Ramrod ends - Steel or Wood?

Toneloc · Jan 15, 2023

Stupid question here, but kinda curious what others prefer and why.

Getting close to finishing my Kibler SMR kit in .45. This is my first build and first “nice” muzzleloader. Coming from my TC guns, used to seeing the ball driving side of the ramrod have a metal coned tip…..so never driven any balls with a wood tip only. I see metal tips of every size readily available on TOTW (about to put an order in anyway for some permalyn). Curious what you all think on this? Do you have a preference on this? Any advantages/disadvantages with metal vs wood tip?

Thanks,
Tony

david w · Jan 15, 2023

You may find wood is too soft and will soon be damaged. A metal tip has a threaded end which allows you to use several different attachments.

Smokey Plainsman · Jan 15, 2023

Brass with cupped end to protect the nose of the ball.

longcruise · Jan 16, 2023

Smokey Plainsman said:
Brass with cupped end to protect the nose of the ball.

Ditto, and one on each end ta boot. If you like the look of steel it's ok too.

JamesT · Jan 16, 2023

I prefer a tapered rammer. Fatter wooden end to seat the ball. The skinnier end with the metal tip for cleaning.,etc
James

Ames · Jan 16, 2023

longcruise said:
Ditto, and one on each end ta boot.

Yep. What he said. With a metal tip on each end, if need be, you can thread a metal T handle into a stuck or slippery rod and pull it out.
That can save the day pulling a ball in the woods.

Rifleman1776 · Jan 16, 2023

I have used all kinds of material. Wood (hickory) is just fine. I like to fire harden the cupped tips. Other materials like Delrin or other hard plastics, antler, brass, exotic woods like ebony all work just fine. There is little wear on a rod tip. Do wat you like, yer own thang.

Toneloc · Jan 16, 2023

Thanks guys. The rod that came with the kit seems like good quality hickory that would probably stand up pretty decent. It came with a metal threaded tip for the end that goes into the stock. Rest of the kit is steel so thats where I was coming for on that….otherwise would go brass.

Good point about being able to put a T handle on and pull a ball…think that seals it for me….will be adding a tip to the ball end…

Thanks for the input guys.

JamesT · Jan 16, 2023

Bore end and jag end. Tapered

hickory.

TDM · Jan 16, 2023

Agree with @Rifleman1776. Either use the wood end for ramming or get a cupped brass jag to thread in your metal kit. I personally seldom, if ever, use the ram rods on my guns. I have range rods for each and use them.

ohio ramrod · Jan 16, 2023

I make my ramrods with brass tips on both ends, One end sized for patches and radiused for the caliber and threaded, the other end straight and threaded. This allows me to use a "T" handle to pull stuck patches or dry balls, as if I would ever dry ball!

ColonialRifleSmith · Jan 16, 2023

Toneloc said:
Stupid question here, but kinda curious what others prefer and why.

Getting close to finishing my Kibler SMR kit in .45. This is my first build and first “nice” muzzleloader. Coming from my TC guns, used to seeing the ball driving side of the ramrod have a metal coned tip…..so never driven any balls with a wood tip only. I see metal tips of every size readily available on TOTW (about to put an order in anyway for some permalyn). Curious what you all think on this? Do you have a preference on this? Any advantages/disadvantages with metal vs wood tip?

Thanks,
Tony

Well, if I put a metal end on my ramrods, I use either brass or german silver. I only use steel if the customer insists. Steel against steel can spark. Can ruin your whole day. Have I ever heard of it happening, yes. Have I ever seen it happen, no. I don't want it to happen with one of my guns. If you use white brass instead of steel, 'Brass Black' does a great job blending it in with the rest of the steel furniture. I just finished a gun with steel furniture and a white brass rod tip darkened with brass black. I'm not one to attempt fate. Semper Fi.

FlinterNick · Jan 17, 2023

For my tips i generally use sheet brass with an open end or i tip it with nail or tack.

the small end i use a tapered end that is threaded.

oldwood · Jan 17, 2023

End that goes in the gun is plain w/no tip. The end sitting exposed in the r/r thimbles , gets a pinned on tip , w/ 8 /32 for a screw on tip to seat the ball. Like a lot of folks , I have a wooden range rod to use while at practice. The range rod takes the ware , and the rifle rod lasts longer.

FlinterNick · Jan 17, 2023

oldwood said:
End that goes in the gun is plain w/no tip. The end sitting exposed in the r/r thimbles , gets a pinned on tip , w/ 8 /32 for a screw on tip to seat the ball. Like a lot of folks , I have a wooden range rod to use while at practice. The range rod takes the ware , and the rifle rod lasts longer.

