Buck & Ball question

This is probably something I should know, but I don't. If I want to load my Bess with Buck & Ball, I'm loading something around a .715 round ball on top of three .319 round balls (which is 00 buckshot, yes?).
The cartridges I've seen appear to have the powder charge on the bottom, then the large (.715) round ball, and the three buckshot balls on top of that. Is that because in use one bites open the powder end, charges the pan, pours the rest down the barrel, then turns the cartridge upside down before ramming it down on top of the powder?
So, the load is: powder, paper, three buckshot balls, one full size ball, and whatever paper is left from the cartridge. Am I right on this?
Thanks again for the help. This forum has proven to be an invaluable resource for me. :bow:

From what i have seen and heard they work better with the buckshot on top of the ball. The only way to know for sure how yours does though is to try it both ways. So it would be powder patched rd ball, buckshot and then an overshot card wad.

That's interesting. I always though the buckshot went on top. OK I'm confused. :hmm:

Cruzatte

The image I found shows the buckshot on top as well...

"Curiouser and curiouser!" said Musketman... :hmm:

Buckshot goes on top of the powder then the ball.
This was used in the Civil War but wasn't a common practice. Don't know how common it was in earlier times.

:hmm: --I'd always assumed the buck was on top so that the ball would serve as the wad behind the buck. I'd always thought that shortly past the muzzle, the ball would drive past the buck and scatter it wildly. Makes more sense that one would turn the cartridge upside down after dumping the powder. :hmm:
Anyhow, I can't see much practical use for such a load, certainly not for hunting.

It never was a hunting load it's a short range man killing load. If you miss with the ball ya gets three more chances.

rebel727 said:

It never was a hunting load it's a short range man killing load. If you miss with the ball ya gets three more chances.

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Yeah, so is your neighborhood plagued with an infestation of red coats? :haha:

CoyoteJoe said:

Yeah, so is your neighborhood plagued with an infestation of red coats? :haha:

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Ummmm, nooo. :haha: I never said I used them. Never have and don't have anything they would work out of.

i shoot buck and ball out of my 42 loaded with paper cartridge no wad or patch. if you put the round ball on top of the buckshot sometimes the powder will blow past pushing the ball out but leaving some buck in the barrel. so i put buck on top of ball and seat paper cartridge on top of buck

The original way of doing it was ram the paper down on top of the powder then the shot, then the ball.

Sorry, ball is loaded with the buckshot on top, other wise the small buckshot will loose velocity VERY quickly and dribble out of the bore doing no harm. Best loaded while still wrapped in the cartridge paper after tearing the paper and dumping the powder in the barrel and almost always was done this way. In US (and CS) service, a .64 - .65 cal. ball was used and that left plenty of room in the .69 - .715 cal. US muskets to use the paper to take up windage.

Although we have used buck and ball at our Fort deChartres musket frolics, we didn't do it at our skirmish this time; but we understand others have tried it in N SSA demonstration matches. Buck and ball was, of course, the standard load for U.S. smoothbore muskets by the time of the Civil War. The round generally consisted of three or four buckshot, loaded in conjunction with a standard musket ball. While it is inconvenient (and actually not very effective) to use buck and ball routinely in skirmish competition, it is a heck of a lot of fun to issue a packet of three .30 caliber buck to each shooter at the start of the pigeon board relay. so that the first volley is the traditional buck and ball load. For those new to buck and ball, the .30 caliber projectiles go into the barrel first, followed by the musket ball.
[url] http://www.n-ssa.org/SKIRMISHLINE/1997/nov97-6.htm[/url]

I've read somewhere where a fellow did some accuracy tests with buck-n-ball and tried them both ways (ball over buck and vise versa). He suspected that the ball over the buckshot would be superior but it didn't turn out that way. In my .69 Chareville I have only tried it with powder,patched 662 ball, 3 .32 balls over that and the whole thing kept in place with some newsprint wadding. Shot at a human sillouette target at about 25-30 yards with great effect. One very dead target with all projectiles striking the chest/stomach area. squint

squint said:

In my .69 Chareville I have only tried it with powder,patched 662 ball, 3 .32 balls over that. Shot at a human sillouette target at about 25-30 yards with great effect. One very dead target with all projectiles striking the chest/stomach area. squint

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I have had EXACTLY the same experience with my .69 Charleville. Loading buck on top of the ball almost always produces a nice triangle of 3 buckshot holes around one large hole at 25 yards.
I get about the same results at 25 yards using a paper cartridge (brown lunch bag) or loaded loose with over powder cards.
Jack

I have shot .662 patched round ball with
3 - oo buck with an over shot card on top from my Fusil de Chasse.

At 25 yd. it produced one large hole in the center, and 3 equaly spaced holes at about 14 inches from the center.

Interesting!

At the Battle of Fredericksburg during the American Civil War, when the Yankees got close enough to lay down fire with their smoothbore buck and ball loads at the Sunken Road, they literally slaughtered the Confederates behind the Stone Wall.