choked?

Help Support Muzzle Loading Forum:

azmntman

Cannon
Joined
Nov 17, 2013
Messages
7,094
Reaction score
849
Location
Northern AZ
So since last weekend when I tried out the skychief load and found excellent results I have noted a few things. # 1) if you try this take 3-4 rags or a roll of cheap paper towels. Its messy! #2) not sure if its 1F or the olive oil but that was the DIRTIEST gun I believe I have ever cleaned. Also shooting Schuetzeun for the first time (was told it mimicked Goex in performance?, is it alot dirtier?

Now the title page.... I mic'd my barrels. One is .620 and one is .624. Is this enough of a difference to have been choked? If so what choke? One does seem to throw a slightly tighter pattern. Winds at and over 40 again so I stayed in, hope to get some more testing done with 2F BP as well as 2F Triple 7 and maybe Black MZ. Also a tuna can.
 

nhmoose

58 Cal.
MLF Supporter
Joined
Sep 30, 2010
Messages
3,259
Reaction score
624
Location
north of Golden Pond, NH
Choke Chart (hallowellco.com) gives what the constrictions are. Modern or ML chokes choke.

Your bores need to be measured abut 2 - 2 1/2 inches in and then the muzzle. the difference between is the constriction.

When both are the same there is no constriction.

The 2 measurements you gave can just be the difference in the makers of the barrels
 

The Crisco Kid

40 Cal
MLF Supporter
Joined
Dec 23, 2013
Messages
350
Reaction score
375
Location
Alaska and Arizona
I'm building a short barreled 20 gauge and was able to test fire it this past Saturday. The wind was blowing so hard that I only fired one "chewed" .597 bare ball which hit the paper at 25 yds. I used the Skychief load with 1 oz. #4 and 50 grains of FF. The pattern was great! This is with 4 mils of choke in the Model 37 Winchester barrel that I'm using which according to the charts is a skeet choke. I reamed out most of the choke and left a little in just to see how it would work. So far it looks very good and I can't wait to try it out on a better day at the range.
 

Britsmoothy

70 Cal.
MLF Supporter
Joined
Feb 28, 2007
Messages
7,580
Reaction score
4,785
Location
England.
So since last weekend when I tried out the skychief load and found excellent results I have noted a few things. # 1) if you try this take 3-4 rags or a roll of cheap paper towels. Its messy! #2) not sure if its 1F or the olive oil but that was the DIRTIEST gun I believe I have ever cleaned. Also shooting Schuetzeun for the first time (was told it mimicked Goex in performance?, is it alot dirtier?

Now the title page.... I mic'd my barrels. One is .620 and one is .624. Is this enough of a difference to have been choked? If so what choke? One does seem to throw a slightly tighter pattern. Winds at and over 40 again so I stayed in, hope to get some more testing done with 2F BP as well as 2F Triple 7 and maybe Black MZ. Also a tuna can.
If it is choked it's around skeet.
When I soak the fibre wads I keep them in a sealed tin. No need get it all over you and it wont hurt anyhow.
1f burns so poorly its akin to an engine running to rich and the cylinders get all sooted up!
Get some 3f 😊
 

Feltwad

45 Cal.
Joined
May 28, 2017
Messages
1,376
Reaction score
899
Here we go again another thread talking a load of rubbish such has Fg powder in 12 bore and smaller, messy oil soaked felt wads, dirty bores , dirty powder , swabbing the bore after each shot .All I personally need is a 12 bore side by side shotgun using 2.3/4 drms of FFFg powder 2 number 1/8 cards over powder 1.1/8 oz of shot and a 1/16 card wad over shot so I can shoot up 100 shots with no swabbing the barrel may look like a sooty chimney ,more compression means better killing power.
Feltwad
 
Joined
Feb 13, 2021
Messages
229
Reaction score
173
Location
Johnstown Colorado
Here we go again another thread talking a load of rubbish such has Fg powder in 12 bore and smaller, messy oil soaked felt wads, dirty bores , dirty powder , swabbing the bore after each shot .All I personally need is a 12 bore side by side shotgun using 2.3/4 drms of FFFg powder 2 number 1/8 cards over powder 1.1/8 oz of shot and a 1/16 card wad over shot so I can shoot up 100 shots with no swabbing the barrel may look like a sooty chimney ,more compression means better killing power.
Feltwad
This is the voice of experience.
 

azmntman

Cannon
Joined
Nov 17, 2013
Messages
7,094
Reaction score
849
Location
Northern AZ
Here we go again with the opinion from across the pond that is the only one that matters. We must all be liars over here. This from the gentlemen that stated turkey hunting is unsportsman like.

I did the shooting and I noted no cheek slapping compared to 3f (it was a lie!). I did the cleaning and noted the dirtiest barrel I have ever cleaned (it was a lie!). Loading was an ease as the oiled wads (which per MY RESULTS allowed a pattern VS 8-9 pellets at 25 yds) swabbed the bore well each shot (another lie), The filth was below the shot charge. I dont eat crows or kill things I dont eat.

