Closest powder grain size to original?

Discussion in 'Smoothbore' started by Stantheman86, Jun 11, 2019.

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  1. Jun 11, 2019 #1

    Stantheman86

    Stantheman86

    Stantheman86

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    For the big bore Smoothies like .69's etc, is anyone having better results with 1.5f or 1f vs 2f?

    Does 1f foul the bore faster or more?

    What grain do people feel is the closest to the "original" musket charge powder used in the 17-1800's?

    Just looking for opinions, a 100gr charge of Old Eynsford 2f works well in my Pedersoli 1816 Springfield, is reliable and doesn't foul bad so I'm hesitant to change but still curious if people feel other grain sizes work better.
     
  2. Jun 11, 2019 #2

    Rifleman1776

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    Not really answering your question, but for wat it's worth: I once had a pound of Swiss 1 1/2 Fg given to me. I tried using it in my flint smoothie 20 ga. I could not get that stuff to ignite hardly at all. Of course, I was using 4Fg bp for primer. I had a picture of that powder compared to other bp. It definitely was different stuff. Might have been designed for bp cartridge. But do keep this in mind before spending yer money.
     
  3. Jun 11, 2019 #3

    Stantheman86

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    I already have a couple pounds of 1.5f and most of a pound of 1f I got by accident.

    I'm thinking if 2f works , is accurate and burns clean I'm not gonna deviate until I get a gun that maybe has a strange preference for 1f.

    I bought the 1.5f because Brett from paper cartridges.com says it works the best in Pritchett cartridges .
     
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  4. Jun 11, 2019 #4

    BrownBear

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    Dunno about the original stuff other than the "impression" from oldsters I've known that it was pretty course.

    For a number of years I've been using 1f Goex for all my shot loads (equal volumes powder and shot) and for ball in 62, 69 cal and in my Bess. Fouling is ZERO issue if you are using lubed patches/wads and your lube is keeping the fouling soft like it should. Each new load you seat pushes the fouling down the bore onto the top of the powder and it's launched on the next shot. Yeah, there's fouling, but there's no buildup of hard stuff to make loading difficult.

    BTW- I even use 1f in the pan of my Bess with perfect happiness. The size of those pans tells me that's what the original users did too. No piddling around with priming flasks required.
     
  5. Jun 11, 2019 #5

    tenngun

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    F size was established early, middle eighteenth century I think. By early nineteenth century most powders were figured in that size and sold as such. F was common in muskets, and double f was more popular in early nineteenth for everything except very small guns and pistols.
    In eighteenth century ballistic test were done with ballistic pendulums.
    It wasn’t as accurate as modern chonographs but velocities obtained with good powder in test were in the same range as modern test with the same charges.
    I think you just have to play with what works best for you. I don’t believe any one gun has one best charge.
     
  6. Jun 11, 2019 #6

    Brokennock

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    Can't tell you about original powder granule size.
    I shoot 2 different 20 gauge smoothbores. I mostly use 3f in both of them. I notice much less fouling than with 2f, especially with shot loads. And, it takes a little less power for the same results ballisticly. Maybe a slight bit more recoil than with 2f for same results, and some say the lower pressure of 2f produces better shot patterns. But I've also seen reports of 1f loads being grossly underpowered unless using large charges of powder.
     
  7. Jun 12, 2019 at 2:52 AM #7

    DaveC

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    FFg Goex for me. FFFg for Miniés. historically, musket power was coarse. Powder charges were often larger than what is used today, since powder has changed to a degree.
     
  8. Jun 12, 2019 at 3:59 AM #8

    jime444

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    My aunt found an original horn dated 1822 on it about 40 years ago at a farm auction. As far as we know, and according to the sources kin, it was great, great great,, great grandads and hadn’t had the plug out since he last used it, about 1840-50. Curious, we finally got the plug out and it appeared very similar to then current DuPont 2fg. Surprised us. Very consistent particle sizes, and had been graphited or similar. Good looking stuff. We made a small pile and carefully set it off. Very vigorous, similar to then current powder avail,!dupont. Unfortunately, grandads rifle was in pieces, having been used as a play toy for many years. It’s been said that Curtis and Harvey was very good powder equivalent to Swiss brand today. Wouldn’t surprise me.
     
  9. Jun 12, 2019 at 4:33 AM #9

    tenngun

    tenngun

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    Had some CH back in the 70s, $5.00 a pound when GO was $3.50. Shot low with lighter recoil. About that time Lyman came out with its Black Powder ballistics book. It showed that it took about 30% more CH to get the same velocities as GO, but did produce much lower chamber pressures even when loaded to get the same velocities
     
  10. Jun 12, 2019 at 5:26 AM #10

    Stantheman86

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    I'll have to load some cartridges with different grain sizes and see what works better.
     
  11. Jun 12, 2019 at 11:05 AM #11

    spudnut

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    I just shot a woodswalk with my 16 gauge cookson using 100 gr.1f goex. You can definetly see the difference just looking at the granuels. I have to put 2 and 3 f side by side to see the difference. Fouling wasnt a problem using a well lubed patch with neatsfoot and beeswax. I even primed with it.
     
  12. Jun 12, 2019 at 3:34 PM #12

    Rifleman1776

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    The very first bp I ever bought was a five pound round cardboard canister from E. Christopher Firearms at Miamitown, Ohio for $4.95. Brand name forgotten.
     
  13. Jun 12, 2019 at 8:00 PM #13

    tenngun

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    I remember doing the math on my first rifle. Lead was $.50 a pound powder was $3.50 patches and caps were a $1.
    So a hundred shots was 3.5 cents,plus1.3 cents for ball, not counting gas to run the ball. Just about 7 cents a shot.
    My 30-30 cost 17 cents a shot and was no where near as fun to shoot.
    I was a poor boy, ( never got over that). I could shoot my first rifle every weekend. And it was cheap fun.
     
  14. Jun 12, 2019 at 8:59 PM #14

    Heelerau

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    A mate and I just shot in a smoothbore postal comp for another website, mate used his IMA Brown Bess and I used a sporterised Potzdam caplock musket. I made up cartridges using a .685 ball and 110 grains of Fg. Interestingly the Brown Bess was less inclined to foul than my cap lock musket. I had to use a greased felt wad every 8 shots to clear the fouling. As a point of interest I was using 120 grains of Fg in my .72 (patched round ball with thick greased felt wad) Bore rifle. I changed to 110 grains of FFg and found the rifle grouped a bit better, kicks a lot harder and you can feel the rifle torque up in your hand holding the forend.
     

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