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Be careful Shooting Indian made guns in the Rain- stock trouble

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ajbennettnc

ajbennettnc

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Took my Indian made Long Land musket out for a rainy day hunt the other day. Didn't see any deer after an hour or so and we can't hunt between 9 and 12 on Sundays so I went back to the house and fired off the load. Had beeswax around the pan, reprised halfway through the time out there, and kept my lock and breech under a wool blanket as much as possible.
The gun went off gun fine and rang a 8 in steel at 50 yards. I pulled the barrel off to clean so as to dry out the barrel channel, and when I reassembled everything later I saw this... (see photo attached.)
The load wasn't super heavy, .715 ball and tow wadding over 85 or 90 grains.
Reckon this Rosewood(?) Stock won't be seeing such aquatic action anymore, just in case.
Any advice on this is appreciated!
 

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Also, I feel the need to explain the rust on the tang. I bought this gun used a year ago off a fellow reenactor. The breech tang was already in the condition notable here, and I keep my gun's as clean as I can. I reckon I need to take more steel wool to it and polish a bit more, especially before the next inspection of my 18th century Militia unit.
 
2 shots said:
might have been too tightly inlet or maybe the breech is not seated square to the stock, putting the recoil force on the tang.
Click to expand...
I agree! I always file a large draft on the back of the tank so if anything it would ride up over the back inlet. But also, it was very common on the trade guns to have a space behind the tang.

Also note that the better that the breech area and around the breech plug is inlet/bedded, the less the rearward recoil thrust will act on the tang.

That wood might be a ‘dry’ wood, but I think that is a symptom, not the cause.
 
The tang locates the barrel in the stock but should not bear any of the recoil load. Hence a small gap is often purposefully left. The force of the recoil is taken by the tang nail. One reason for it to screw into the hand guard. This is a good reason not to bubba a wood screw in to replace a rear nail. I would imagine that the rain caused the wood behind the tang to swell slightly, just enough to bear upon the tang itself. Then the recoil would impact the wood. The unnamed Indian wood may be more prone to swelling than good walnut although perfectly sound otherwise. The preventative is to both keep the wood well oiled and to leave a tiny gap, rather more than in a walnut stock. Easy enough to cut in a new piece of wood to replace the chip and rework the clearance.
 
RAEDWALD said:
The tang locates the barrel in the stock but should not bear any of the recoil load. Hence a small gap is often purposefully left. The force of the recoil is taken by the tang nail. One reason for it to screw into the hand guard. This is a good reason not to bubba a wood screw in to replace a rear nail. I would imagine that the rain caused the wood behind the tang to swell slightly, just enough to bear upon the tang itself. Then the recoil would impact the wood. The unnamed Indian wood may be more prone to swelling than good walnut although perfectly sound otherwise. The preventative is to both keep the wood well oiled and to leave a tiny gap, rather more than in a walnut stock. Easy enough to cut in a new piece of wood to replace the chip and rework the clearance.
Click to expand...

Correct, and it's not just India made guns.

I've seen a Perdersoli kit eject a large chunk of wood from the edge of the tang acting sorta like a wood chisel.

What sometimes happens is the tang screw is in a hole that is too large. That's what happened with the Pedersoli, the owner had enlarged the tang screw hole to make it easy to put in the tang screw.

The other reason this happens is that the tang screw alone is not supposed to take all of the recoil. ;) The butt of the barrel and the tang-lug, when properly seated in the stock, rests on a lot of wood, and that takes the recoil. However, factory kits and factory guns often take away too much wood. So while "bedding" a barrel is not necessarily needed, if the tang/breech area is bedded on a factory gun, the bedding compound takes up the space where too much wood was removed, and thus helps to solve the problem.

In the above Pedersoli Kit situation, the wood piece was large enough that it was found. It was secured to the stock with bedding compound, along with bedding a small portion of the breech, and filling the tang screw hole, and redrilling it, so the screw was supported as well.

LD
 
Loyalist Dave said:
Correct, and it's not just India made guns.

I've seen a Perdersoli kit eject a large chunk of wood from the edge of the tang acting sorta like a wood chisel.

What sometimes happens is the tang screw is in a hole that is too large. That's what happened with the Pedersoli, the owner had enlarged the tang screw hole to make it easy to put in the tang screw.

The other reason this happens is that the tang screw alone is not supposed to take all of the recoil. ;) The butt of the barrel and the tang-lug, when properly seated in the stock, rests on a lot of wood, and that takes the recoil. However, factory kits and factory guns often take away too much wood. So while "bedding" a barrel is not necessarily needed, if the tang/breech area is bedded on a factory gun, the bedding compound takes up the space where too much wood was removed, and thus helps to solve the problem.

In the above Pedersoli Kit situation, the wood piece was large enough that it was found. It was secured to the stock with bedding compound, along with bedding a small portion of the breech, and filling the tang screw hole, and redrilling it, so the screw was supported as well.

LD
Click to expand...
Quite so. The recoil force, as a whole, is taken up by assorted bits of stock. But in the case of the tang my point was merely that the tang itself does not but the tang nail plays a significant role. If one looks at 15th century Western European guns and at middle eastern guns there is no tang and the barrel breech is flat and bears directly upon the stock.
 
I don't leave the end of my tangs square, I cut a draft around the tang to make inletting tight and easier. On the back end I file this draft to about 10-15 degrees and leave a small wood gap behind the tang. This doesn't show and there is only a sliver of metal close to the back of the inlet.

You can see the gap on the square edges behind the screw, the is no square metal on the tang to the rear of the screw it is all beveled underneath the wood rather sharply.

gray barrel.jpg
 
Wood swells. I like a bit of gap around everything then bed what needs it.
A good finish that seals the wood.
Last months club shoot it was drizzling and several people had issues with swelling. Mainly in lock area.
 

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