1765-1775 English Fowler

[dave_person]

Hi,
Here is my version of an export or 2nd quality grade English fowling gun from 1765-1775. Thousands of these generic guns were made and sometimes ordered by the half dozen by wealthy landowners to serve as guns for guests. They were also exported. Mine is scaled down as if ordered for an adolescent son and will be owned by a petite woman reenactor. The LOP is just over 13”, drop at heel is 2.5”, barrel is 20 gauge, 36” long by Getz. The lock is a small Siler reshaped into a flat-faced English lock. The thumb escutcheon was designed and cast by me and all of the engraving was closely inspired by original guns. The stock is American black walnut that I logged 30 years ago and I colored it to look more like English walnut. The gun was built, decorated, and finished in an efficient workmanlike manner without a lot of fuss. When I hold it next to my original fowler, it looks pretty authentic. Enjoy the photos and comments are welcome.

dave

 

[Micah Clark]

Good Golly, Miss Mollie . .that is gorgeous, from end to end.

I am building a Jim Chambers PA fowler that is a very similar design. . it is in LH so it has a Siler lock that I've tried to make look more English and less Siler-ish . . . but it's not even in the same league as this one.

My stock is maple, but I love the color of your stock.

WOW . . . is all I can say . .thanks for posting pics !!

 

[Artificer]

OMG, she is gorgeous!

Isn't that the lock you converted from the Siler lock?

Is there "a story" on why you used the Military Panoply Engraving on top the butt plate? I REALLY like it.

Since you mentioned this was an "export" grade, I was wondering what the period terminology in the 18th century was? For example, was there a "Best" Grade and then next an "Export" Grade and then maybe some kind of "economy" grade?

Thank you for sharing. Always LOVE to see examples of your work.

Gus

 

[Col. Batguano]

Are English Fowler locks and lock panels kicked outwards at the front the way English Sporting Rifles are? I can't really tell if they are from your pictures, but have no doubt that what uyou did was historically correct.

I'd been considering doing an ESR build, but have been discouraged by the lack of suitable English Walnut blanks offered that are long enough for a full stock. Lots of blanks around for modern guns. Precious few for ML'ers. Your treatment of American walnut gives me hope there may be a viable alternative.

 

[Capt. Jas.]

Super nice job.
What is the drop at the comb nose?

 

[dave_person]

Hi,
James, I will measure it for you. I don't know off hand. Mac, thanks for the kind words. It is a nice handling gun that weighs just about 5lbs. Gus, I looked forward to hearing from you! The lock is the one I converted from a Siler. The panoply of arms was a common motif and in this case has no significance. The engraving would have been farmed out to the engraver guild and they might choose the design because it was "manly" and popular. The Brits did not have hard classified grades but it was understood that there were quality differences for wealthy and aristocratic elites, middle class sportsmen, military and militia, and poorer quality trade items. I am sure very few American colonists could afford the highest quality guns, so the best they could do were the well made "second quality guns offered for export. I believe my gun is a good quality example of that.

dave

 

[dave_person]

Hi David,
The flared in architecture on late flint English guns results from the invention of the stepped patent breech in the early 19th century. You really have to understand that English guns evolved over time just like American guns. During 1767-1770 the were no patent breeches, no stepped breeches, very few roller frizzens (William Bailes started the fashion in the 1760s), few "waterproof pans", little color case hardening, and little heat bluing or rust browning. Lock panels were parallel. All those other things that you mention came 30-35 years later.

dave

 

[Artificer]

Dave,

Thank you so much. I did not realize that about the Military Panoply. Back in the 70's, I wanted an American Sergeant's Gorget for use in FIW reenacting. So I traded work with a very good friend and he made a very nice gorget and then unexpectantly engraved something similar on it, but not as elaborate as yours. It was very nicely engraved, but I thought it would not be correct for the period. Turns out it may well have been, then.

