1861 Springfield Repro First Time Clean and Protectant Question

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TDDredge

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Don't forget about Sizing the Minies.

You can get a .577 sizer from Dixie.

If you buy them cast the Minies might have dropped out of the mold oversized. Get a .582 Minie jammed in the pipe of your rifle and it's gonna be a hassle.

When Remington and other manufacturers cast Minies originally, they sized them.
I am waiting until I have the gun, then I'm going to pin gauge the bore, and acquire bullets and a sizer accordingly. I have a pair of calipers so I can measure bullets. To start I won't be casting my own. I'll probably order from track of the wolf, and I'll measure them before I lube them. Honestly I might get a couple .575s out the gate to just get the hang of using the gun and ignoring the lower accuracy that is obviously very likely to result. Then move to sized bullets based on the gauging of the barrel and what bullet size and sizers I can get. Then once I'm really able to bleed a little money, it'll be time to start getting into casting.
 

TDDredge

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Breech scrapers are great for flat faced breeches. Not so great on chambered breeches. A small brush of 30 or 22 caliber is needed to reach into the chambered breech.
Do you know if the 1861 springfield rifles have a chambered breech?
 

TDDredge

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I'm afraid I don't know if your musket has a chambered breech.
Oh come now, you aren't entirely aware of every detail of everything ever? Lol I kid. I'll figure it out, was just hoping you might know off hand and save me a bit of research. Thank you for all your input in all the questions I've asked!
 
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I honestly am willing to trade a little accuracy for the ability to load 40 paper cartridges with a .575 without wiping or jabbing Minies down a fouled bore

20210715_154751.jpg


This is about what my ArmiSport will do from 100 yards with .575 Minies, from a standing shooting position. From a rest , shrink the group up a few inches.

I've fired entire 40 round Cartridge Boxes full and depending on if I do my part I can hit a 12"x12" steel swinger at 200.

20190802_152422.jpg


It's kind of a dilemma, I mean, am I shooting for fun and to experience historically accurate shooting with a Military rifle-musket ? Or am a Target Shooter?

It depends on what rifle I have , usually.

I shoot everything from Smoothbore muskets to Parker-Hale Volunteer rifles, so it depends on what I feel like doing I guess

The Ordnance Dept called for, I believe a .578 or .577 Minie in 1855 for the "new" Springfield rifle, going from memory they tried .576 and after a lot of shooting during Testing and the onset of the war the US Ordnance Dept went with a .575 Minie as a "one size fits all" approach so it could also be used in the Enfield , and given bore variance in manufacturing it gave usable accuracy in combat. They even switched up the lube as time went on .

So , for me, if I'm just trying to enjoy myself I'm more than happy to plug 100 and 200 yard targets with as close to what I'd be using in 1861 rather than trying to get .001 below bore size. I know all of those rounds will go right down the pipe and the rifle will still do its intended job.

If I feel the need to really see what something like my Parker-Hale P53 can do I'll use loose .577 Minies but I'll be swabbing the bore after about 10 of them because the lands mic at about .578.

The "return" on the accuracy isn't always worth having to play with Minie sizing, I tried larger Minies in the ArmiSport and accuracy improvement was minimal , plus after 20 rounds I started getting afraid one was gonna get hung up on fouling.

This is why the British played with their early Pritchett cartridge bullet sizing, during the Crimean War there were reports of British troops having to fight bullets down bores after prolonged firing, so a reduction in the bullet solved the problem

Early writings about Civil War soldiers beating on ramrods with rocks points to probably Enfields being used with early , larger Minies

There's whole books written about this stuff, guys writing home saying they got bullets stuck in the pipe of their rifles and had to discard them ,and find new ones. We're never gonna know if it was a Union soldier trying to use captured Confederate cartridges that had larger bullets, or vice versa , there's too many variables with all this.

I've been there, years ago, beating Minies down the pipe of my first ArmiSport 1861 Springfield because I didn't know about sizing.

The standard sizing to .575 seemed to solve all these problems.
 
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TDDredge

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I honestly am willing to trade a little accuracy for the ability to load 40 paper cartridges with a .575 without wiping or jabbing Minies down a fouled bore

View attachment 89421

This is about what my ArmiSport will do from 100 yards with .575 Minies, from a standing shooting position. From a rest , shrink the group up a few inches.