Mine rods are all tipped on both ends. I do use a range rod however not when in the field.

LRB · Jan 17, 2023

ColonialRifleSmith said:
Well, if I put a metal end on my ramrods, I use either brass or german silver. I only use steel if the customer insists. Steel against steel can spark. Can ruin your whole day. Have I ever heard of it happening, yes. Have I ever seen it happen, no. I don't want it to happen with one of my guns. If you use white brass instead of steel, 'Brass Black' does a great job blending it in with the rest of the steel furniture. I just finished a gun with steel furniture and a white brass rod tip darkened with brass black. I'm not one to attempt fate. Semper Fi.

View attachment 190849

View attachment 190850

Please excuse me, and although you are entitled to your beliefs, but that is ridiculous considering the intended use of a ramrod tip. If you can cause a spark from two pieces of cold low carbon steel coming together at hand force inside a gun barrel, you are a very special being. Yes, two pieces of steel forced to rub together in very fast motion, under a high degree of force and pressure would build enough heat to ignite black powder, but this would be of an extraordinary planned and designed event and impossible inside of a gun barrel otherwise. Sorry, but your reason is not reasonable. Anyway, the common ramrods of the 18th c. civilian guns would be a tapered wood rod with or without a sheet iron tip on the entry end and a wide front end of bare wood to seat the load. Preferably concaved a tad bit for a ball if wanted. Ideally, the steel tip should not have contact with the bore walls anyway.

Timmit · Jan 17, 2023

On the Kibler SMR, Jim supplies you with a tapered steel tip that goes into the ramrod hole in the stock. Since it is an iron furnished gun, I would go with a steel tip on the exposed end of the ramrod if you want one at all. Brass does not look right on a SMR.

FlinterNick · Jan 17, 2023

LRB said:
Please excuse me, and although you are entitled to your beliefs, but that is ridiculous considering the intended use of a ramrod tip. If you can cause a spark from two pieces of cold low carbon steel coming together at hand force inside a gun barrel, you are a very special being. Yes, two pieces of steel forced to rub together in very fast motion, under a high degree of force and pressure would build enough heat to ignite black powder, but this would be of an extraordinary planned and designed event and impossible inside of a gun barrel otherwise. Sorry, but your reason is not reasonable. Anyway, the common ramrods of the 18th c. civilian guns would be a tapered wood rod with or without a sheet iron tip on the entry end and a wide front end of bare wood to seat the load. Preferably concaved a tad bit for a ball if wanted. Ideally, the steel tip should not have contact with the bore walls anyway.

I use a non-Ferros metal, Brass, Copper or bronze or aluminum, and i have a few steel tipped ones but i tend to avoid the steel as it wears out the rifling.

FlinterNick · Jan 17, 2023

FlinterNick said:
I use a non-Ferros metal, Brass, Copper or bronze or aluminum and i have a few that are steel.

ColonialRifleSmith said:
Well, if I put a metal end on my ramrods, I use either brass or german silver. I only use steel if the customer insists. Steel against steel can spark. Can ruin your whole day. Have I ever heard of it happening, yes. Have I ever seen it happen, no. I don't want it to happen with one of my guns. If you use white brass instead of steel, 'Brass Black' does a great job blending it in with the rest of the steel furniture. I just finished a gun with steel furniture and a white brass rod tip darkened with brass black. I'm not one to attempt fate. Semper Fi.

View attachment 190849

View attachment 190850

Spark ? Thats highly unlikely.

If that were actually a fact, then many military arms (reproduction and original) would have exploded upon loading them as they use steel rammers.

If a round ignites as its being rammed, you can rest assure it’s not because a spark was generated from the contact of the barrel and rammer tip.

It’s likely there were embers in the breech or some fouling built up create a fuse effect or there were embers in the pan.

Toneloc · Jan 17, 2023

Feel like I'm having a conversation with my enginerd friends

(I'm an engineer, so I can make fun of my type).

My thought is....IF it was possible to generate a spark, I want to know how it would get past the ball and patch and ignite the powder? Low carbon steel tip on ram rod damaging the rifling? I guess that's possible...but wouldn't it be softer than barrel steel? The tip is not going to have knife edge to grab onto metal either if it did wander to the side a bit. Probably would take an awful lot of sloppy ram rodding to wear out rifling from an steel tip ram rod.

Ramrod ends - Steel or Wood?

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