.44 cal Piettas

Discussion in 'Handguns' started by RKSmithy, Jun 29, 2012.

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  1. Aug 23, 2012 #21

    Trumpetman

    Trumpetman

    Trumpetman

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    I wonder where Daniel Boone plugged in his dremmel? You're right, though. I am a bit obsessive/compulsive (or so I'm told).
    On the other hand -- every cap fits the same way on every nipple each and every time without fail. I like that. I guess it would be more "period correct" to have used an auger or a mini foot-spun lathe.
    I bow to your authenticity :bow: !!!
     
  2. Aug 23, 2012 #22

    Trumpetman

    Trumpetman

    Trumpetman

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    You got me. I have a whole gallon of lube I made from parafine, Crisco, bacon grease, etc. It's good to go at 104 degrees hot -- without melting and running down the frame and dripping onto my toes!
    Not only that, but I also made my own front sight out of a little brass rod. I'd like to say I spun it on an old-fashioned blacksmith's do-dad or gizmo, but -- again, I chucked it in a drill and did some filing. It hits pretty close to point of aim now, and I can actually SEE the sight!
     
  3. Aug 23, 2012 #23

    Trumpetman

    Trumpetman

    Trumpetman

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    YES! CAPS: Useful information (dimensions).

    CCI #10: Opening--.160" Length--.160"
    CCI #11: Opening--.166" Length--.162"
    Rem #10: Opening--.167" Length--.168"
    Rem #11: Opening--.166" Length--.145"
    RSW 1075: Opening--.165" Length--.154"
    CCI Musket: Opening--.225" Length--.244"

    Note: My Cash Capper seems to like Rem. #10's because they are taller than the others. Also, I realize the Rem. #11's stated measurements show a smaller opening than the #10's, and I don't know why. I checked them out myself a couple of years ago and found that these dimensions held true at that time. With that said, you still have to just try things until you find what works for your particular gun.
     
  4. Aug 23, 2012 #24

    rafterob

    rafterob

    rafterob

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    The revolver, nor the percussion system were around in Daniel's day so he didn't need a dremel. :blah:
     
  5. Aug 23, 2012 #25

    Zonie

    Zonie

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    But he would have used one if he had it.

    :rotf:
     
  6. Aug 26, 2012 #26

    Trumpetman

    Trumpetman

    Trumpetman

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    I fired six rounds today through my chrony. They each had 17 grains of 3f goex powder behind cream of wheat filler, topped off with a .454 cast lead ball and some home-made grease. The first five shots had 17 grains (by volume) of cream of wheat. The last shot had 22 grains of cream of wheat, compressed really hard.

    Here are the numbers:

    725.2 fps
    766.4 fps
    718.2 fps
    751.9 fps
    711.0 fps
    712.2 fps

    Average of 6 shots: 730.81 fps.

    On another day several months ago I got an average of 806 fps out of this 17-grain load of 3f with no filler. I believe velocities in the low 700's should be adequate for what I do with this gun: shooting paper at 21 and 50 feet, and metal targets at 25 yards. If zeroed at 25 yards, the drop at 50 yards would be less than 4 inches, which is even good enough for the 12-inch gong at 50-yards. I believe I'll play it safe with this gun so I can hand it down to one of the kids some day. If I want to shoot stout loads, I'll go out and get myself a steel-framed revolver.
    :hatsoff: Many thanks to all for helpful advice for those of us who are still on the upward slope of the learning curve. :v
     
  7. Aug 26, 2012 #27

    don hepler

    don hepler

    don hepler

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    One other thing that nobody mentioned, the reason for using fillers and wads between the ball and powder charge is to keep the compresson necessary, as not to leave a gap between the ball and charge.

    On light loads my ROA won't push the ball deep enough into the chamber to seat the ball tight against the charge. Thats why a filler is needed.

    I do the same with the nipples, as far as sizing each one, to establish consistancy from one cylinder to the next. I have to two Ruger Old Army pistols and there is a few thousands difference is diameter between the two pistols.

    Used guns, rifles or revolvers are often dry fired by previous owners, and nipples need to be replaced or repaired as you have described.

    You're learning fast. Good shootin!
     
  8. Aug 26, 2012 #28

    preston cook

    preston cook

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    has a filler always been used .i mean would you take the time to add a filler if you were in a shoot out situation such as the old west or civil war i know time of reloading would play an important role so who and when did the use of fillers start :confused: :v
     
  9. Aug 26, 2012 #29

    cynthialee

    cynthialee

    cynthialee

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    I do not know.

