Pedersoli Springfield 1861 loads?

Whitacre Barrels still use Progressive depth rifling .

Whitacre's Machine Shop

RjSixgun said:

Whitacre Barrels still use Progressive depth rifling .

Whitacre's Machine Shop

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And Hoyt's barrels and relines as well.

Stantheman86 said:

The only repro that has Progressive Rifling are the Birmingham produced Parker-Hale Enfields.

Italian repros do not use it because it's extra production steps and would cost more.

I'm probably wrong but I recall reading that the 1863 Springfield doesn't have Progressive Rifling because the Ordnance Dept thought the extra steps didn't justify any real improvements.

I assume my original 1861 Springfields have Progressive rifling but again I'm not sure all of them used it. It seems like an Enfield feature.

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Original '63s had progressive rifling.

i recieved my pedersoli about 2 weeks ago and im awaiting a few things to be able to shoot it.My 1861 pin gaged at 578 so ill be shooting .577 minnies.Im waiting on my lubesizer die and SPG Lube and a range rod and then im ready to shoot!

1861 Springfield said:

i recieved my pedersoli about 2 weeks ago and im awaiting a few things to be able to shoot it.My 1861 pin gaged at 578 so ill be shooting .577 minnies.Im waiting on my lubesizer die and SPG Lube and a range rod and then im ready to shoot!

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SPG might not be the best lube. Try plain crisco and start from there.

nah...Im not messing with crisco and all the mess that goes with it to start with. .SPG lube will do just fine and its made for black powder as ive talked to alot of musket shooters who use it and it does great for them .i know people use crisco but Have u sir ever tried SPG yourself or are you just assuming its no good?

1861 Springfield said:

nah...Im not messing with crisco and all the mess that goes with it.SPG lube will do just fine and its made for black powder.ive talked to alot of musket shooters who use it and it does great for them .Have u sir ever tried it yourself?

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Yup and it was found lacking in the accuracy and fouling control department. I shoot competition and SPG lube doesn’t deliver the best possible accuracy nor is it good for fouling control in a progressive depth rifling musket. The key to accuracy is to control variables to minimize my error, and if there are better thing found, then it’s time for something else.

While working up a satisfactory load for instruction, I found a balance point where the gun could be fired till either we ran out of ammo, shoulder, daylight or caps all without wiping nor loss of accuracy. Musket was Zoli Zouave. Load- 46g 3f Schutzen, RWS caps, RCBS Hodgdon minie sized to .001 under bore, LUBE 50/50 beeswax/lard. In one instructional session, we ran that load more than 55 shots straight without wiping. Targets were 3 gongs suspended on chains. Session ended when the 11yo kid I was working with cut 5 chains with 5 shots. Not that anyone was encouraging him or we were running out of light and time or anything........... The guys using SPG were wiping about every 10 shots. So yeah, I know a bit of which I speak.

dont take it so personal pal. im not gonna compete and i dont mind wiping every few shots.The guys i have talked to also compete and say it works just fine.i live in SC and Crisco would be nothing but a aggravating mess in our heat and thats why im not going with that route.SPG is made for black powder fouling.

Crisco+1

I dip my pre-loaded rounds in melted lube made of beeswax & Olive oil. I have no problem with the SC heat.

1861 Springfield said:

dont take it so personal pal. im not gonna compete and i dont mind wiping every few shots.The guys i have talked to also compete and say it works just fine.i live in SC and Crisco would be nothing but a aggravating mess in our heat and thats why im not going with that route.SPG is made for black powder fouling.

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Nothing personal but I'm in NC and well aware of heat issues. SPG works fine in black powder cartridge guns but in every case I've tried it with minies, it was lacking. Beeswax/lard isn't messy at all. I suggest Crisco only as a starting point.

