black powder drilling

[hoochiepapa]

Very cool gun!!

 

[F.G. Ford]

I will offer more than that $152.99 :grin: :v
And even throw in an ugly cat.

Seriously that is a rare and valuable piece of Americana. With more research you will you have a gun that has more value than $150

Best regards
Old Ford

 

[De Feyter]

Thank you for all your help.
Craig

 

[Flint311]

The "Drillings" I know of are of German origin, but more modern with proof marks. My dad has a "Zwilling" (1 shotgun/1rifle barrel) that is too old for the proof markings. These are Merkel-Gebruder from Germany. Taken here because they were a great combo gun of the day.

Sorry, not sure on yours. Good luck!

 

[Cascade Pete]

Drillings of any origin are VERY VALUABLE firearms. I bought one in Germany in 1986 for 8000 Marks. That was about $2500, at the time. 4 years 5 Years later sold it for $10,000 Stateside. I have never seen a BP Drilling. Very Nice piece. Don't let anyone lowball You on this piece...It smells of Money, and age!!!!!!

Check the barrels and locks with a flashlight and a magnifying glass. There will be markings. Many times they are on the rib, towards the hammers...

 

[De Feyter]

Pete,
I used a glass again on the gun and see nothing for marks.
finish on the bbls looks like a dark brown almost a slight stripe through it but does not look tobe the old twist steel on newer guns than this.
The patch box is hand made by looking at it as does the rest of the gun.

 

[Cascade Pete]

Would not have been Damascus. Europeans have been forging steel in their firearms for centuries...
Have You removed the wood and checked for markings on the steel underneath it???

 

[De Feyter]

I don't dare to try and take anything apart on the weapon. I can see by the screws that that has not been done in a long time.
If it would be done I would want someone in the know to do it.

 

[TFoley]

Would not have been Damascus. Europeans have been forging steel in their firearms for centuries...
Have You removed the wood and checked for markings on the steel underneath it???

Sir - Damascus is not the place the barrels were made, it is the name of the method that produces a Damascene-patterned appearance to the finished barrel - a feature usually highlighed by light acid etching. Barrels made by this method are fabricated from stubs or twists of wrought iron hammered around a mandrel to produce the tube - this tube shows the patterns of the twists in the form of the decorative appearance that gives it the name. The more stubs used, the finer and more expensive the twist appearance. In UK, barrels made by this method were/are called fine-stub twist barrels. Six is common, eight to twelve is VERY high grade.

Shotguns with Damascus barrels, well-made and in proof, are still capable of being shot with moderate modern loads. However, close examination of the internals are required before shooting, as weakaning corrosion can be hidden in the joints of the twist of a poorly-made gun - NOT a good thing.

Incidentally, most gun-makers in history used one of two methods of barrel-making - either rolled and seamed tubes - hammer welded from end to end, or this method of stub welding - rather like braiding hair, but in metal, for lighter guns like fowlers and shotguns of all grades.

tac

 

[TFoley]

The "Drillings" I know of are of German origin, but more modern with proof marks. My dad has a "Zwilling" (1 shotgun/1rifle barrel) that is too old for the proof markings. These are Merkel-Gebruder from Germany. Taken here because they were a great combo gun of the day.

Sorry, not sure on yours. Good luck!

Sir - respectfully, you are mistaken in your statement. Gebrueder Merkel opened their factory in 1989 - see -
http://issuu.com/merkel_usa/docs/the_double_gun___single_shot_journal_-_autumn_2009

Every firearm made in any part of Germany after 1891 was subject to the Mai 19st 1891 Ausfuehrungsbestimmung [published and promulgated on 21 June 1892]. Proof houses were opened in Suhl [home of Merkel], Zella-Mehlis, Frankfurt-am-Oder and Oberndorf-am-Necker.

If your gun was made by Merkel, it should have literally a dozen of more stamps all over the barrels and water-tables of the action.

Please have a another look.

tac

 

[Cascade Pete]

Even us Uncivilized Americans Know about Damascus Steel. I was making a point that the Germans have been forging steel for centuries. As a long time firearms collector and apraiser, I have seen many old Drillings with steel barrels, But none with Twist steel/....

 

[TFoley]

Even us Uncivilized Americans Know about Damascus Steel. I was making a point that the Germans have been forging steel for centuries. As a long time firearms collector and apraiser, I have seen many old Drillings with steel barrels, But none with Twist steel/....

Sir - you wrote that, not I.

Please check my almost 1600 posts and see where I have made a single disparaging remark about America or Americans.

I described the making of some types of so-called Damascus barrels for the benefit of those who may not have known what was meant by the term. I noted that nobody else, even the many experts on this forum, had, at that time, bothered to do so.

tac

 

[Cascade Pete]

Most Americans are well aware of Damascus steel. We as a Nation Own More firearms than any other country, because we are able to, and it is defined in our Bill Of Rights...No Disparagemnet, just a fact of life...

 

[TFoley]

I'll add my $0.02 to that comment. It is a remarkably well-made and well-thought-out piece of great interest and instrinsic value, no matter where it was made.

I suspect that Mr Brooks, for whom I have the greatest of respect, has it 99% right. The apparent lack of markings of any kind suggests an American-made gun to me - European guns have been slathered with inspection, proof, test and gauging marks since the latter end of the 18th century in the major gun-making nations - all of which rapidly became law with the advent of mass-production. Add to that that the laws require that at least SOME of those marks be visible without recourse to dismantling the arm, and you'll see my meaning.

And for the sharp-eyed out there, well done! The rest of you have failed the little test. Gebrueder Merkel was founded in 1898, NOT 1989.

And for Mr Pete over there in the beautiful Cascades [so well known to me and mrs tac], ease up on the political point-making, if you please. I've spent at least a fifth of my life [I'm 65] in the USA, teaching and learning, being commanded and commanding US military personnel, and I need no advisement of the Constitution, or any part of it - especially in view of the fact that many of what used to be my guns now live in the USA, and that I am a life member of the NRA. Thanks.

tac

 

 

[De Feyter]

I want to thank you all for all your help on this gun.
I know nothing about the older gun like this-I am a big Viet Nam collector guy.
I do want to sell this and take that money for my Nam stuff BUT have no idea what to ask for it.
My Dad killed a deer with it the last time it was shot in the 1970s.
My dad was a gun smith for 50 some years.
Again thank you all
Craig
Grand Haven Mich.

 

[TFoley]

Don't like the post?

Don't read it.

Simple.

tac

 

[ericb]

K-Dog - It's not for me to say, and forgive me if I'm being overly forward, but given the Family History & Ties to the Piece, I would keep it. You can always get some 'Nam stuff, even as the price goes up, but years from now, when you wish you would've kept Dad's old ML Drilling, it's quite likely no amount of money will get it back for you, or even find it.

Eric

ps - it is really a unique and nice piece, and worth having in it's own right.

 

[TFoley]

K-Dog - It's not for me to say, and forgive me if I'm being overly forward, but given the Family History & Ties to the Piece, I would keep it. You can always get some 'Nam stuff, even as the price goes up, but years from now, when you wish you would've kept Dad's old ML Drilling, it's quite likely no amount of money will get it back for you, or even find it.

Eric

ps - it is really a unique and nice piece, and worth having in it's own right.

+1

tac

 

[De Feyter]

I contacted my insurance copmany to get coverage on it and they are asking what it would cost to replace it if something would happen--what do I give them for a price-how do I find out?
Craig