mechanical lock too. I wet out the holes with special ultra thin epoxy, which absorbs really well and fully into the wood pores (as I heat/warm the wood, NOT the epoxy) and upon cooling, the wood will suck the thin epoxy in.

Once kicked, I'll use the standard thickness or thickened epoxy to effect the repair.
 
Ouch, crack is right in a knot. I'm leaning towards Mike's suggestion, drill where it would be the most effective and hide the hole with something fancy. I would even think about epoxying an all-thread bolt in there for maximum strength. Probably best to drill a small escape hole to get the air out.

Another idea, and a more traditional repair, would be to inlet plates on both sides of the crack, and sandwich together with bolts. I've seen a wrist on an expensive custom Hawken repaired this way, and it actually looked pretty cool. The bigger and thicker the plates, the stronger the repair, certainly more so than a single wooden dowel. Would be quite a conversation piece. Bill
 
I had a smoothbore stock break in about the same place. I drilled a 3/8" blind hole in the butt part and then a matching blind hole in the front. I took a long 1/4" stainless steel bolt and cut off the head. Fitted it into the holes and made sure everything lined up. Made up some epoxy cement with a little bit of coloring mixed in so it wouldn't stand out. Filled the holes with the epoxy and then the rest of the crack. Put the stainless steel rod in and then pushed everything together. That was about 16 years ago and I still shoot the gun.

16 years ago all I had to work with was the standard 5 minute epoxy. I think a slower setting epoxy would "soak" into the wood better. The trick is to use the stainless steel screw, for strength and as a rebar to hold to the epoxy.

Many Klatch
 
I strengthened a stock where a slight crack was following the grain by drilling a pair of parallel holes.
Then marked the steel drill bits I used and sacrificed them by cutting them off at the precise lengths, completely coated them with epoxy and tapped them back into the holes.
 
If I were repairing your stock I would put the dowels where the strength would be best. I also would use more than one. I like the down from the top of the wrist area better from your photograph. A couple oak dowels of the biggest feasible size glued in place will make it very strong. And do remember to make a provision for the air to escape. You can crack the wood if t you don't. Try to match the stain color and line the grain up as best you can and it may not be as objectionable as you might think!
 
Well, I guess it's time for a quick update and to get a little advice on the repair. I took Mike's advice and drilled it down through the wrist and where I could get it through the center of the crack and at a ninety degree angle. It's a 3/8 dowel and it is 3.5 inches long.
Top of wrist with dowel cutoff.
2848684890104169197S425x425Q85.jpg

I also added a 3/8 square dowel to the underside of the stock between the rear trigger plate and the rear screw of the trigger guard.
Area before repair:
2556661540104169197S425x425Q85.jpg

After repair (haven't gotten around to inletting the triggerguard yet):
2880989190104169197S425x425Q85.jpg

I'm still planning on putting a couple of wing inlays on each side of the wrist but haven't decided on using small screws or just nailing them in place. I have ordered two brass wings and a shield to cover the dowel on the wrist. The wing inlays will look like the picture below but will be brass and not silver. Any comments or suggestions are most welcome.
2587458140104169197S425x425Q85.jpg
 
Just a thought a lot of the old originals were field repaired with a rawhide wrap that had been sewn wet and allowed to shrink down. More than likely back then that may have been all that was done to it!

I have got a book if I can find the reference I will post it!
 
I agree with Cliff,

The last thing I would do with an already weakend wrist is to remove wood for an inlay, rawhide wrap would do the job of hiding the crack and help support the wrist.
 
This is the reference I was talking to using a rawhide wrap to repair or in your case to add extra strength too the area and hide the repaired area.

It is from the book Firearms, Traps, And Tool Of The Mountain Man by Carl P. Russell.
This reference is from page 74 of the book. You will have to excuse the quality as scanning it on my scanner was the only was to show this picture to you that I had.

The reference at the bottom of the page says and I quote:
"The top unmarked specimen is the Bright Angel Lodge, Grand Canyon National Park, and its history is not known. The others, all by Leman, are captured or surrendered Indian rifles taken by the U.S. Army from the Sioux and Cheyenne in the 1870"s. The bottom specimen is in the Missouri Historical Society and the five above were once in the National Museum as parts of the U.S. Cartridge Co. Collection. Now they are owned by various collectors. All show the rawhide repairs so characteristic of of used Indian arms. Splintered stocks and even loose lock plates were repaired, after a fashion, by the warrior far from gunshops. Wet rawhide was wrapped, tacked on, or well sewed around the broken parts. As it dried it tended to shrink tight to the gun and became hard as bone. The drawings are by Glenn Dines.

