1840-60 period ignored

[BillinOregon]

Finished Summer Moon, then read "Texas and the Mexican War" by Robinson and am now half way through Cremony's "Life Among the Apaches."
There are absolutely no grounds for the excuse that this period is without significant history!

 

[Claude Mathis]

There are absolutely no grounds for the excuse that this period is without significant history!

All periods have significant history. The question is, does a period (small window) have enough interest for the general public, to justify reenactments?

 

[montanawolfer]

"All periods have significant history. The question is, does a period (small window) have enough interest for the general public, to justify reenactments."


Absolutely. The 1840 to '65 period was active from Minnesota (Sioux) to the Southwest (Apaches), throughout much of California, the war with Mexico, Texas Rangers and Comanches, the gold rushes from California to Colorado to Montana, early buffalo hunting in Eastern Kansas, Indian conflict on the plains (the Gratten Massacre, Bluewater) Border Ruffians, Cracker Cowboys, and etc. All of these would hold interest for the general public, and allow for expanding the public's knowledge outside of the current rendezvous/cowboy eras.

Just a couple of current historical sites that include annual encampments would be Bent's Old Fort (1846) in Colorado, and Fort Union (1851) in North Dakota. All it takes is a group of like-minded men and women who want to explore a new time frame. The inclusion of percussion revolvers and certain breech-loading rifles doesn't hurt, either.

 

[Stillwater]

The book "Crow Killer," was fiction... I wish it were otherwise, but unfortunately, it was fiction through and through.

Although "White eye" Jack Anderson did die in southern California.

Bill

 

[BHScout]

Thread resurrection.
I hope that's ok.
I really do like this time period, Besides westward expanssion and all the noted things going on this also was a time of scientific exploration that also had hired guides.

 

[Red Owl]

I agree 100%. I started out many years ago as a "mountain man" with my Hawken rifle and Colt Navy, etc. I then learned a lot wasn't "pre-1840" so I got suckered into the Pre-1840 thing but for many folks, I think they would be better off just portraying a post-1840 Mountain man. Jim Bridger, Kit Carson, Meeks, etc.- just as they were after 1840.

 

[sheriff john]

Around here Hannibal, Missouri, it's all about Mark Twain. Sadly, the only personas around are Tom and Becky. Nobody doing Injun Joe nor "Jim". We have the setting, but no one's started anything. Thought about getting a Sheriff's Posse together, but don't know where to start. Runaway slaves are pretty scarce these days.

 

[David Y. Snellen]

Gentlemen,
Personally, I LOVE the 1840-65 period. In that period we had the most interesting guns, clothes and saddles. I would have a hard time (personally) reenacting something that didn't happen where I live. I never understood the SCA portraying knights and their fights in Kentucky, but each to their own.
Most of my people are from Ky, Tenn and Missouri. I reenacted as a Missouri Partisan Ranger and carried 4 pistols on my person and 4 on my horse. I loved that hey-day in the 1990's. But... I am 52 now. Political correctness demonized anything Southern, covid killed the rest of the reenactments. Young people are only interested in using their thumbs...
But for me, the 1850s are perfect. Again, great guns, clothes and saddles and we hadn't lost everything yet. At my age, portraying a guerilla is stretching it (yes, Capt. Anderson had a man that was 62 riding with him, but most were late teens early 20s).
Respectfully,
David

 

[Rendezvous Valley Trading]

Strange this was brought up today! I was in working in my shop today and was listening to a tv series I have on dvd playing because I am sick of the radio and it got me kinda thinking about that. It’s called Into The West. It portrays a families’ life from pretty much the fur trade to about 1900 ish. Not the greatest series ever made but is fairly interesting. Alot happened in that period, but it is pretty glazed over or just kinda bullet pointed.

 

[Rod Man]

Few folks also do 1812 in the states. At an office in DC I once saw a fancy brass plaque that said, " On this site on November 23, 1872, absolutely nothing of importance occurred."

For many history buffs, that same "nothing of importance occurred" is true for that time period.

Hollywood and the media have so romanticized some parts of our history and ignored others.

A few movies about the original cattle drives, very few about the Mexican War era or 1812.

One movie about Fremont that I recall. Any about Kit Carson? Not many superheros from that era. Davy Crockett was gone in 1836. A few minor Indian uprisings.

People do not realize how critical the 1st Quarter of the 19th Century was. We barely made it. We were literally just fumbling a long trying to figure it all out, a brand new Republic. The Federalist/Republicans infighting and the Louisiana Purchase and subsequent Corps of Discovery, the War of 1812 and of Course the migration to the west and then there is Texas. To me this is the most exciting of times. I agree, with the OP however. My people were in Texas at that time and it was not easy. The Texas Rangers were in a constant state of undeclared war with the Red Man, Ruffian, Bandit and a Hostile Nation to its south all of “US” just trying to hold on.

