Smoothbore rate of twist?

Gordoncourtney said:

Ha ha nobody hits much at distance with a smooth bore I have tried it .....

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I know several smooth bore shooters, myself included, that could make life very interesting for a person at 200 yards.

Of course nobody has mentioned “paradox “ smoothies. In muzzle loaders. That’s where the 6” before muzzle is rifled. Invented to shoot both shot and bullets in a cartridge gun. Seen a few at Holts London Auction. And discussed in Graeme Wright’s shooting the British double rifle It would make an interesting easy loading flintlock.

However interesting this might’ve be it’s not shooting fairly as our forefathers did, so too controversial for this forum and I apologise for bringing it up. But one has to think outside the box sometimes
Of course theses would be modern MLs would ram the bullet home then screw in a rifled choke

waksupi said:

I know several smooth bore shooters, myself included, that could make life very interesting for a person at 200 yards.

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Ditto

I only had the opportunity to try a 200 yard shot on steel silhouettes once. The relay had ended, I asked permission from the range officer to take a shot before they reset.

The ram went down !

I used to catch fastpitch softball. Knuckballs are very difficult to get right. To get erratic movement there needs to be 0 spin. Any slight spin on the ball will cause it to come straight in and then get smashed out of the infield.

I doubt a ball shot from a gun will have zero spin with all the points in the barrel it is being touched.

I think it is a huge misconception to think a ball bounces from one side of the barrel to the other. It simply does not have time to.
Can it drag on one side more than the other side and then drag someplace different on the following shots? Sure it can.

Another misconception is that patching a ball in a smoothbore is better! Well....for some guns it will be yes but the patch can also influence the ball on exiting the muzzle. Any cloth bearing more on one side than the other of the ball can cause an issue.

Britsmoothy said:

I think it is a huge misconception to think a ball bounces from one side of the barrel to the other. It simply does not have time to.
Can it drag on one side more than the other side and then drag someplace different on the following shots? Sure it can.

Another misconception is that patching a ball in a smoothbore is better! Well....for some guns it will be yes but the patch can also influence the ball on exiting the muzzle. Any cloth bearing more on one side than the other of the ball can cause an issue.

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A bare ball in my Bess will produce a pattern 3 or 4 times bigger than a patched ball. (Patched being a .735 ball and a .010 patch) The bore measures .752 at the muzzle.

if it spins or not - it will likely be negligible.

A great answer to this topic is LEARN TO SHOOT

Britsmoothy said:

I do believe there was once straight rifling, but don't ask for a reference!

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I think it was tried as an attempt to reduce the effects of fouling. This memory just makes the short-term cut off point, I think..

Billy Boy said:

I think it was tried as an attempt to reduce the effects of fouling. This memory just makes the short-term cut off point, I think..

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Possibly but I don't know, I mean, I've never had a fouling issue in my normal smoothbores. Maybe for military arms.

There was "straight rifling" in some European and American made "rifles". I have seen the straight grooves on a couple of original flintlocks, and as mentioned, likely just for fouling control. Modern shotgun barrels have been made with straight grooves in attempt to prevent modern wads and shot columns from spinning, gimmick or not....

I understand this one of the most interesting threads. It comes to mind that many,some, barrels bores are not truly round but oval or triangular , it’s been know to happen drilling holes but not on deep hole drilling for quality guns , perhaps it’s this poor quality that impacts a spin on they lead bore, just a thought it only needs like .006” out of round to spin a ball How accurate were the old cannon.

I was under the impression that rifling was invented to provide some long range predictability to a spherical ball. I would confidently shoot an elk broadside with my Charleyville up to about 60 yards. At longer ranges I would be reaching for the rifled Hawken.

waksupi said:

I know several smooth bore shooters, myself included, that could make life very interesting for a person at 200 yards.

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I think that was the idea of the British infantry square , you got it in one, Well said. terrifying thing to attack Poor old Napolian

Tip Curtis made me a Fussil that has no rate of twist but it does have micro forward rifling that imparts a forward roll to a PRB just like a bowling ball.

Just kidding. It would be really cool if someone like Mythbusters took on this "myth". I'm sure they could figure out what's is happening with high speed cameras etc.

All you need to do is watch slowed down curve balls and knuckle balls thrown by a baseball pitcher to see what's going on. The physics of it is the same as firing a roundball through a smoothbore or a rifled barrel.

If the projectile is complete, weigh it and compare to other balls. It could have a void in it.

Well folks , my humble opinion is the key words " .010 LUBED PATCH " !! When the ball exits the barrel with the "lubed patch " stuck to it , it is then subject to air friction which i think will peel that patch off the ball like tearing the top off a can of Yoplait !! GOT SPIN ?? Yeah , i think so . Again , just my opinion !!

recurvebill said:

Well folks , my humble opinion is the key words " .010 LUBED PATCH " !! When the ball exits the barrel with the "lubed patch " stuck to it , it is then subject to air friction which i think will peel that patch off the ball like tearing the top off a can of Yoplait !! GOT SPIN ?? Yeah , i think so . Again , just my opinion !!

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I can't remember where I saw it - but there was a slo-mo video of a patch peeling off the ball.
The patch shed directly off the tail end of the ball, the "lubed" patch did not stick to the ball.
I'll try and find that again.