Veteran Arms opinions

What do you think of the guns made by Veteran Arms are they good. The prices seem good just curious about people’s experience with them. http://veteranarms.com/ReproductionMuzzleloadersandFlintlocks/Muskets.html

Be sure to read all the FAQs on their site. The FAQs tell you where they are made and what they do to prepare these guns for delivery.

Veteran Arms FAQs

I have not handled one of their products.

Veterans Arms is a good company to deal with. As far as the guns, you get what you pay for.

I bought a French Infantry musket and was pleased with the gun for the most part. the lock worked very well and the gun shot as good as any smoothbore I ever shot. I test shot it by tying it to a tire and loading a tripple powder load and a double load of shot. Barrel measured the same and no damage any where.

If you are planning on doing a lot of shooting, you may want to save your money for a good quality flinter. If all you want is a wall hanger or an occasional shooter with light loads, the guns they sell will work.

"If all you want is a wall hanger or an occasional shooter with light loads, the guns they sell will work."

Ditto, except for the part about "...will work."

I have worked for months to get a $700 Baker replica lock to function, including having to fabricate a sear spring to replace the pot metal junk that broke soon after I got the gun (had to replace it with a small coil spring and J-B Weld). The lock was made in India with a hammer and a wood rasp, apparently, given its (in) tolerances and failure of the sear to engage the firing notch consistently. Asked for help and got no reply. Never did figure out what to do about the tight spot in the barrel about 6" down from the muzzle, very noticeable when loading a ball with a patch for the first time - fired the gun after loading this by using a long cord in case the constriction caused a problem. Never shot it again after that first time. Still can't get the lock to function and hold the dog back at full cock consistently.

Made in India...;no thanks!

SM

Indian Muskets.....you roll the dice , just like with Italian stuff but , with the Indian made guns you never know what you're gonna get.

That said I tried an Indian Made P53 Enfield from Middlesex Trading and its actually a really decent musket. I have a video of me shooting a live ball through it to prove I did it and survived . all joking aside it's accurate and solid for what it is. It does well with .530 balls in paper cartridges.

None of the Indian stuff is rifled so you're basically getting a shotgun, or you can shoot round ball in it.

Oddly all of the Veteran Arms .69 muskets are ".68". I emailed him, they are really .68. I don't know why, all of the other sellers list them as .69.

Most of the bore sizes are nominal so they are listed , for example as ".60-.62" like Veteran Arms' Lorenz musket.

Honestly I would stay away from anything Flintlock in the Indian muskets, a percussion is far less reliant on lock quality and timing....... as long as it pops the cap.

I have ordered a Northwest trade gun from Millitary Heritage and have no complaints. I don't mind it not being drilled for a flash hole I can do it and know it is drilled in the correct place. I trimmed down the stock and refinished it and also browned the steel. It weights less then my pedersoli tradegun. Shoots great. People complain that they cannot contact them by phone they are in the office early in the AM. then they go to the shipping Dept. I had to call at 6:00am NewMexico time and had no problem talking to them. My veteran arms FDC I had to do alot of lock tunning. The bore has a lot of tight spots in it, like a wash board. I like my Millitary Heritage trade gun alot better.

Pedersoli is my go-to for range guns or field guns , they're nice , and well made, but not irreplaceable custom gems I had to wait 4 years for that are worth more than my car.

Indian muskets , I don't know, they're tempting but I have so far resisted getting any more. The .62 Lorenz looks neat and also that .75 Tower Musket, just because no one makes one, but they really don't offer me anything over what I already have.

One word aka JUNK!

Not a quality product.

I have no reason to feel one way or the other , but it's worth noting that all the "failures " with Indian muskets are from Reenactors. Italian muskets have failed to. In short, some reenactors don't properly clean muskets and a cement like build up in the breech area eventually creates a choke point, blowing the barrel. An original musket will do the same.

If someone can post a link to an injury from an Indian musket failing under live fire it would be informative .

That said, I feel they're too expensive for what they are. $500 for a P53, some of the big flinters are almost $700???

If you want a low priced front stuffer you can find good, used T/C Renegades for $250, or a Zoli Zouave .

Or just pay a few hundred more for an Italian.

If something like an 1842 Springfield repro , that was safe and shootable, made in India and priced at $300 then you're gonna have a good entry level option. $650-700? No thanks , I'll just put that money down on a deposit for something cool like an 8 Bore October Country rifle.