Interesting times.

RM

 

[TNBandit]

Funny you should mention this time period. My current Winter project is bringing back from the dead a Springfield Model 1842 that had the typical shotgun conversion by chopping the stock and the barrel down after the Civil War. Those are extremely easy to find and usually cheap. I've got 160 bucks into this one and mechanically it's in great condition. I've also got a spare Model 1842 lock from Harpers Ferry set aside for a future project and looking for an 1841 "Mississippi" to mess with. It was an interesting time period. Flintlocks were just being phased out and the Model 1842 was considered to be one of the first entirely interchangeable rifles where parts from one would fit another with no fussing around.

 

[BHScout]

I'd like to find one of those usually cheap model 1842

 

[TNBandit]

I'd like to find one of those usually cheap model 1842

I was speaking of the ones with cut down stocks & barrels. They're out there.

 

[Notchy Bob]

Kudos to @BillinOregon for bringing this up... Ten years ago!

That 1840-1865 era is probably my favorite period of history on the western frontier. The "classic" Hawken halfstock rifles were a product of the 1850's. Some of the most beloved and most often quoted mountain man references... Ruxton, Garrard, Parkman... date to the mid-1840's. There are plenty of original accounts of beaver trappers in Nebraska, Kansas, and the Rockies and northern plains throughout the forties, fifties, and sixties, even into the seventies. Roosevelt described meeting "mountain men"... hunters and trappers... into the eighties. I think the reason for the last rendezvous in 1840 was a temporary decline in the value of beaver coupled with the surge in construction of trading posts and forts in the far west. The rendezvous was simply obsolete.

It's good to see some interest here.

Best regards,

Notchy Bob

 

[FiremanBrad]

Don’t forget the Missouri Border War and Bloody Kansas!!!
Dadgum Jayhawkers anyway!!

 

[Essayons!]

Gentlemen,
Personally, I LOVE the 1840-65 period. In that period we had the most interesting guns, clothes and saddles. I would have a hard time (personally) reenacting something that didn't happen where I live. I never understood the SCA portraying knights and their fights in Kentucky, but each to their own.
Most of my people are from Ky, Tenn and Missouri. I reenacted as a Missouri Partisan Ranger and carried 4 pistols on my person and 4 on my horse. I loved that hey-day in the 1990's. But... I am 52 now. Political correctness demonized anything Southern, covid killed the rest of the reenactments. Young people are only interested in using their thumbs...
But for me, the 1850s are perfect. Again, great guns, clothes and saddles and we hadn't lost everything yet. At my age, portraying a guerilla is stretching it (yes, Capt. Anderson had a man that was 62 riding with him, but most were late teens early 20s).
Respectfully,
David

I really think the "Era of Expansion" 1820-1844 is the most neglected era for reenactors/living history involving clothing, headwear, footwear US uniforms(some sources)...

 

[nkbj]

There was an old western on TV yesterday with Fremont, some mountain men and other characters. Forget now what show it was. Maybe Death Valley. Robert Taylor was the host.
Made me think about my Fremont

 

[DuncNZ]

Kudos to @BillinOregon for bringing this up... Ten years ago!

That 1840-1865 era is probably my favorite period of history on the western frontier. The "classic" Hawken halfstock rifles were a product of the 1850's. Some of the most beloved and most often quoted mountain man references... Ruxton, Garrard, Parkman... date to the mid-1840's. There are plenty of original accounts of beaver trappers in Nebraska, Kansas, and the Rockies and northern plains throughout the forties, fifties, and sixties, even into the seventies. Roosevelt described meeting "mountain men"... hunters and trappers... into the eighties. I think the reason for the last rendezvous in 1840 was a temporary decline in the value of beaver coupled with the surge in construction of trading posts and forts in the far west. The rendezvous was simply obsolete.

It's good to see some interest here.

Best regards,

Notchy Bob

Notchy Bob , I believe some the decline in the fur trade and the rendezvous was as you say , but it was considerably enhanced by the development of the silk top hat , much more glamorous and stylish than the beaver one .

 

[Jim Wag]

Dang
Cut
To think that
Style
Could impact the
Course of
Western expansion

Jim in La Luz

 

[BillinOregon]

nkbj: Is that the "Fremonted" Model 1842, rifled and shortened? We need photos, man! Always wanted to handle and shoot one of these. Fremont and Carson explored, mapped and named much of the far West.