.50 Renegade Hunter Conical How To?

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Dedicated PRB shooter seeking input from conical buffs.

What I want to do is sight in a near new T/C Renegade Hunter with QLA with lead conical bullets. 1 in 48" twist

What I have;

* A supply of factory T/C Maxi-Balls and Maxi-Hunter lubricated bullets.

* A supply of home cast unlubricated Maxi-Balls.

* T/C Bore Butter

* .125 .50 cal felt wad lubricated with bore butter

* FFG & FFFG Schuetzen Blackpowder

My experience with conicals was years ago when Maxi-Lube was recommended for T/C Maxi-Balls which were the go to conical for the .50 T/C Hawken. That Maxi-lube was nasty stuff as I recall.

A few questions;

* Is using a wad beneath a conical bullet offer any real benefit?

* Is the .125 lubricated felt wad the right type to use with a conical bullet?

* If using a fully lubricated wad under the bullet is it necessary to lube the bullet as well?

* When using the factory made lubricated T/C Maxi-type bullets is a lubricated wad recommended?

Any other helpful recommendations, information and/or suggestions would be appreciated.

The felt wads are on order and should be here in a week or so then given good weather I'm headed to the range to see what I can do with conical bullets.
 
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TDM

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I used to shoot Maxi-Balls in my Renegade and I used Maxi-Lube and Bore Butter too. Back then that was recommended and I sure didn’t know any better. But they shot great as I remember, nice 100 yrd groups, but having 40 year younger eyes helped with that too. I still have a fair supply of TC conicals but haven’t used them in a long time. I know all this rambling isn’t much help, but they do work well. Most any good lube should work and I don’t think an over powder wad would hurt at all, but I’ve not used that myself with conicals.
 
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Dedicated PRB shooter seeking input from conical buffs.

What I want to do is sight in a near new T/C Renegade Hunter with QLA with lead conical bullets. 1 in 48" twist

What I have;

* A supply of factory T/C Maxi-Balls and Maxi-Hunter lubricated bullets.

* A supply of home cast unlubricated Maxi-Balls.

* T/C Bore Butter

* .125 .50 cal felt wad lubricated with bore butter

* FFG & FFFG Schuetzen Blackpowder

My experience with conicals was years ago when Maxi-Lube was recommended for T/C Maxi-Balls which were the go to conical for the .50 T/C Hawken. That Maxi-lube was nasty stuff as I recall.

A few questions;

* If using a wad beneath a conical bullet offer any real benefit?

* Is the .125 lubricated felt wad the right type to use with a conical bullet?

* If using a fully lubricated wad under the bullet is it necessary to lube the bullet as well?

* When using the factory made lubricated T/C Maxi-type bullets is a lubricated wad recommended?

Any other helpful recommendations, information and/or suggestions would be appreciated.

The felt wads are on order and should be here in a week or so then given good weather I'm headed to the range to see what I can do with conical bullets.
Here are some thought in no particular order.
  1. Not a real fan of BoreButter for a few reasons. A big one is it’s narrow Goldilocks temperature window. In the summer heat it’s a runny mess, in the winter you can pound nails with it.
  2. I haven’t found wads under a conical or round ball to cause accuracy problems, but they sure have helped improve accuracy in many cases. I have mostly moved on to paperpatching when shooting conicals, but still use a wad.
  3. Have found a wad diameter slightly larger than caliber to seal the bore best, particularly with deeper rifling.
  4. I use 1/8” hard felt from Duro-Felt Products. Good people to deal with.
  5. I have an inexpensive set of wad punches from 1/8” to 1” diameter. Let’s me punch my own and experiment.
  6. Was disappointed with Maxi Balls for hunting when I used them, as they tended to pencil through if they didn’t hit bone. Some testing seemed to indicate the upper band was being pushed into the top groove on the bullet, almost creating a spire point bullet. The Maxi Hunter seemed to have resolved the problem, at least in testing I was involved in.
Nothing beats actual range time. Let us know what you discover.
 

bubba.50

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I've personally never seen any benefit to the wad, but, no harm either. Wad or no wad, FULLY LUBE that bullet! I've used boer butter for about as long as I been shootin' these things & probably about every other lube too & have even made my own with beeswax & veg oil. All worked well. Just be sure to give a good cleaning afterwards.

