54 cal T/C Hawken accurate loads

[Cbriggs57]

Bought a used-but-excellent 54 cal Hawken last summer. It came with lots of extras, including several boxes of maxi hunters and pyrodex. No lube, though. Looking for suggestions for loads and lubes for maxi hunters, or suggestions for other conicals that would shoot accurately and thump hard. Real life experiences would be preferred.

 

[Crewdawg445]

What's your barrel twist rate? If it's anything like my .54 hawken rifles, a roundball with the correct patch will be the cats meow. With a .54cal a round ball is going to do plenty of thumping. I myself have used the maxi's and will never use them again, I've harvested plenty of deer and the majority of the animals have dropped on impact with a good ole roundball. Powder loads are going to differ from each rifle to another. What my .54's like, yours may hate. You'll also find most of the guys use real black powder versus pyrodex, again I myself find it to be more consistent than pyrodex and I do use both. Play around and let your rifle show you what it likes and wants.

 

[longcruise]

In 1992 I took 3rd place in state championships /percussion / with an identical rifle. Load was 80 gr goex FF, .022 canvas patch and .530 hornady round ball. Was also good enough for 2nd place in the 135 yd "hawken" match. 265 registered shooters. This was all RB shooting.

Plenty of other good combo's.

honestly, there is no reason to punish yourself with .54 conicals. If you want to shoot conical bullets, get .45 or .50.

regardless, you are in possession of an excellent rifle!

 

[longcruise]

BTW, that same load has taken a number of elk in my camp!

 

[Crewdawg445]

:thumbsup: With the correct patch, you absolutely cannot beat a roundball! I absolutely love the faces on people when they see you ready your rifle and laugh because you'll never hit anything with a ball.... then upon target retrieval they are amazed at the groupings.

 

[Colin Sprute]

I used to shoot lots of t/c maxi hunters 350 grain. about all my t/cs had a 1:48 twist and I used mainly 90 grains of 3f goex. all my guns are 50 cal. killed lots of elk with that load. all round balls now. like everyone will say you will have to find your own magic load. about any lube will work for those bullets. I used t/cs bore butter.

 

[bubba.50]

70gr by volume pyrodex w/.535 patched rb & 90gr by volume pyrodex with bore butter lubed maxi-ball both shot accurately in my Renegade and to the same point-of-aim at 75yds.

 

[ryoung14]

Since you'll want to shoot up those conicals anyway, here's a suggestion. Try firing them with a reduced load of 60 to 70 gr. Pyrodex RS to keep them subsonic (below about 1100fps).

I've recently had very good luck shooting the Hornady Great Plains bullets over 70 gr. loads. According to the books, that keeps them below the speed of sound at the muzzle. Launched at the slower subsonic speed they:
1)don't lose as much velocity over 100 yards as they would if launched above 1100 fps (according to the books).
2)are much more consistently accurate in most of my guns.
3)don't smack the shooter as hard.
It seems that decelerating through the "sound barrier" has an upsetting effect on conical flight.

Haven't tried this yet with Maxi's; maybe it doesn't hold true for them. But it does for the GP bullet in the faster twist barrels.

 

[Cbriggs57]

Last weekend of regular firearms deer season here in Mitten-land and I have a full list of to-dos, so I'm really looking forward to lighting off this T/C 54 and my T/C Pennsylvania Hunter 50 cal, so I can take one or the other out in the late "primitive weapons" (as it used to be called) season. I like the big-boomer smokepoles. Shoot a Marlin guide with cast bullets (burn/blind/deafen loads) in the reg'lar season, so this just gets my blood pumpin'. Might even get to hunt a big piece of private land then, too. Me'n my thumpers.

 

[BrownBear]

Mine is really fond of 80 grains of 2f Goex or Pyro RS with a lubed felt wad between that and the MaxiHunter. The rifle can't tell the difference between the two powders.

I haven't popped any deer with it, but my shoulder sezz it's thumping real well. Even better is the Hornady Great Plains bullet with the same charge and lubed felt wad. But "better" is the difference between groups running 3-3.5" at 50, and 2" at the same range. That particular rifle doesn't like LEE REALs for some reason, but it's worth a try too if you're into casting your own to save buxx. A bud of mine gets accuracy comparable to the Hornady from his rifle, and he's sure thumped a lot of deer with it. He finds the lubed felt wad best too, but I don't recall his charge.

 

[Cbriggs57]

That's the kind of real-world experience I'm looking for. Got to get or make some lubed felt wads and see how that works. Thanks for the data!

 

[AZbpBurner]

Mine is really fond of 80 grains of 2f Goex or Pyro RS with a lubed felt wad between that and the MaxiHunter. The rifle can't tell the difference between the two powders.

I haven't popped any deer with it, but my shoulder sezz it's thumping real well. Even better is the Hornady Great Plains bullet with the same charge and lubed felt wad. But "better" is the difference between groups running 3-3.5" at 50, and 2" at the same range. That particular rifle doesn't like LEE REALs for some reason, but it's worth a try too if you're into casting your own to save buxx. A bud of mine gets accuracy comparable to the Hornady from his rifle, and he's sure thumped a lot of deer with it. He finds the lubed felt wad best too, but I don't recall his charge.

80 Gr. seems to be the powder load of choice for 1:48" barrels of multiple manufacturers.

Yours is one of the first admissions I've read that has found 2F BP and Pyrodex RS to perform the same. I use both with the same powder measure setting, and my targets can't tell any difference, either. I've also used a 5 gr. kicker charge of 2F behind Pyrodex RS in one of my flintlocks, and accuracy out to 100 yards is beyond my expectations.