Places like Loyalist and Veteran Arms test fire the pieces , I don't know if they're "proofed" or they just pop off a round ball with a 60 gr charge and call it good. Middlesex Village charges a pretty heavy fee for "Proofing" but he does offer it.

"I have no reason to feel one way or the other , but it's worth noting that all the "failures " with Indian muskets are from Reenactors."

I never got to the stage of "failure" with mine, because the lock NEVER worked consistently, either not engaging the firing sear, or when it did, catching on the half-cock notch upon trigger pull. Fired one shot (with a cord on the trigger, as stated above) because I never trusted either the barrel diameter variation I found, or the reliability of the lock ( this after repeated disassembly and filing).

"AKA junk." Succinctly and accurately analyzed, Sun City -

Stantheman86 said:

I don't know why, all of the other sellers list them as .69.

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Well there is the myth that all of the guns from India come from the same back alley shop in the same town and were never made to be fired, made by the same half dozen guys, and made with unmarked barrels. ALL of Which I've found isn't true. I've had great success with Loyalist Arms LLP Besses, Artillery Carbines, and Tradeguns. Shoot them live all the time. No worries. Haven't seen many of the Veteran Arms guns. Seen a lot of the MVTC guns, and with them the caveate is to hand pick yours from the seller at a show.

LD

Loyalist Dave said:

Well there is the myth that all of the guns from India come from the same back alley shop in the same town and were never made to be fired, made by the same half dozen guys, and made with unmarked barrels. ALL of Which I've found isn't true. I've had great success with Loyalist Arms LLP Besses, Artillery Carbines, and Tradeguns. Shoot them live all the time. No worries. Haven't seen many of the Veteran Arms guns. Seen a lot of the MVTC guns, and with them the caveate is to hand pick yours from the seller at a show.

LD

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Loyalist Arms does make a nice product. My only real issue with them is the stocks are not walnut, even if they used Maple I’d probably be more inclined. I had a second hand bess Indian made from discriminating general which was so poorly made I ended up almost giving away.

Not all failures have been from reenactors. There was a pistol that had been fired with wad and ball that cracked at the rear of the barrel where the breechplug screws in. This was posted by the owner on one of the muzzleloading forums several years ago, may have been this forum. The gun's owner was a regular poster and an experienced shooter.

FlinterNick Niether Walnut or maple are available in India . Stocking was allways a problem in the sub continent some walnut was sent out for the East India Company's needs and other local wood tried . But what they generally use isn't ideal and is 'musket cut' that is as it comes without seeking the ideal grain flow to best suit no different to most muskets it that regard . While many snear at India's products my own re enactment musket was got up from three different broken or defective rejects but after I worked on it & even posted to the US in two pieces later to repair the wrist but it served me admirably and stood proof so I was quite happy with it . VERY few replica muskets are correct when machine made .But most cant see the difference . I was once asked to look at a musket some re enactment buff workman found at a house he" Wanted to cut it down for a Musketoon" he said . Well the Musket was a near mint India Pattern original with its original Bayonet . He didn't know from the proverbial Shineola and it well illustrates what I say . I don't believe he got it . Rudyard

Well, I don't think Indian muzzle loaders are proved...not way they can be without a touch hole. And I'm not totally sure they're not cottage-industry guns. I've heard good (a few) and bad (more) reviews on them. Italian guns are at least proved.

Just for fun here's me shooting my Middlesex Village P53.

It looks only vaguely similar to a P53, I compared it side by side with my original P53, not even close but it shoots well. I put about 50 rounds through it.

.530 round balls in paper cartridges , fun range popper with 80 gr of 2f. Very accurate for what it is . I felt no need to keep it "HC" so I put a leather FAL cheek pad on it to get a better sight picture. It's actually a lot of fun to shoot. I may use it in a Turkey shoot.

I had to satisfy my Indian musket curiosity and I have. I don't think I'll get any more of them.

Loyalist Arms was attempting to have a .65 3-band P59 made for me but the Indian manufacturer didn't want to do it.

The little .65 carbine looks neat but the shipping from Canada is like $100, and the total $$ for the gun was just too prohibitive vs. just buying a new toy from somewhere else. I mean there's only but so much you can do with a .58 or .65 smoothbore, I don't need a pile of them when I now have 3 Pedersoli .69's.

Gene L said:

Well, I don't think Indian muzzle loaders are proved...not way they can be without a touch hole. And I'm not totally sure they're not cottage-industry guns. I've heard good (a few) and bad (more) reviews on them. Italian guns are at least proved.

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Can you tell me how guns in the US are proofed, any muzzleloader made here?