Schuetzen Powder Accuracy Test & Velocity

I accuracy shot Schuetzen 2F Powder this morning, and shot over my Chronograph to gather Velocity Data. .54 Cal Patched Roundball, 224 Grain Ball, Powder charge was 80 Grains by WEIGHT. I used a Proven Load for this Short Range accuracy Test (Patch/Ball Combo) that performed excellent yesterday with my Swiss 2F Powder, I simply switched the Powder from Swiss to Schuetzen This morning and Group Shot it.

The Video






3 Shot Group at 60 Yards. Schuetzen shot very well, Just as good as my Swiss Did Yesterday



Schuetzen 2F Velocity was 1,353 Fps. Again, The powder charge was 80 Grains by WEIGHT



GOEX 2F Velocity was 1,461 Fps, Powder charge was also 80 Grains by WEIGHT



Swiss 2F Velocity was 1,624 Fps, Powder Charge was also 80 Grains by WEIGHT

I was quite surprised in the Velocity difference, I didn’t expect there to be that much difference, Swiss is 271 Fps Faster with the Same Weight powder Charge

If I did the
Math correctly,
That's a
17 percent
Increase in
MV.
That is
A lot

Jim in La Luz

In my testing, with my Can of Schuetzen 2F Powder, 80 Grains by VOLUME of Schuetzen is 83 Grains by WEIGHT

Swiss is a powerful powder. Nearly the equal of Triple Seven.

Being a serious target shooter can anyone tell us if there is or not a difference from our old standard 3f Goex to 3f Swiss or 3f Schuetzen. Many are currently looking for an alternative. Thank you
Doc,

Doc said:

Being a serious target shooter can anyone tell us if there is or not a difference from our old standard 3f Goex to 3f Swiss or 3f Schuetzen. Many are currently looking for an alternative. Thank you
Doc,

Click to expand...

Please by volume only.

Doc said:

Being a serious target shooter can anyone tell us if there is or not a difference from our old standard 3f Goex to 3f Swiss or 3f Schuetzen. Many are currently looking for an alternative. Thank you
Doc,

Click to expand...

Short answer, yes.

If you're serious about target shooting, you'll work with weight as well. No way around it for absolute consistency.

I am a serious muzzleloading competitor. I like Swiss. The OPs result tracks with my experience. When working up a load with minies, I have to cut the charge levels with Swiss.

That's interesting, I thought Schuetzen was the same as Wano which we get. But when I measured 90 grains by volume it was 84 grains by weight.

Had to look to find this pic. Gun was an 1862 Colt Contract musket, 2 band length. This is a 5 shot group. Two shots went a bit high. This was as much a rough test of Swiss as it was of the minie bullet in question. I haven't revisited this yet, but with the Goex flap, I think I'll spend some quality time with the lead pot and make a seriously uniform run of 580213s only this time, I'll size to .580 and see exactly what I can wring out of Swiss and this bullet.

My experience with Schuetzen was very similar to Goex, just a different fouling. Swiss is definitely hotter than Goex. Same results in my rifles with 15 to 20 grains less of Swiss as compared to Goex.

Swiss & Olde Enysford are each companies top/premium powders.
Schuetzen & Goex are their respective lower grades.

dave951 said:

Short answer, yes.

If you're serious about target shooting, you'll work with weight as well. No way around it for absolute consistency.

I am a serious muzzleloading competitor. I like Swiss. The OPs result tracks with my experience. When working up a load with minies, I have to cut the charge levels with Swiss.

Click to expand...

Out west we are moving from target to target shooting at an unknown distance. Shooting out of your shooting bag. Weighting a charge is not possible must be done by volume. Usually 30/35 shots. Almost every event is on a undeveloped ranchers trail walk.

Doc said:

Out west we are moving from target to target shooting at an unknown distance. Shooting out of your shooting bag. Weighting a charge is not possible must be done by volume. Usually 30/35 shots. Almost every event is on a undeveloped ranchers trail walk.