And before it's done you'll probably get a lot of negative comments on the QLA. It's never affected my shooting either good or bad. It's just there.
 
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All of my 1:48 twist rifles shoot Maxis good, both ball and hunter. It was posted here that lubing only the bottom band produced better accuracy. I found that it didn't keep the bore as "clean" as fully lubed but accuracy is everything. When going to the range in warm weather I put the Bore Butter in a cooler to keep it more solid. I also take lotsa paper towels. I now use bees wax and veg oil to lube mine. I never used a wad until reading here. IMO it didn't help but I need to try oversize wads at some time. I've read a lot on here about maxi balls not expanding. Most all kills were a pass thru and the deer rarely left their tracks.
 

deermanok

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I used to have a Black Mountain Magnum rifle. I guess it was about the same as the New Englander.
It had the QLA barrel.
I only ever shot the TC Maxi Hunters 275 grain.
No wad, that gun was very accurate. I only ever shot at paper out to 100 yards but it would put em right in there.
 
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Urban Coyote,
About the QLA, I had a .54 New Englander with the QLA counterbore. It was a study in frustrations when trying to load it. Ended up calling TC and talking to guys in the shop to learn (much to my dismay) that the counterbore was actually flat bottomed by design, there being no chamfer on the crown.
I thought about that for two or three seconds and decided to change it.

New Englander and Lyman 457124.jpg

.458" bore liner.

I hope your QLA works better than mine but I really like what mine became.
 

ElkStalker

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After reading some info from Idaho Lewis, I took his advice and lubed only the bottom lube band and it really helped with accuracy. A 54cal Ox yoke lubed over powder wad shrunk my groups in half with both the Renegade and Hawken. Use a 54 cal OP wad in a 50cal rifle for beat results. I personally hate bore butter and tried it several times. It’s either a huge mess, or you can’t hardly get it out of the tube. Another member mentioned the very small Goldilocks window with this stuff. I can only imagine how much is oozing into the powder during a warm weather hunt. I tried using TOW’s Mink oil and had excellent results. I use this with my PRB loads, so I figured why not try it?
 
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I've used Hornady Great Plains maxis as well as TC 275gr Maxi-Hunter and 320gr Maxi-Ball with the lube that comes on them almost exclusively over the years. I've never tried a wad and have had more than acceptable accuracy for typical hunting distance.

I might suggest trying them as they come with no wad first and see how they do. My TC Hawken is superbly accurate with the 320gr Maxi-Ball pushed by 80gr of 2F. If you can't find a load recipe within the recommended min/max range in terms of charge levels that shoots well, then maybe try things like wads and whatnot.

Back 20+ years ago when I had only my TC manual to go by for knowledge and load data, I used the 425gr Hornady Great Plains in my Renegade. It was always good for minute of deer accuracy but didn't ever seem to print groups worthy of hanging on the refrigerator. Since my interest in muzzleloading has resurged here over the last year or so and joining this forum here, and getting into reloading cartridges about ten years ago, I've learned a lot more. Since the TC rifles have the 1:48 "should be acceptable for conicals or PRB" rifling, I recently decided to try lighter conicals. I haven't done real serious testing with the 275gr Maxi-hunter yet, but the 320gr Maxi-Ball produces a refrigerator worthy target from my Hawken. That got me to thinking, maybe perhaps the heavy Hornady Great Plains might be pushing the limits of TCs 1:48 twist. I never got groups as tight with my 'Gade sending the Great Plains bullets. More experimentation will commence...
 
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I dug out my Renegade Hunter, it had been tucked away for a number of years, and it does not have QLA. My order from Midway having the .125 lubricated wads is scheduled for delivery tomorrow so after that the only thing keeping me from moving forward is weather.
 
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