From cap & ball revolver, to my cap rifles, to a flint or 2, Pyrodex works for me as direct replacement for BP in times where I don't have real BP on hand. My closest BP source is a 300 mile round trip, and since I no longer have family in Tucson, I don't go there much anymore.

 

[Rat Trapper]

I use 90 grains of triple seven 2F with round ball and have used 120 grains of T7 with the 390 grain Hornady great plains bullet with very good luck and accuracy.

 

[MSW]

by way of 'my two cents:'

if you don't already have a copy, you should get Dutch Schoultz' method. Here's a link:
http://www.blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/

this will walk you through the steps you need to take. His work is guaranteed to tighten your groups, which begs the logical question: which fancy expensive shooting coach will make the same claim?

read the method, do the steps, get smaller groups. what's not to like?

make good smoke!

 

[AZbpBurner]

I use 90 grains of triple seven 2F with round ball and have used 120 grains of T7 with the 390 grain Hornady great plains bullet with very good luck and accuracy.

That would be a pretty stout load even with black powder. while 100 gr. for roundball is usually listed as maximum for Black powder in many commercially made rifles, and 90 BP for the Hornadays, keep in mind that to duplicate a black powder load you need to drop the Triple 7 load by 15%.

IMO, you may be taking an unnecessary risk with a pretty hot load.

 

[Billnpatti]

Usually, the Maxi Hunters will work quite well in a .54 T/C Hawken and they are reported to be very effective on larger game. Personally, I think a .54 cal. patched round ball will cleanly kill anything you will likely be hunting. The Maxi Hunters may be over kill, but they are good bullets if that is what you want to use. Whether or not a substitute powder will work in your rifle will depend on whether or not it is a caplock. If it is a caplock, it will shoot the substitutes very well. If it is a flintlock, it won't shoot subs at all. A flintlock must have real black powder. As for the substitute that the seller gave you, I think I might use it just for plinking because subs have a finite shelf life and you probably do not know how old that stuff is that he gave you. When you get down to serious shooting, you will need to get a can of new powder. Shoot the subs if you must but real black powder is always preferable if you can get it. As for the lube, there are a ga-jillion recipes and just as many people who will tell you that theirs is the absolute best. If it were me, I'd just pick up a tube of Bore Butter. It's good stuff. As for the best powder charge, no one can tell you exactly what your rifle will prefer. You will have to determine that for yourself by trying different loads at the range. Start with something around 55 grains of 3f. It is best to shoot one round into the bank first just to foul your barrel. Then run a damp patch in and out in one stroke with no pumping. Do this between every shot to keep your bore exactly the same from shot to shot. Shoot five shots from a sand bag rest at a target at about 50 yards. As long as your shots are on the paper, do not change your point of aim. Aim dead center on the bulls eye for all shots. Don't pay attention to where they are on the paper just yet. Once you find the best load, you can adjust your sights to put the point of impact right where you want it. Then increase your load by 5 grains and shoot five more shots. Keep doing this until you get to around 110 grains. Then measure each group to determine which charge gives you the best group. That's what you ought to use in your rifle. Now, if this charge is not hitting exactly where you want it, now is the time to adjust your sights to put your POI just where you want it. :hatsoff:

BTW, MSW gave you some excellent advice. His recommendation is the best source of accuracy information that you can get.

 

[bigmike]

80grs of Pyrodex ,.490rb or .495 .012 patch. I use it with my .50 Renegade. At 50 yards ,it groups very well. Can't see much further than that.

 

[Cbriggs57]

80grs of Pyrodex ,.490rb or .495 .012 patch. I use it with my .50 Renegade. At 50 yards ,it groups very well. Can't see much further than that.

My Pennsylvania Hunter shoots best with 90 gr equivalent of pyrodex, .490 ball, and .020 ox yoke dry lubed patches. I bought the Hawken to get a conical ball shooter. I have yet to kill a deer with the 50 cal roundball, but couldn't pass up the 54 cal Hawken, so I bought it to have the option...and, it just looked so good, and seemed like it could be a lot of big-bore, heavy-hitting fun. I know it's a lot of gun for deer, but I shoot a Marlin 1895 G with stout loads during the regular firearms season, so this isn't that big a stretch for me. Maybe I'm nuts (I am) but big-gun recoil doesn't bother me. It's...kinda fun, actually.

 

[William O.]

My .54 has a 1:48 twist rate and shoots best with a .530 RB covered with a .018 mattress ticking patch pushed by 85 grains of 2f Goex. I've used straight olive oil for lube, olive oil/beeswax and now I'm experimenting with Dutch's dry lube recipe.

 

[Rat Trapper]

I use 90 grains of triple seven 2F with round ball and have used 120 grains of T7 with the 390 grain Hornady great plains bullet with very good luck and accuracy.

That would be a pretty stout load even with black powder. while 100 gr. for roundball is usually listed as maximum for Black powder in many commercially made rifles, and 90 BP for the Hornadays, keep in mind that to duplicate a black powder load you need to drop the Triple 7 load by 15%.

IMO, you may be taking an unnecessary risk with a pretty hot load.

I called TC and was told that would be ok. So there is no safety problem. Remember this is a 54 and the TC loading manual says you can go up to 120 grains anyway. the rifle shoots real well with 90 grains of T7 2F with a .530 Hornady ball. Hornady no longer makes the 390 grain great plains bullets, but I have plenty for my own use. The rifle also shot very well with the hot load and the 390 grain great plains bullet and I have used it on a number of deer with success.