Part of the reason I asked about the grades of British Guns was from genealogical research done by my Sister. She has extensive records on eight families in our line. So I had a question about Christian Springs, PA; as she has done a lot of research in historical archives around there. When I told her the question referred to the gunsmiths living there, she said, “Oh, did I mention we have a famous gunsmith further back in our line?” My jaw dropped, as I had asked her a few years earlier about any gunsmiths in our line and she told me then that we had none. So I asked her who it was?

Well, she did not remember the name at first, but remembered a fairly good bit about him. She said when the family stopped off in England to earn more money for the voyage to America, this gunsmith ancestor had studied firearms engraving for a year and a half so he could do “Royal Quality” gun work. Then she added that for the guns he had made for Royalty, he was not allowed to engrave his name on them. This because it was not acceptable for a “commoner’s name” to be on a Royal’s Gun. It was permissible for a trade card to be attached “unobtrusively” somewhere on the case, though. She then informed me that he did so well in England with a fairly large shop and employees, he wound up staying there instead of moving on to the Colonies. Needless to say I was stunned and asked her to try to find the information again. (Note: My sister grew up hunting, but has no interest in gun collecting. So I was rather floored by this description.)

However, I am not sure where my Sister read or came up with the “royal” adjective, though. The information she had may have stated “the nobility” and she transposed that into “Royal.” Anyway, she could not remember exactly where that information was at, so I had to wait some months to find out more.

A few weeks ago and out of the blue, my Sister remarked, “Oh, found some of that information on the gunsmith in England.” She did not quite pronounce the name correctly but it was close enough I said in awe and shock, “Do you mean Durs Egg”!!” She said, “Yes, I think that is correct, but the bad news is he is not a direct ancestor.” Seems my Great Great Grandfather’s Brother married a Lady who was a direct descendant of Durs Egg. Oh well, at least we got some of the blood in the family.

Gus

 

[dave_person]

Hi Gus,
That is a great bit of history. Egg first worked for John Twigg in London before setting up his own business. As to signing "Royal" guns, the maker certainly signed them and if there is any silver or gold ornamentation, the metal is hallmarked along with the stamp of the gold or silversmith. Certainly, stockers and engravers rarely if ever signed their work.

dave

 

[pargent]

:applause: :applause: :applause: :hatsoff:

 

[dave_person]

Hi James,
Drop at the wrist just in front of the comb is 1 11/16". Drop at the top of the comb is 1 1/2" at a position 3/4" back from the end of the comb.

dave

 

[Capt. Jas.]

Hi James,
Drop at the wrist just in front of the comb is 1 11/16". Drop at the top of the comb is 1 1/2" at a position 3/4" back from the end of the comb.

dave

Much appreciated Dave!

 

[Flintlock]

Would you be seeking to adopt any older children, I can have my bags packed at a moments notice. That really is a remarkable gun.

 

[wattlebuster]

Beautiful :bow: You do some fine work

 

[Cowboy]

I never tire of seeing your work. A masterpiece as usual!!

Respectfully, Cowboy

 

[Mickc01]

2nd quality grade!!?? All I can say is WOW!....Mick

 

[MSW]

tremendous! now about the drool on my keyboard...

 

[dave_person]

Hi Folks,
Thank you for your interest and comments on my work. The gun really does represent a generic quality of gun from that time and place. While I did all of the work, except the barrel and some of the hardware, in London probably 7 different tradesmen would have been involved. The gun probably would barely be noticed in 18th century England. As an example, I normally draw my engraving designs precisely on paper, scan them and print the image on transparency film. Then I transfer the image to the metal for cutting. On this gun, I just drew the designs freehand on the metal with a film marker and cut them. That gave them an imperfect, freehanded look very similar to the original 2nd quality London fowler that I own. Despite its average quality, it would have cost 3-4 pounds sterling at a time when 80% of English families earned

 

[Col. Batguano]

What would make it 1st quality, and then best quality then? The architecture would (likely) be the same. The Brits of the time didn't go in much for a lot of fancy carving. Would it be more highly figured wood, and more detailed engraving (more shading)? More sterling silver and a more elaborate left side plate?

 

[dave_person]

Hi David,
This would be best quality but from about 25 years earlier:

dave