Only rubbish I have noted is the arrogant posts of an old man who can no longer learn new things or tolerate another way of doing the same thing. My old German Shepherd can learn new stuff and is happy to do so? Perhaps you need a new trainer or some better treats?
 

azmntman

Cannon
Joined
Nov 17, 2013
Messages
7,094
Reaction score
849
Location
Northern AZ
If it is choked it's around skeet.
When I soak the fibre wads I keep them in a sealed tin. No need get it all over you and it wont hurt anyhow.
1f burns so poorly its akin to an engine running to rich and the cylinders get all sooted up!
Get some 3f 😊
Brit.... per our earlier conversations I did shoot some 3f as it was all I had (I shoot it for about everything else). It slapped my cheek like a bad date night with the butt sisters! Also NO PATTERN, had 9-10 hits at 30 yds. Now it may be the skycheif method (I was loading the "right" way as described above by he who knows all) and it may be the 1F. To me I dont care, I would rather not get the ol cheek slapped that hard! recoil belongs in the shoulder! Remember I do have steel in my neck along with a bit of hip bone so I admit I likely have mounting issues?

Next time I have the time and the wind is under 40 MPH I will return and try 2F and a tuna can. 1F was suggested by Brownbear (RIP) and as I lack the royal status of the forums EXPERT IN ALL THINGS I gave it a try. No cheek slap and (using the skychief load) a GRE T pattern at 25 yds.

Unless stopped by the moderators due to my 48 years experience not being sufficient to challenge the old goat, (ummm I mean expert) then I will report back. There just may be others than can benefit from other methods!

I didnt have sealed tin but a zip lock bag and they was messy! Still soaking thouh....may need to soak and then put in the tin!
 

Feltwad

45 Cal.
Joined
May 28, 2017
Messages
1,376
Reaction score
899
Here we go again with the opinion from across the pond that is the only one that matters. We must all be liars over here. This from the gentlemen that stated turkey hunting is unsportsman like.

I did the shooting and I noted no cheek slapping compared to 3f (it was a lie!). I did the cleaning and noted the dirtiest barrel I have ever cleaned (it was a lie!). Loading was an ease as the oiled wads (which per MY RESULTS allowed a pattern VS 8-9 pellets at 25 yds) swabbed the bore well each shot (another lie), The filth was below the shot charge. I dont eat crows or kill things I dont eat.

Only rubbish I have noted is the arrogant posts of an old man who can no longer learn new things or tolerate another way of doing the same thing. My old German Shepherd can learn new stuff and is happy to do so? Perhaps you need a new trainer or some better treats?
Here we go again name calling nobody mentioned liars .
Feltwad
 

azmntman

Cannon
Joined
Nov 17, 2013
Messages
7,094
Reaction score
849
Location
Northern AZ
Here we go again stating others opinions and methods are rubbish. So what are you saying about us folks that do things differently? WTH do you mean exactly by rubbish? I take it as a liar as we stand by it?

In the USA we have at our pharmacies a wonder medicine called Miralax.... getcha some, you'll feel better and be more tolerant.
 

Feltwad

45 Cal.
Joined
May 28, 2017
Messages
1,376
Reaction score
899
Here we go again stating others opinions and methods are rubbish. So what are you saying about us folks that do things differently? WTH do you mean exactly by rubbish? I take it as a liar as we stand by it?

In the USA we have at our pharmacies a wonder medicine called Miralax.... getcha some, you'll feel better and be more tolerant.
You have taken it the wrong way .
Feltwad
 
Joined
Aug 13, 2020
Messages
246
Reaction score
198
Location
Aberdeen, South Dakota
I just don't get it. Maybe European 1Fg is inferior to American 1Fg? Standard Goex in the red can 1Fg is plenty clean. If anything it is cleaner burning than 2Fg! I can shoot as much as I want, no swabbing, no lubed wads. I wipe off the nipples from time to time is all I do.
 

Feltwad

45 Cal.
Joined
May 28, 2017
Messages
1,376
Reaction score
899
I just don't get it. Maybe European 1Fg is inferior to American 1Fg? Standard Goex in the red can 1Fg is plenty clean. If anything it is cleaner burning than 2Fg! I can shoot as much as I want, no swabbing, no lubed wads. I wipe off the nipples from time to time is all I do.
There maybe some difference in 1Fg powder here in the Uk to that in the States Here the granulations of powder are best in has follows
1Fg for 4 bore and 6 Bore. 2FFg for 7,8,9,10 bore, 3FFFg for 12bore and smaller. Also rifles , 4 FFFFG pistols and priming, These are the standard powders for different bore sizes
For 1 Fg to give the best results has it is a lot slower it shoots best in a 4 or 6 bore with a 40 inch barrel. To shoot 1Fg in say 16 bore barrel of 30 inch most will leave the muzzle not ignited shoot it over snow then notice the unburnt powder on the snow .
This is the experience of a old boy who does not own a German Shepard but if shooters want to use say 1 Fg in a small bore go ahead but all I have said is what I have experience over many years
Feltwad
 
Joined
Aug 13, 2020
Messages
246
Reaction score
198
Location
Aberdeen, South Dakota
The only European powder I have experience with is Swiss. There are definite differences, even if comparing 1Fg to 1Fg, so it very well could be we are talking apples and oranges. Heck, even Goex red can is different than Goex Olde Eynsford.

