• This community needs YOUR help today. We rely 100% on Supporting Memberships to fund our efforts. With the ever increasing fees of everything, we need help. We need more Supporting Members, today. Please invest back into this community. I will ship a few decals too in addition to all the account perks you get.



    Sign up here: https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/account/upgrades

1820/1846 stamped Charleville Musket? What do I have?

Muzzleloading Forum

Help Support Muzzleloading Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

BWE Firearms

32 Cal
Joined
Jun 21, 2020
Messages
16
Reaction score
13
Location
Longwood, FL
I have what I think is a Charleville pattern musket. It has two dates on the barrel. An 1820 date above the wood and an 1846 date on the bottom of the barrel. The musket is 56 1/2" long with a 41 1/8" barrel that measures .7375" bore diameter. All the furniture is brass except the buttplate which is iron. The lock is engraved "Neifse" With the two dates being 26 years apart could this have been originally a flintlock that was later converted to percussion. I mostly work on submachine guns up to the 1980s so muzzleloaders are way out of my knowledge base. Any help anyone could be would be greatly appreciated.

IMG_E3421.JPG


IMG_3422 (2).JPG


IMG_3415.JPG


IMG_3410.JPG


IMG_3416.JPG


IMG_3417.JPG


IMG_3423.JPG
 
A Potzdam musket that was converted from flint to percussion. Probably an 1809 which was converted in 1840. The nice feature of yours is that it retains the sights, and sling swivels and the lug for the front one. They are often found without those. They are very common in the US as the Union bought huge quantities to keep them out of the hands of the South and they were issued and used in the war.

They were the standard German (Prussian Army) issue till about 1841 when replaced by the Dreyse needle gun.

Nice find specially as you have the bayonet too. The bayonet is retained by the catch under the barrel which snaps into the notch on the socket. Before you try the bayonet on the gun I recommend you remove the barrel and free up the catch as it's probably frozen in the stock by rust and will make it very difficult to remove the bayonet, at least that's my experience.
 
Last edited:
I have the screw. I just forgot to put it back in for the picture. Thank you for your help

Would it be horrible to convert it back to a flintlock?
 
Your musket is a beauty. And thank you, hawkeye2, for identifying it.

Would it be horrible to convert it back to a flintlock?

It is your gun and you are certainly free to do as you please with it, and I understand the Potzdam muskets are not uncommon. However, at this point, it has been a percussion musket for a lot longer than it was ever a flinter, and the history of these arms as percussion guns has a value of its own. If it were mine, I would enjoy it as it is.

That's just my opinion, though. I would be interested in hearing what some of the collectors in the crowd might have to say.

Best regards,

Notchy Bob
 
As common as they are it probably wouldn't be much of a blow to the collector's market to convert one back to flint. Skirmishers don't hesitate to replace missing items and shoot them and even reline the barrels. At one time there were probably of tons of the flint parts removed from these guns in Belgium but they are likely all gone now. I don't know of any reproduction parts unless you robbed them from an Indian gun and I don't think I would restore one without original parts.
 
I would except it as it is for what it is rather than put it back. I am of the "Lord save the drum & nipple" Nobody else will " School of thought .We can use up floating parts puts them into context no loss but to deliberately alter a fine original is against preservation .Anything else is fakery..
Regards Rudyard
 
As Hawkeye2 said the later date refers to its percussion conversion . I have one similar ( also a Potzdam) but it has been converted with a screw in Nock type breech with integral rear, bolster and rear sight and there is a cleanup screw in the cone bolster. I did obtain a new cone for mine from Lodgewood, as they are an odd type thread. Mine came with a metric cone fitted and only after shooting and cleaning the musket I realised the thread was burred over and not right. They shoot well with a paper cartridge. I note your musket conversion differs from mine in that they have just replaced the breech plug and brazed on a cone bolster. I suspect the screw in the posters of both of ours was to facilitate drilling the vent through to the breach and is not intended for removal during cleaning, much the same as the Parker Hale Volunteer .451s, you don't remove them. I would leave it as percussion as it is part of the guns story, and it is a nice conversion.
 
Back
Top