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Swiss Powder vrs Goex

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I'm getting close to that time that I will be placing a 25 lb powder order. I always used Goex and I have no complaints with it's performance. Am I missing out on something really great by never trying Swiss Powder? Is there a real advantage to paying the extra money for Swiss? The shoots that I have attended, Goex seemed to be the powder of choice. If I could run down to my local dealer and pick up a pound of Swiss, I would, but not many shops carry swiss.
 
Swiss burns cleaner and has more "power" than Goex. In BP cartridges, that can be helpful. For Muzzleloading I haven't seen a great difference.
 
Swiss burns cleaner and has more "power" than Goex. In BP cartridges, that can be helpful. For Muzzleloading I haven't seen a great difference.
I have. As much as 6 inches difference in drop at 100 yards in a .54 Hawken with the same charge. When the weather clears and I can get to the range I will attempt to document this difference. I'll use Goex in the fowler. But in rifles the Swiss shoots much flatter for me.
 
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I switched to Swiss from Old Eynsford (Goex product). To get the same performance, I had to lower the charge about 10% so I'm using less powder. Cost per shot is about a wash. Since I'm a competitive shooter, that's not really much of a factor. What matters most to me is fouling control when firing fast shot strings with a 58cal musket and minie balls. That's where Swiss really shines.
 
Yes, you have to use more Goex to get the same velocity as with Swiss. And Swiss produces less fowling. And Swiss is produced with charcoal made from alderwood gathered by gypsies. These are all good things.
 
Wish I can could find an American powder that performs as well as Swiss, but I have not. Have tried a lot of different powders, and while some perform in individual guns as well as Swiss, can’t seem to find any that perform better.

For giggles and kicks, check out the powder that is used by the top shooters in the long distance matches. It’s not Goex. These are folks that accuracy performance is top priority.

And if cost is an issue, do not understand the thinking. We spare no expense on our guns and equipment, and then some complain about paying a premium of a few cents per round on powder. Just my opinion.
 
Wish I can could find an American powder that performs as well as Swiss, but I have not. Have tried a lot of different powders, and while some perform in individual guns as well as Swiss, can’t seem to find any that perform better.

For giggles and kicks, check out the powder that is used by the top shooters in the long distance matches. It’s not Goex. These are folks that accuracy performance is top priority.

And if cost is an issue, do not understand the thinking. We spare no expense on our guns and equipment, and then some complain about paying a premium of a few cents per round on powder. Just my opinion.

Have you tried Olde Eynsford by Goex? It was made to compete with Swiss. It certainly gives a very similar performance. The cost is less than $2 more per pound vs standard Goex at Grafs. Some feel it is not quite as good as Swiss but I’ve not heard of one want any of the other powders instead.
 
Have you tried Olde Eynsford by Goex? It was made to compete with Swiss. It certainly gives a very similar performance. The cost is less than $2 more per pound vs standard Goex at Grafs. Some feel it is not quite as good as Swiss but I’ve not heard of one want any of the other powders instead.
Tried OE a while back. In my fast twist (1-30) 45 caliber set up for paper patch conicals it was 8” or so lower at 300 yards with a bigger group that I get with Swiss. Although with only a few dozen shots or so it was wasn’t exactly a detailed evaluation, but the half pound of OE was free, so I tried it. If I recall correctly, had to go from 80 grains of Swiss to over 90 grains of OE to get close to the same point of impact, but lager group made it challenging to be sure. Didn’t try any of the OE with roundballs, but with about 15 pounds of Swiss fff from last PowderInc order I not in any hurry to mess with something that’s working.
 
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Tried OE a while back. In my fast twist (1-30) 45 caliber set up for paper patch conicals it was 8” or so lower at 300 yards with a bigger group that I get with Swiss. Although with only a few dozen shots or so it was wasn’t exactly a detailed evaluation, but the half pound of OE was free, so I tried it. If I recall correctly, had to go from 80 grains of Swiss to over 90 grains of OE to get close to the same point of impact, but lager group made it challenging to be sure. Didn’t try any of the OE with roundballs, but with about 15 pounds of Swiss fff from last PowderInc order I not in any hurry to mess with something that’s working.


There’s another fellow on here who basically says what you do (3F?), but that 1 1/2 or maybe it was 2F was very good, but no so with the 3F.
 
I like Old Eynsford 2F at least as well as Swiss 2F in my Chunk and Table rifles. I haven’t had as good luck with 3f in either Old Eynsford or Swiss in my target rifles. The 2f just seems to be more consistent even though it produces slightly more fouling for the same performance.
Better hurry and order....The price has really gone up lately.
 
There’s another fellow on here who basically says what you do (3F?), but that 1 1/2 or maybe it was 2F was very good, but no so with the 3F.
After a year of struggling with Goex 2F and 3F trying to reproduce the accuracy I once enjoyed using Goex Cartridge grade in a .45 lever gun, I finally discovered that Swiss 1 1/2 F provides comparable results.
 
I’d try the Olde Eynsford and Swiss both. I’m not sure I would reduce powder charges to begin. The rifle that can take 100 grains of GOEX can take the same charge of OE or Swiss.
 
There’s another fellow on here who basically says what you do (3F?), but that 1 1/2 or maybe it was 2F was very good, but no so with the 3F.
I have only tried the OE fff, and only shot about a 1/2 pound of it total. Can only speak to what I observed, and can best summarize by stating that the OE fff was not, at least in my rifle, a straight grain for grain (by volume) substitute for Swiss fff, a proven and accurate load in my gun from 80 to 90 grains with the 400 grain bullet I use. The OE as I remember did have a much larger velocity standard deviation on the few shots I put over a chronograph (no, I do not have the data). Would imagine that with some load development it should be able to be made to work, but is something I was not interested in doing then or now.
 
Swiss 2F might be the best powder ever made as far as being consistent. It does have a slightly harder "fouling ring" than Goex imo.

Swiss 3F has an unbelievably tough fouling ring. If you don't mind wiping between shots it's okay, but I can't get more than 4-5 shots with it without wiping.

With Goex- especially Old Enynsford I can easily load 60 plus shots without wiping.

I don't see Swiss being worth it personally, unless you want 2F for strict target work.

I can't detect any accuracy difference between Swiss or O. Eynsford.

In my .45 using 65gr. of 3f Swiss gave 17fps (15' from muzzle) more velocity than O. Eynsford using10 shot strings.

I don't see 17fps as being significant, especially for the price difference of roughly 1/3 more, but the super hard fouling ring is what really turned me off to Swiss 3F
 
Swiss 2F might be the best powder ever made as far as being consistent. It does have a slightly harder "fouling ring" than Goex imo.

Swiss 3F has an unbelievably tough fouling ring. If you don't mind wiping between shots it's okay, but I can't get more than 4-5 shots with it without wiping.

With Goex- especially Old Enynsford I can easily load 60 plus shots without wiping.

I don't see Swiss being worth it personally, unless you want 2F for strict target work.

I can't detect any accuracy difference between Swiss or O. Eynsford.

In my .45 using 65gr. of 3f Swiss gave 17fps (15' from muzzle) more velocity than O. Eynsford using10 shot strings.

I don't see 17fps as being significant, especially for the price difference of roughly 1/3 more, but the super hard fouling ring is what really turned me off to Swiss 3F


Granted these are another fellows results from 8” barreled NMAs using a 30 grn volume, but Swiss gave an average of 920 FPS with a standard deviation of 11.3 FPS whereas OE gave an average of 906 FPS and 14.4 deviation. There’s not been much more side by side equal comparisons I’ve seen available.
 
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