Goex vs Schuetzen

I'm sure this has been addressed before but I would like to know about folk actual use of them and the difference.
I'm also starting a list of mine and wondering if others in the area would like to jump in on a bulk buy on REAL black powder for Missourians. I'll be dealing with PVI or Buffalo Arms.

I've used both and have found them to be the same energy wise. If I work up a load using a specific amount of Goex, I can use the same amount of Schuetzen and it will shoot the same groups and hit the same POI. If any difference exists and it's not just in my mind, the Schuetzen seems to have slightly less fouling than the Goex.

If your’re close to I70, you can just drive to Graf and Sons store front and buy all the powder you need. Great folks to deal with.

manure, I forgot about that. I use to live in Mexico.

Unfortunately for me, my local price for any black powder is around $25-$27 per pound. So I buy from Graf & Sons, and I buya bunch of Graf's brand powder (made by Wano) and I buy a container or two or three of GOEX standard. I'm not worried about the slight difference in fouling when shooting live ball, and when it comes to blanks I shoot the cheapest I have on hand at the time. None of the current brands out there were as nasty fouling as Elephant or Diamondback were....

Why do I spend a little more to get a few pounds of GOEX along with the bulk order of Graf's..???...it's made in America and I don't want some political puke to wipe out my shooting by passing some ban on imported powder(s)...and if GOEX goes out of business for lack of sales,

LD

Loyalist Dave said:

Unfortunately for me, my local price for any black powder is around $25-$27 per pound. So I buy from Graf & Sons, and I buya bunch of Graf's brand powder (made by Wano) and I buy a container or two or three of GOEX standard. I'm not worried about the slight difference in fouling when shooting live ball, and when it comes to blanks I shoot the cheapest I have on hand at the time. None of the current brands out there were as nasty fouling as Elephant or Diamondback were....

Why do I spend a little more to get a few pounds of GOEX along with the bulk order of Graf's..???...it's made in America and I don't want some political puke to wipe out my shooting by passing some ban on imported powder(s)...and if GOEX goes out of business for lack of sales,

LD

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Though I intend on trying Swiss powder one day, I buy Goex Olde E or Hodgdon’s Triple 7, both American powders. I like supporting local and ensuring we have homemade stuff that’s good for my needs.

I was afraid to try Grafs powder at first. Thought it would be like store brand coffee.
For general backyard shooting it has been fine. But, same as LD, I still throw in a few Goex to round out the powder keg up here.

I think Wano makes Schuetzen and Grafs. Goex has had a checkered past as far as consistency is concerned. HOWEVER, I believe those issues are in the past.

I have used and chronographed graf, goex and Scheutzen. Same day same gun same load. The differences were insignificant.

I have used both and can find no difference in performance.

They all kill the paper targets I aim at.

Yet to try Graf's but have had fine results with Goex products.

I buy schuetzen because of the price, i do buy some Goex 1F as well, 20 pounds schuetzen 5 pounds Goex

Being a competition shooter, I'm all about accuracy in my muzzleloaders. That said, standard Goex and Schutzen are about the same as far as accuracy and fouling go. In doing load development, I worked with both and also Old E and Swiss. There is a marked difference in accuracy between Goex/Schutzen and Old E/Swiss and there is a difference in fouling. Group sizes from my 1862 Colt Contract musket with Goex/Schutzen were about 2in at 50yds. Switch to Old E and the groups shrank to under 2in. I've since moved to Swiss and they're tighter still, think one big ragged hole. No other changes in the load.

I read on another forum dedicated to BPCR, where the OP examined all those grades of powders and used sieves to check individual grain size and the amount of "dust" in each. As you go down in cost/lb of powder, the variation of grain size gets larger and the amount of dust, higher. Go up in price and the powder starts to become much more uniform. He also checked mv for each. The lower cost powders all yielded wider variation. Swiss was hands down the most consistent in the test gun with a variation of under 10fps and Old E was right behind it.

So after reading all that, if you're just plinking, Goex/Schutzen are fine. Want accuracy for match purposes, only Old E or Swiss.

Thank you Dave, that's just what I wanted to know.

I currently am using Old Eynsford almost exclusively. Have a couple of pounds Goex left that I dip into once in a while, but when I purchased my last case, the price difference between GO and OE was just around 30 cents a pound, so I went with it. Frankly, I am not anywhere near a good enough shot to be able to tell the difference with a more expensive powder like Swiss. I also will admit that I also have a pound of (gasp, choke) Elephant to burn.

"A man was sprinkling powder on his front yard."Whats the powder for?" asked his neighbor. "To keep the elephants off the grass," replied the first man. "But we don't have elephants around here!" "I know. Great stuff isn't it?""

Just had to do it.

hanshi said:

Yet to try Graf's but have had fine results with Goex products.

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Grafs is now made by Goex.

Blogman said:

"A man was sprinkling powder on his front yard."Whats the powder for?" asked his neighbor. "To keep the elephants off the grass," replied the first man. "But we don't have elephants around here!" "I know. Great stuff isn't it?""

Just had to do it.

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LOL. So far, I have resisted the impulse to sprinkle my Elephant on the grass. Might kill the crabgrass though.

AlanG said:

Grafs is now made by Goex

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Looking at the website it appears those grades of powder (1F and 2F etc.) with a blue label are Goex, and those with a green label (3F) are still made by Wano/Schutzen.

Good to know, thanks