Another clarification on accuracy. Everybody's idea is different. Some folks are happy with 4in at 50yds. I say 4in at 100yds is beginning to getting there. Be careful on who you trust in that regard. Both my Parker Hales shoot 2moa or better. Both are 1st gen Birmingham guns with progressive rifling. NEITHER will shoot to that level with SPG in head to head testing. But it's a starting point for you, have at it.

me starting with crisco would be pointless because like i said im not going to end up using it.Im not gonna fool with it so if SPG is garbage like you say ill try something else. i want to use something that i can put in my lubesizer.Any commercial made lube you could recommend?

Dave951, you know the saying about leading a horse to water right??? most people on this board aren't n-ssa guys like we are, they still think round ball and a ton of powder is the way to go. Minnie balls have some voodoo magic that only we N-ssa members understand. So forget about talking lube.

RjSixgun said:

Dave951, you know the saying about leading a horse to water right??? most people on this board aren't n-ssa guys like we are, they still think round ball and a ton of powder is the way to go. Minnie balls have some voodoo magic that only we N-ssa members understand. So forget about talking lube.

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Not everyone who is new should not be considered an idiot. Do you use only Crisco today for all your minnie ball lube?

1861 Springfield said:

Not everyone who is new should not be considered an idiot. Do you use only Crisco today for all your minnie ball lube?

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Just from the tone of your previous posts it looks like your mind is made up and you want to be argumentative with folks trying to help who have been there already. Again, SPG is fine for cartridge but not so much for minies. Also don't think we haven't experimented a bit with minies in lube/powder combinations. Most PRB shooters have worked out what works for them, but that almost never fully translates to minies.

FWIW, I don't use Crisco for ANY lube formula. It was great before they changed the formula to cut down on blood mud in fried foods but since then, it's just ok for our purposes and other stuff is much better. In head to head testing, Crisco isn't the ticket for best accuracy. If you use a bit of insight while reading my earlier posts you would have already picked up on that.

I'll say this. Ditch the lubrisizer idea for now. Get a plain push through sizer. Dip lube the minie then size. Use a moderate charge of QUALITY black powder and QUALITY caps.

Stantheman86 said:

The only repro that has Progressive Rifling are the Birmingham produced Parker-Hale Enfields.

Italian repros do not use it because it's extra production steps and would cost more.

I'm probably wrong but I recall reading that the 1863 Springfield doesn't have Progressive Rifling because the Ordnance Dept thought the extra steps didn't justify any real improvements.

I assume my original 1861 Springfields have Progressive rifling but again I'm not sure all of them used it. It seems like an Enfield feature.

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From what I’m to understand you are correct, no progressive rifling.

I lube Minies with a candle wax melter and Pyrex dishes. Dip them in and then I use my Push Thru sizer powered by a $30 Harbor Freight die punch press.

I used SPG one time, it did ok. I fired a full cartridge box of 50 .575 Minies through an Armi Sport CS Richmond , no wiping , just one after the other.

Sizing is important, vitally important. I'd much rather give up a little "accuracy "with the bullets being a bit smaller than ideal size than be pounding a stubborn Minie down after 8 shots

Sizing is not only important to accuracy its important because the bullet needs to expand when fired. If you size it as tight as possible the bullet expands a little, but if you use one to small the bullet skirt may expand to much and get ripped off leaving a ring of lead in the barrel.
While I myself have never done this, I have see it done a few times with hard lead and a small minie. A very bad combination! But soft lead and a tight minie will avoid this problem.

I usually live in the .575 zone , although some may do better with .577.

I'll say this. Ditch the lubrisizer idea for now. Get a plain push through sizer. Dip lube the minie then size. Use a moderate charge of QUALITY black powder and QUALITY caps.
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Not sure where the crisco and the lubrisizer came up but doing more research i will fiddle with the patched round ball idea however, I’ve plunged head first and purchased the supplies to start casting.

My supplies will remain nameless on this thread to avoid any more infighting. But, I am going the way of hand sizer and hand operated lube, my production levels will be low.

Awaiting bore diameter any suggestions on mold brand, I’m liking pedersoli’s at the moment.