4f in rifle?

Muzzleloading Forum

Help Support Muzzleloading Forum:

Joined
Apr 17, 2018
Messages
854
Reaction score
1,134
Location
THE WOODS OF S.C.
i have been thinking about this, has anybody ever tried light charges of 4F as the main charge in say a 40 cal. or smaller. and if so, how did it shoot? if the average load in a 40 is about 40gr. i would think you should be able to shoot 20-25gr. with no problem. and yes, i have a couple of cans of 4F i need to burn,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
 

Brokennock

75 Cal.
Joined
May 15, 2011
Messages
5,576
Reaction score
6,014
Location
North Central Connecticut
Here we go........

Enter the, "fear, fire, foe," crowd with there dire warnings of eminent doom, pestilence, blowing up your entire state. 🙄


There are many posts about this, always resulting in bickering.

No one yet has provided an example of a gun known to have been blown up by using a reasonable load of 4f.

Small, well thought out/reasonable, charges of 3f have been used by a few folks here, one in particular, successfully.

Just as one drops the starting powder charge of load development down when going from 2f to 3f, one should do the same when trying 4f,,,, maybe, maybe, a little more so.

Do keep in mind that 4f loads will be more susceptible to being effected by moisture.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Apr 17, 2018
Messages
854
Reaction score
1,134
Location
THE WOODS OF S.C.
yep i was figuring moisture would be a factor. but if you are shooting it on the range and not keeping your gun loaded with it for days it should do fine. i wonder how it would group. i have a range at my house, maybe i will go see. the problem is i live in the lowcountry of SC and right now we have 100% humidity and in the 90s every day. it is very damp outside,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
 

waksupi

40 Cal.
Joined
Oct 6, 2004
Messages
661
Reaction score
761
I've not tried it, but suspect you would want the frizzen closed while loading, to prevent the load from being blown out the vent. The closed frizzen while loading would be the thing that would make me hesitate.
 

Brokennock

75 Cal.
Joined
May 15, 2011
Messages
5,576
Reaction score
6,014
Location
North Central Connecticut
yep i was figuring moisture would be a factor. but if you are shooting it on the range and not keeping your gun loaded with it for days it should do fine. i wonder how it would group. i have a range at my house, maybe i will go see. the problem is i live in the lowcountry of SC and right now we have 100% humidity and in the 90s every day. it is very damp outside,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
I might even try just 15 or so grains.
I mean, really, what are you going to use the 4f load for? Maybe plinking amd squirrel hunting? Ranges shouldn't be all that far and accuracy will be more important than power for that.

Maybe see how low you can go?

Go too low and we will have a new stuck ball thread for folks to chew on, distracting them from this "4f in the barrel," topic. 🤣 🤣 🤣 🤣 🤣
 

Brokennock

75 Cal.
Joined
May 15, 2011
Messages
5,576
Reaction score
6,014
Location
North Central Connecticut
I've not tried it, but suspect you would want the frizzen closed while loading, to prevent the load from being blown out the vent. The closed frizzen while loading would be the thing that would make me hesitate.
Could just plug the hole with a feather as they did in days of old.
 
Joined
Jul 22, 2021
Messages
1,028
Reaction score
1,872
Only conjecture on my part, but I'd think weighing equal volumes, 4fg would weigh a bit more than larger granulations due to being more compact with less air space between grains. Probably, maybe, might be.

One time I inadvertantly mixed two cans of different granulations trying to save shelf space. Shot ok out of my shotguns (percussion).
 

M. De Land

75 Cal.
Joined
Dec 25, 2011
Messages
6,892
Reaction score
1,536
i have been thinking about this, has anybody ever tried light charges of 4F as the main charge in say a 40 cal. or smaller. and if so, how did it shoot? if the average load in a 40 is about 40gr. i would think you should be able to shoot 20-25gr. with no problem. and yes, i have a couple of cans of 4F i need to burn,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Actually if you shoot full cans of Goex of any granulation and do not sock the fines out you have probably already shot some 4F loads inadvertently!
 

Rock Home Isle

58 Cal.
Joined
Feb 13, 2021
Messages
2,003
Reaction score
3,041
Location
Johnstown Colorado
The only time I have used 4f for a main charge is when I dry balled( everyone has or will) and I forced 4f in the touch hole and shot the ball out.
With 3f I use 10% less than 2f by Volume, never considered using 4f
Okay…I need to back-pedal on my previous post…I’ve used 4f to blow-out a dry ball.
 
Joined
May 5, 2007
Messages
1,085
Reaction score
312
Location
Tall Grass Prairie
Way back in the '70s I was looking for the fastest flatest shooting load for 100 yard shooting under windy conditions. The final load I tried in my .45 T/C was 120 grains of 4f. It didn't better my groups, but taught me big charges of 4f don't hurt a modern rifles. Much lighter charges of 4f in 40 calibers ought not be a problem.
 
Joined
Jan 27, 2008
Messages
21,725
Reaction score
18,371
Location
Republic mo
I've not tried it, but suspect you would want the frizzen closed while loading, to prevent the load from being blown out the vent. The closed frizzen while loading would be the thing that would make me hesitate.
A feather in the hat is seen in paintings. Feathers were macaroni, but frontiersman often had one to plug the vent while loading. I seem to recall Boone having been described doing this by Audubon .
One could plug the vent and save that problem or slip on a frizzen sock.
I would be concerned about slowing the ignition, even with four, through a vent fuse effect.
I’m happy with three or two myself. But I’m thinking it was used pretty heavy by Britsmoothie, you may find some of his post on it.
 
Joined
Sep 13, 2021
Messages
790
Reaction score
988
Here we go........

Enter the, "fear, fire, foe," crowd with there dire warnings of eminent doom, pestilence, blowing up your entire state. 🙄
It's true! This is what can happen if you load 4f into a rifle!
 

Attachments

  • tumblr_957a326f72b10d7811f0161a4d4cd0e2_c12a992c_500.gif
    tumblr_957a326f72b10d7811f0161a4d4cd0e2_c12a992c_500.gif
    2 MB · Views: 0

stikshooter

32 Cal.
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Messages
345
Reaction score
270
i have been thinking about this, has anybody ever tried light charges of 4F as the main charge in say a 40 cal. or smaller. and if so, how did it shoot? if the average load in a 40 is about 40gr. i would think you should be able to shoot 20-25gr. with no problem. and yes, i have a couple of cans of 4F i need to burn,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
My under hammer likes 45 gr under a 440 RB ,the squirrels hate it/Ed
 
Top