I've fired entire 40 round Cartridge Boxes full and depending on if I do my part I can hit a 12"x12" steel swinger at 200.

View attachment 89426

It's kind of a dilemma, I mean, am I shooting for fun and to experience historically accurate shooting with a Military rifle-musket ? Or am a Target Shooter?

It depends on what rifle I have , usually.

I shoot everything from Smoothbore muskets to Parker-Hale Volunteer rifles, so it depends on what I feel like doing I guess

The Ordnance Dept called for, I believe a .578 or .577 Minie in 1855 for the "new" Springfield rifle, going from memory they tried .576 and after a lot of shooting during Testing and the onset of the war the US Ordnance Dept went with a .575 Minie as a "one size fits all" approach so it could also be used in the Enfield , and given bore variance in manufacturing it gave usable accuracy in combat. They even switched up the lube as time went on .

So , for me, if I'm just trying to enjoy myself I'm more than happy to plug 100 and 200 yard targets with as close to what I'd be using in 1861 rather than trying to get .001 below bore size. I know all of those rounds will go right down the pipe and the rifle will still do its intended job.

If I feel the need to really see what something like my Parker-Hale P53 can do I'll use loose .577 Minies but I'll be swabbing the bore after about 10 of them because the lands mic at about .578.

The "return" on the accuracy isn't always worth having to play with Minie sizing, I tried larger Minies in the ArmiSport and accuracy improvement was minimal , plus after 20 rounds I started getting afraid one was gonna get hung up on fouling.

This is why the British played with their early Pritchett cartridge bullet sizing, during the Crimean War there were reports of British troops having to fight bullets down bores after prolonged firing, so a reduction in the bullet solved the problem

Early writings about Civil War soldiers beating on ramrods with rocks points to probably Enfields being used with early , larger Minies

There's whole books written about this stuff, guys writing home saying they got bullets stuck in the pipe of their rifles and had to discard them ,and find new ones. We're never gonna know if it was a Union soldier trying to use captured Confederate cartridges that had larger bullets, or vice versa , there's too many variables with all this.

I've been there, years ago, beating Minies down the pipe of my first ArmiSport 1861 Springfield because I didn't know about sizing.

The standard sizing to .575 seemed to solve all these problems.
Well, it's real easy for me. Pin gauged my bore. .577 fits, .578 doesn't fit. So .575 minies it is! Hadn't cleaned the barrel just yet, and it is a + pin gauge, and .578 ALMOST fit, but not quite. So I think .575 minies will be a very happy size for this gun.
 
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Well, it's real easy for me. Pin gauged my bore. .577 fits, .578 doesn't fit. So .575 minies it is! Hadn't cleaned the barrel just yet, and it is a + pin gauge, and .578 ALMOST fit, but not quite. So I think .575 minies will be a very happy size for this gun.
If they are tight in a clean bore, they will be hard to load when fouled.

.575 should produce good accuracy and be easy to load.

Bear in mind what these Minie rifles were designed for , to increase the range of volley fire , to have a high rate of fire (for the period) and give the individual soldier a Combat Accurate weapon. They are capable of excellent accuracy but they're usually not "ragged hole at 200 yards" rifles.

They have heavy triggers and shoot high , POA vs POI is always high. They can hit a man sized target at 300 and an area target to 1000+. Some shoot better than others. The Italians sometimes do a less than perfect job fitting the barrel to the stock.

Only one way to know, and that's to get out and shoot it :)
 
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2 targets- one from a Zoli Zouave, the other from an Armi Sport Richmond, both from sandbags at 100 yards. Bullet was the RCBS Hodgdon 416 grain bullet lubed with beeswax and mutton tallow. Powder charge was 50 grains of Goex 2F.
 

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2 targets- one from a Zoli Zouave, the other from an Armi Sport Richmond, both from sandbags at 100 yards. Bullet was the RCBS Hodgdon 416 grain bullet lubed with beeswax and mutton tallow. Powder charge was 50 grains of Goex 2F.
These groups fall well within the 4" at 100 yard "standard" , ArmiSport does a good job with their barrels. Mine shoots very well with .570 round balls and bigger charges like 80gr
 
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