Hawkenwraprefrence.jpg


Hope that helps define what I was talking about!
 
Wood with a knot there should never have been used in a gun stock. But, it is too late now. I would be hesitant of this repair. It could come undone, depending on the rifle's recoil. Also, even moderate side pressure will break the stock. It is only the thickness (and toughness) of the dowels that is giving strength to the stock in the repair area.

I often encounter these types of break, especially with nitro hunting rifles. Where re stocking is not an option (time, cost etc.); I fix as follows:

I strip the gun and clamp the fore piece in a padded vice. Using acetone in a hypodermic and needle, I GENTLY flex the stock so the crack opens a bit and then squirt acetone into the crack. This serves two purposes: One, it shows the extent of the crack (don't be surprised if the acetone runs out in places you never thought was cracked and two: it dissolves the oil in the wood so the glue can 'take' better. Allow to dry.

Then, use a good quality industrial super glue (not the gel) and, again slightly flexing the stock, add the super glue liberally. Gently flex and work the glue into the crack. The glue will go where the acetone went.

Then, use copper plate to clad the outside of the stock. This is an accepted traditional method of repair and is often seen on old guns; especially the hard kickers.

Best material to use is the copper plate salvaged from junk water heaters (geysers). The heating and cooling cycles not only anneals the plate, but gives it a genuine 100+ year old patina that is impossible to duplicate. Use counter sunk brass screws to fix the plate to the stock, spaced about 1/4" - 3/8" apart. Be sure to counter sink the plate as well, otherwise you'll shred your hand under recoil.

Incredibly strong mend: used on doubles up to .577 nitro and never had a failure.

Hope this helps.
 
that's a bad crack! it's not the result of stress, it's from the knot drying out and the surrounding wood shrinking, separating the grain where it changes direction. a flaw in the blank, in an area that would eliminate it from being used as a stock. any fix will most likey never hold up as the surrounding area will continually move in opposite directions with humididty changes.
if were to repair it i wouldn't use wood as a dowel. i would be tempted to use a brass or steel pin of about 3/8 dia. to effect some rigidity in the area because the crack will continue to open and close as humidity changes no mater how it's fixed or how well it's glued.
 
Thanks to all that have offered tips and suggestions. I think I'll just add the one inlay on the cheek side across the part that has already been cracked. I should mention that this stock was cracked and repaired before I bought it but I didn't think the repair was adequate. The crack was already filled with some sort of glue and there was a much smaller plug or pin down through the crack from the wrist area. My much larger dowel goes under the smaller dowel and is more centered through the middle of the crack. I'm going to leave the lock side that hasn't cracked through alone for now. The rawhide wrap is an interesting idea. I'm curious as to how well the rawhide would take some stain to possibly match the color of the stock? This rifle is a 45 cal that will only be used with PRB and target loads on paper. I'm not a hunter and only shoot for fun.
 
Rawhide will take stain! Now as too an exact match I doubt it. I knew from rereading your post that the repair had already been done.
The recommendation for the rawhide was intended more as a cover-up. However back in the day it was used a real repair. Gunsmiths and the ability to do repairs in the field usually didn't go hand in hand. If you read the diaries and manuscript from the traders and such they often had a gunsmith in there company that could do repairs in the field so to speak. Lewis and Clark had a gunsmith int here company. However as most trading companies of the day they also carried backup weapons.
The ones in the pics were predominantly used by the Indians. The repairs they made had to last and the rawhide applied correctly was used to facilitate many repairs as I stated! In the book I was referencing it also states that most problems with guns, their barrels and other problems could be traced back to blocked barrels or ineffective cleaning, or to say it in laymen terms, operator error. Cracking the skull of an enemy when the rifle was empty, a double load, often resulted in cracked or broken stocks!
 
Well after giving it some more thought, I decided on a brass back strap over the wrist and comb. I think it's a little over kill but after all this if it comes apart it will time to tear it apart and sell off the parts. More pictures after it's all done and back together.
2872390540104169197S600x600Q85.jpg

2372722260104169197S600x600Q85.jpg
 
I would make a new stock for it. That stock was a problem from day one.....

Keith Lisle
 
All the repairs are finished so I'm using this stock as practice for doing some wire inlay before I do anymore to the TC Hawken I'm refinishing. Thanks again for all the ideas and suggestions. More pictures of the repairs so far and I'll add more as I get the wire inlays done and the rifle refinished.

Brass strap inlayed and nailed in place.
2373364190104169197S600x600Q85.jpg

Side view of inlay area.
2585442770104169197S600x600Q85.jpg

Wing inlay across crack.
2464430870104169197S600x600Q85.jpg
 
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