    I only started using filler the last 3 or 4 years. Saw some guy on a youtube video give the reasons for it and ever since I have been doing that way.

    I do not imagine I will ever get myself in the position of a protracted pistol battle. I try and keep my shooting skills up to par so that if there ever is need of a pistol for a gun fight, I should only need 1 or 2 shots. :wink:
     
  10. Aug 27, 2012 #30

    Trumpetman

    Trumpetman

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    Good for you! You've got a leg-up on the bad guys, for sure.

    I was robbed at gunpoint in 2004, before I started carrying a handgun. The whole time the crook had the pistol on me, he held it sideways. At the point where I broke away and ran, he took a shot and missed. I wasn't looking, but I can only assume he was shooting sideways. Thank God for his lack of skill! I was only 15 yards away, yet he wasn't able to hit me.

    Now I carry everywhere I go, even to church. I also practice every week. Here in Indianapolis it would be hard to carry (conceal) a really big gun, especially with summer clothing, so I carry a 9mm or a snub .357 Mag. If I could afford it, I would love to get a Colt New Army and carry it in a nice holster whenever feasible.
     
  11. Aug 27, 2012 #31

    Zonie

    Zonie

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    No, a filler has not always been used.
    It is a idea that gained popularity back in the late 1960's and early '70s when people started realizing that Cap & Ball pistols are more accurate with reduced powder loads.

    Although he doesn't say how much powder to use when loading one of his guns, here is a partial quote from the Colt Manual that came with his civilian guns:

    "...First explode a cap on each nipple to clear them from oil or dust, then draw back the hammer to the half-cock, which allows the \par
    cylinder to be rotated; a charge of powder is then placed in one of the chambers, keeping the barrel up. and a ball with the pointed end upwards without wadding or patch is
    put into the mouth of the chamber. turned under the rammer, and forced down with the lever below the surface of the cylinder, so that it cannot hinder its rotation
    (care should be used in ramming down the ball not to shake the powder from the chamber, thereby reducing the charge).
    This is repeated until all the chambers are loaded. Percussion-caps are then placed on the nipples..."
     
  12. Aug 27, 2012 #32

    preston cook

    preston cook

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    :hatsoff:
     
  13. Aug 27, 2012 #33

    Trumpetman

    Trumpetman

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    TO FILL OR NOT TO FILL?
    -- I shoot with a good friend who has been shooting 40 grains of 3f in a very stout New Army .44. He has the original cylinder plus 3 extras. He loads his cylinders with a doo-dad that presses all 6 balls at the same time. The cylinders on his gun are part of a quick-change system, with a 'trick' cylinder pin that has a stop in it, to keep it from coming all the way out of the hole when you pull it to release the cylinder.

    I have fired this gun, and it is fantastic for slow-medium action steel plates, etc., although it roars qite a bit more than I am accustomed to. On the other hand, fast-action shooting may be a challenge with all that smoke and the extra kick of a powder charge that equals my Hawken's target load!

    My friend is an excellent shooter, and at age 70+, he has a lot of good advice to offer. (I'm 57.) Still, he was impressed with my 1851 Confederate Navy Pietta's groups on paper targets. Realizing I use extremely light loads, my friend decided to cut his load down, landing on 33 grains of 3f Goex topped off with cream of wheat and a home-cast .457 99% lead ball and Bore Butter. I didn't think he really needed any filler, but he insisted. This lighter load still would have barely been counter-sunk into the chambers. So, why use filler? In his case, he explained, he needed the balls to be compressed to a certain pressure point. To achieve this compression, his load height needs to match his loading arm's capability. That's because his loading gizmo has a stop in it, so he needs a very full cylinder in order to get good compression at the point where the arm stops pressing the balls down.

    By the way, his groups closed up a bit with his first cylinder-full with the reduced load. He said he might experiment further with a little less powder and a little more filler. We shall see.

    I do believe I found out at least two things about using filler to bring the ball closer to the forcing cone of the barrel. In my case I lost a bit of velocity, but I believe I gained more in accuracy than I lost in velocity. These findings may not be totally reliable, as I have only fired a few cylinders with my current load of 17 grains 3f under 17 grains (by volume) of cream of wheat.

    Still, before I ever used fillers, I was satisfied with the performance of my revolver, in general. I do think my extremely mild load is best served by using a filler. Biggerloads of powder that nearly fill the chamber without filler may or may not be well served by using fillers. I would think it probably depends on the particular gun and the kind of shooting it does.

    I wonder how full the chamber needs to be to avoid using fillers? Any ideas?
     

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