I shot maybe 30 shots from my 26" barrel 10 gauge not long ago, all from the same spot, pattern testing, all but maybe a shot or two was 1Fg Goex red can. There was nothing remarkable in the snow as far as powder goes.

I only say this because it seems so many European members like 2Fg and 3Fg powders, and yet almost universally American shooters who try 1Fg come to love it, or at least are indifferent.
 

azmntman

Cannon
Joined
Nov 17, 2013
Messages
7,094
Reaction score
849
Location
Northern AZ
I just don't get it. Maybe European 1Fg is inferior to American 1Fg? Standard Goex in the red can 1Fg is plenty clean. If anything it is cleaner burning than 2Fg! I can shoot as much as I want, no swabbing, no lubed wads. I wipe off the nipples from time to time is all I do.
The only filthy area was down at the breech and it was NASTY! The lubed wads kept the bore nice n shiny when loading.
 

okawbow

40 Cal.
Joined
Nov 19, 2012
Messages
569
Reaction score
165
I have shot some old, Navy surplus cannon black powder in 10ga., 12ga, and .69 and .75 caliber muskets. The shotguns had 30” barrels. The muskets 46”. This powder is really coarse. It’s at least 1f and maybe coarser.
I killed turkeys at 40 yards with both full choked shotguns using 3 dram and 3 1/2 dram loads. I got excellent accuracy in the muskets with 70 grain loads. I never noticed any unburnt powder or any other problems except a rare slightly slower than normal fire, in the flintlocks, that may or may not have been slow ignition of the coarse powder.

I have also had good luck with Old Eynesford 1 1/2F powder in everything from .54 up.
 
Joined
Aug 13, 2020
Messages
246
Reaction score
198
Location
Aberdeen, South Dakota
I have shot some old, Navy surplus cannon black powder in 10ga., 12ga, and .69 and .75 caliber muskets. The shotguns had 30” barrels. The muskets 46”. This powder is really coarse. It’s at least 1f and maybe coarser.
I killed turkeys at 40 yards with both full choked shotguns using 3 dram and 3 1/2 dram loads. I got excellent accuracy in the muskets with 70 grain loads. I never noticed any unburnt powder or any other problems except a rare slightly slower than normal fire, in the flintlocks, that may or may not have been slow ignition of the coarse powder.

I have also had good luck with Old Eynesford 1 1/2F powder in everything from .54 up.
Maybe our American powders, which are mainly made with maple charcoal if I'm not mistaken, just burn better at coarser grains? And maybe European woods like Alder, work better with finer grains? 🤷‍♂️
 

Britsmoothy

70 Cal.
MLF Supporter
Joined
Feb 28, 2007
Messages
7,580
Reaction score
4,785
Location
England.
Brit.... per our earlier conversations I did shoot some 3f as it was all I had (I shoot it for about everything else). It slapped my cheek like a bad date night with the butt sisters! Also NO PATTERN, had 9-10 hits at 30 yds. Now it may be the skycheif method (I was loading the "right" way as described above by he who knows all) and it may be the 1F. To me I dont care, I would rather not get the ol cheek slapped that hard! recoil belongs in the shoulder! Remember I do have steel in my neck along with a bit of hip bone so I admit I likely have mounting issues?

Next time I have the time and the wind is under 40 MPH I will return and try 2F and a tuna can. 1F was suggested by Brownbear (RIP) and as I lack the royal status of the forums EXPERT IN ALL THINGS I gave it a try. No cheek slap and (using the skychief load) a GRE T pattern at 25 yds.

Unless stopped by the moderators due to my 48 years experience not being sufficient to challenge the old goat, (ummm I mean expert) then I will report back. There just may be others than can benefit from other methods!

I didnt have sealed tin but a zip lock bag and they was messy! Still soaking thouh....may need to soak and then put in the tin!
I'm sorry brother.
I forgot our earlier conversation.
I'm getting old 🤦‍♂️.
It's funny how one thing works for some and not for others.
My take on course powder is it gets better the harder it has to work but recoil increases.
Paradoxically powder close to 4f but at 3/4 volume has also worked well for me.
Regarding the face slapping, how about a slight comb raiser. My understanding is that the face must on the stock so you all move together. ??
 
Top