Click to expand...

We shoot Civil War arms in competition and always shoot out of our cartridge boxes. We prepare out ammo prior to the match. Load the cartridge box and have a it. Our competition is a balance of speed and accuracy. While I sometimes carry up to 35 rounds, and that only for my Sharps, if we get to 15, something is drastically wrong. The reason I carry that many for the Sharps is that it's a breech loading cartridge gun and is very fast to load and fire even in percussion. I've never run the box dry. In muskets, a top N-SSA team of 8 shooters will clear 32 clay pigeons at 50yds in about 80-90 seconds with about 34 shots. That's less than 5 per man.

dave951 said:

We shoot Civil War arms in competition and always shoot out of our cartridge boxes. We prepare out ammo prior to the match. Load the cartridge box and have a it. Our competition is a balance of speed and accuracy. While I sometimes carry up to 35 rounds, and that only for my Sharps, if we get to 15, something is drastically wrong. The reason I carry that many for the Sharps is that it's a breech loading cartridge gun and is very fast to load and fire even in percussion. I've never run the box dry. In muskets, a top N-SSA team of 8 shooters will clear 32 clay pigeons at 50yds in about 80-90 seconds with about 34 shots. That's less than 5 per man.

Click to expand...

Please understand I’m asking about the difference between 3f Goex and 3f Swiss or Schuetzen using a volume measurement. I’m sure both are very good. But many of us will be making a change over from Goex.
Doc,

Doc said:

Please understand I’m asking about the difference between 3f Goex and 3f Swiss or Schuetzen using a volume measurement. I’m sure both are very good. But many of us will be making a change over from Goex.
Doc,

Click to expand...

And Lewis already had your answer. You'll have to experiment to find that point where a volumetric measure will yield equivalent results. In general, I've found that I use about 10% less Swiss v 3f Goex by volume. You will find that the fouling from Swiss is different and a bit less than 3f Goex.

Doc said:

Out west we are moving from target to target shooting at an unknown distance. Shooting out of your shooting bag. Weighting a charge is not possible must be done by volume. Usually 30/35 shots. Almost every event is on a undeveloped ranchers trail walk.

Click to expand...

Doc said:

Out west we are moving from target to target shooting at an unknown distance. Shooting out of your shooting bag. Weighting a charge is not possible must be done by volume. Usually 30/35 shots. Almost every event is on a undeveloped ranchers trail walk.

Click to expand...

First let me tell you that my experience shooting Schuetzen 3f powder is very limited. I have never seriously tested this powder from the bench , at least not yet. I to shoot woods walks where we are required to load from the bag and horn , so l know where you are coming from. I've only shot this powder offhand at various distance's out to 50 yds. , for a total of 30 shots . Now that's not a serious test , however l saw enough accuracy from the powder
to believe it is equal to Goex in that respect. I had to increase my powder charge by 5 grains to keep
the same POI that l have been getting with 55 gr. Goex 3f to 60 gr. Schuetzen 3f .Goex seems to be a little more powerful. Fouling and clean up was about the same
for me as Goex . lf l have to make the change from Goex to Schuetzen l fill pretty confident that Schuetzen will do what l need
It to do in the accuracy department .

My renegade with 1:66 round ball twist barrel loves swiss 3F. Keep up the good work on YouTube I like watching your videos. You really squeeze every little bit of accuracy and performance that you can with the old front stuffer guns. ✌

52Bore said:

Swiss & Olde Enysford are each companies top/premium powders.
Schuetzen & Goex are their respective lower grades.

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Schuetzen is the American import of WANO powder from Germany. Swiss is a different manufacturer altogether.

GoodRabbitPilgrim said:

That's interesting, I thought Schuetzen was the same as Wano which we get. But when I measured 90 grains by volume it was 84 grains by weight.

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Schuetzen is Wano in Oz